Building a Hybrid Muzzleloader

[LAGS]

A Hybrid Muzzleloader is what I am going to call this new rifle.
I am building this rifle to use both Percussion as well as Flintlock.
I am building the rifle so all I have to do is switch out the lock and nipple drum.
I think this is going to be a fun rifle to shoot.
It will allow you to say , shoot in percussion competition.
Then switch out the lock and then shoot the same rifle in a flintlock competition.
That might be a good option for hunting also.
I hear many hunters that either prefer one or the other ignition systems depending on the game or weather conditions.
I am going to start this post and have a good friend post pictures of my work.
I want to show you guys how I do it more than just show you the finished rifle.
This rifle is being built out of mostly extra Used Parts.
Some of these parts might have been considered trash.
So building this custom rifle will save lots of parts from the scrap pile and make a very nice and Unique rifle.
This post may take some time.
And I would love to hear your opinions or Suggestions on what and how I am building it.
I too hope it inspires some of you to build something that you can use , especially if you too have some guns you don't use.

[Sasquatch-1]

Sounds like a fun project. Wish I had the patience for something like that.

[LAGS]

It may be a few days before I can get some pictures posted.
But let me start off by telling you how this project started.
I bought a .50 cal Thompson Center " Renegade " barrel on line for a reasonable price.
The seller explained that the bore was rusted and he had bought himself a Green Mountain barrel already.
I had a used spare Renegade stock.
So I figured that I would just send the barrel to Bobby Hoyt and have it Re Bored to a larger caliber.
When I got the barrel.
I found out why it was Rusted.
It was loaded with a load of Pyrodex and a patched ball that was stuck down the bore for several years.
So I tried to pull the breech plug.
It was so rusted in place from that Pyrodex that it stripped the thread out on both the barrel , and the breech plug.
I could not find another TC breech plug to cut the barrel down and re-tap it to fit a new breech plug.
So , I cut off about an inch of the rear of the barrel and tapped it for 3/4-16 to fit a solid tang flintlock style breech plug that I had.
Then I sent it to Hoyt and had it bored to .54 cal with the standard 1:48 twist.
But with Deep round bottom rifling.
Now,
This barrel and tang would not fit the Renegade stock that I had.
So I ordered a Hawken Maple Half Stock that was only inletted for the 1" barrel and a 3/8" ramrod .hole.
When I got the stock,
I inletted the stock to fit that non hook tang breech plug.
Then I decided to install a nipple drum on the barrel and modify a TC percussion lock to work with a nipple drum rather than a pattent style breech plug that comes on TC's.
That is when I thought.
I can set this up for a TC flintlock and replace the nipple drum with a vent hole liner that was the same thread.
So I finally found a TC flintlock that was in good shape.
The TC Percussion lock that I had modified was a lock that I bought on a used Renegade that the lock was rusted.
So modifying it and being able to reuse it was a good move.
The TC flintlock lock and that TC percussion lock were almost the same size and shape.
So now I am reshaping then that minor amount.so they both fit into the same inletting and line up with the hole in the barrel for that drum or flash hole liner.

[LAGS]

There is one thing that may be a lot simpler and cheaper if you want to build a similar "Hybrid".
If you have a Thompson Center Flintlock Renegade or Hawken rifle.
That would be easier to prep for a nipple drum and modify a percussion lock to work.
When I was looking for the new TC percussion breech plug I could have ordered a TC flintlock breech plug as an option to use with a nipple drum installed with a percussion lock.
That would make that barrel and breech plug fit the factory hooked breech plug tang, and fit the factory stock.
But.
Those were out of stock and couldn't be found at the time either.
But rebuilding this style " Hybrid" is not confined to the project methods that I am doing.
Other models of BP rifles might be able to modify like CVA flintlock rifles.
Or even other rifles that you can buy a LR replacement lock that the flintlock and percussion locks match up .

[longbow]

I will be following this one!

I had a similar thought but have not acted... at least yet. I have wanted a Northwest Trade Musket for some time now but not scratched the itch. One reason is that real BP is hard to get locally and a flintlock needs real BP at least in the pan. So, I thought that maybe I could convert the gun to percussion which must have been done to some trade muskets anyway. Then I could use real BP or subs depending on what is available.

Then I start thinking "Why not have both?" and why not, just as you are doing? Along with that is the desire for a rifled barrel which TOTW used to offer for their NWT musket kit... which they no longer seem to assemble but do seem to have all the parts.

So, My wish would be to buy one gun and two barrels, one rifled and one smooth plus both flintlock original and percussion conversion.

Having said that I have read (on TOTW IIRC) that they cannot be converted to percussion. I have to think they can but I guess depending on lock geometry possibly the flintlock lock plate and percussion lock plate might not sit in the same location? That assumes there is a percussion lock plate that will fit which may be incorrect. If that is the case then I'd have to make a lock plate and reassemble the bits on it which may be a bit much.

In your case I suspect that TC flint and percussion lock plates are the same set up and internals with just the pan and hammer different so that may be easy to have both locks fit if that is the case.

Regardless, I will be watching for pics and developments! Sounds like a fun project.

Longbow

[LAGS]

This project is actually a lot of fun so far.
And it seems like something I can play with again like I said with TC flintlocks since I have plenty of extra TC percussion locks just laying around and I find lots of TC stocks very often.
So they would be easy to build with a TC flintlock set up barrel , or like I said , swap out a percussion breech plug for TC's version of a flintlock breech plug.

[LAGS]

One option that I have that I may look into is,
I have a Pedersolli " Cub " .32 Flintlock Rifle "Kit " that I haven't built yet.
I think I may look into ordering a Percussion lock for that model rifle , and see if it too can replace the Flintlock lock like I am doing with this TC.
I also have a Flintlock Blunderbuss that has a L&R Queen Anne lock.
I need to see if the Percussion Queen Anne lock will fit that rifle and turn it into a Hybrid also.
Turning a flint lock gun into a percussion gun seems easier than trying to turn a percussion into a flintlock gun.
But possibly the rifles that come out of the factory with a nipple drum instead of a pattent style breech plug may also be a better option for turning a percussion into a flintlock or making a Hybrid.
I see lots of CVS's and Traditions that have nipple drums.
Something to look into.
Now I just looked into my shop.
I also have a Traditions Percussion Kentucky Rifle Kit that I haven't built yet.
It has a nipple drum on the barrel.
That may be the first one for me to look for a flintlock lock to fit that model.
They are still made and probably very available.

[armoredman]

This has potential to be VERY interesting!

Remember, this is the guy that built the Muzzle Loading Hip Howitzer from junk into a fine and fun pistol.

[armoredman]

And here we go...

1.


2.


3.


4.


5.


6.

[LAGS]

Thank you Armoredman.
I like you posting the pictures for me.


Well Guys , here you go.
Pictures 1 & 2 show the barrel that I am using and the old TC breech plug that the threads are stripped.
The pictures show the style Flintlock breechplug that I fitted to that barrel after I cut off the damaged thread and re tapped it for that breech plug.
Picture 3 showed the two locks that I am using.
Both are made by TC.
But the percussion lock , you can see where I ground in a recess to be able to get that lock to fit a barrel with a nipple drum.
Picture 4 showed the TC barrel in the stock after I fit the barrel for a nipple drum.
The rifle behind it in that picture is a custom TC that I am building also that has the TC pattent style breech plug so you can compare the different looks of the two.
Pictures 5 & 6 show the Hybrid rifle with the nipple drum removed and a flash hole liner installed to work with that flintlock lock.
It is very easy to switch the locks from one to the other.
It can be done in the field or at the range with just a small wrench and a screwdriver in just a couple minutes.

[longbow]

That's pretty slick! I like it!

Longbow

[LAGS]

I think things like this style rifle can be an advantage to ML shooters that only can afford one rifle at a time.
Say , you have say Traditions Hawken rifle that is a percussion lock.
But you want to have a Flintlock rifle too.
But you can't afford it or don't have a place to store a second rifle.
If you buy another lock and the misc parts to do the conversion you might be able to afford to have a Hybrid.
The replacement Lock ( especially a used one that fits ) will be so much cheaper than the cost of a new or maybe even used rifle.

[Baltimoreed]

Nice build, very clever idea. My last builds eons ago were underhammers.

[725]

Lookin' good, LAGS. Fun project, for sure. Keep those pics coming. Very enjoyable to see you at work.

[LAGS]

Thank you 725.
That is a nice comment from one of the few people out there that have actually seen the work that I do.
Hay.
I just remembered that pistol I built for you , had a barrel with a nipple drum , and a new percussion lock that you might be able to find a Flintlock lock that could fit and possibly turn it into a Hybrid also.
Always worth a thought.

[charlie b]

Thanks for this and nice work, as usual.

Interesting that it is something I considered a while ago, and even now, when cap supplies dwindled. You could still shoot your rifle with a flint even when caps are not in your stockpile.

[LAGS]

Thank you Charlie b.
Funny thing is.
This whole project started because I had a barrel that most of you guys would think it was total junk.
But the Hybrid idea has had many options for use like you said.
I hope my projects inspire others into doing their own projects.

[LAGS]

I came up with an idea for a tool to change the locks from one to the other with out a bunch of tools.
The nipple drum uses a 3/8" wrench.
The flash hole liner uses a screw driver.
I am thinking about making a combination wrench out of a 1/4" thick piece of steel.
On one end I will have a slot like an open end wrench that is 3/8" wide for the nipple drum.
The other end of the steel strap will be ground to a taper and shaped into a screwdriver point to fit both the flash hole liner and the lock retaining screw.
Somewhere along the length of the shaft.
I will cut in a notch that fits the nipple to use as a nipple wrench.
I will also on the shaft , mount a piece of piano wire on a screw so it can swing out to the side and be used for a nipple and flash hole pick to clean either out if the for some reason get fouled up.
Once I get the combo wrench designed or built , I will post a picture.

Another thought.
I could make this wrench out of an old worn out or broken file that I have.
That steel will be harder , and the handle end will already be halfway shaped to be the screwdriver end.

[armoredman]

Wouldn't it be the bee's knees if the stock had a special spot built into it for that special one-of-a-kind tool?

[LAGS]

Hmm.
My options for storage spots would be a long wood patch box like the Kibler has.
Or put on some kind of military style butt plate that has that hole in it for the cleaning kit storage.
Like a Garand or SKS uses.
Or just build one of those little trap doors into a Hawken style butt plate.
Many many options..
Kind of like making a spot in the bottom of a semi auto gunstock where you put a spare magazine.
That worked on a rifle I built before.