An Alternative to the 30 Badger / 30 Reece

[Jedman]

You might be surprised at what the accuracy might be. A late friend of mine built an insert barrel- chamber adapter from a 30-06 take off barrel. He shortened the chamber of the 30-06 to about 1.6”and made a wildcat round for it using 445 super magnum brass sized in a shortened 30-06 sizing die and just for a project ground the OD of the barrel with a cheap Harbor freight belt sander turned by hand until he could get it to fit in a 20 ga. Pardner SS shotgun. He did not use any O rings or glue to hold the adapter in he just figured the chamber end was bigger than the bore so where could it go ?
The shotgun barrel did have a scope base mounted on it and he had a 4 x scope to help with sighting it.

The funny thing was he wasn’t able to keep the barrel very round grinding it on a belt sander and he finally hammered it into the shotgun barrel and decided to shoot it like that. So what he had was an old junk 30-06 barrel with a cut down chamber, I did cut a rim recess for the rimmed brass on my lathe so the cartridge would chamber. The cartridge was shaped just like a short 30-06 with a rim formed on 445 SM brass and shooting 150 gr. jacketed bullets and to our surprise he was able to shoot several 1” 3 shot groups with it at 100 yards. It was really a project just to see if he could do it without a lathe and it did shoot well. There were noticeable gaps in the fit of the adapter to the shotguns bore but it was kinda beat in the final 1/16 th of an inch and was snug to where there wasn’t any movement.

As far as the 7.62 x 25 cartridge , I looked it up and it can be loaded as high as 36000 psi so I do believe you will need a small diameter firing pin on a break action gun or else the primer will flow back into the firing pin hole and cause the gun to be hard to break open after fired. Being a rimless case on the Tok I hope it not a PITA to extract the fired cases. Hope it’s a fun and accurate plinker for you.

Last fall about this time I seen Turkish made SS break action shotguns at a Dunhams sporting goods store near me that were on sale for $ 100. They had black synthetic stocks and matte finish on the metal but seemed to be well made . These were not the folding style shotguns which I see quite a few of online , I didn’t notice if they were hammerless or had a cocking hammer and don’t remember about the firing pin size ? I would have probably bought one for a rifle conversion project but I have 2 H&R ‘s and a Iver Johnson that I can use for such things already. I am always on the watch for good older break action shotguns a good prices and I know that they are hard to find without paying an arm and leg for but there are still some around .
Jedman

[jdgabbard]

UPDATE

I have been working on putting this project together over the last week or so. I picked up an H&R Topper 88 in 20ga with a 3” chamber and 26” full choke barrel, this particular gun is a 1982 AY serial number.

I loaded up some converted .223 brass with my custom 90gr RNFP boolit I had cut by Mountain Molds about 15yrs or so ago with 4.0gr of Unique and put a decent crimp. I also grabbed a box of some Tok brass I had loaded with the same boolit, but with 4.5gr of Red Dot. And it was off to the range this morning.

Initial observation was that this shoots centered, but high. The shotgun only has a bead sight, so I’m limited with my accuracy. But at 25yds in the indoor range I was still able to produce decent groups by placing the bead at the base of the target. Groups are below, these were shot unsupported, and as mentioned with only a bead sight. I think with rifle sights this is going to be a capable small game rifle that is very accurate.

Btw, GRT suggests the 4.0gr Unique load is trucking along at about 1390fps. I had zero leading with the unique load which is sized to .311”, and minor leading with the 4.5ft Red Dot load which was sized to .310” and lubed with Carnuba Red instead of PC’d like the Unique load.

4.0gr Unique






4.5yr Red Dot

[Texas by God]

That looks promising for sure.


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[jdgabbard]

That looks promising for sure.


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I was impressed. Now I need to figure out a solution for irons. I’ve been looking around, but I haven’t found anything yet that is going to work. The big issue is the barrel dimensions. Muzzle of the barrel is about .730” and the chamber end is 1.110”

Mossberg apparently makes some sights that might work, but the only place I can find them are at Midway, which is out of stock. Then I need to find a smith local who can install them. I’ll probably have him shorten the barrel to 20” at the same time…


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[technojock]

The 300blk is a cool cartridge, but I don't see it as the do-all cartridge that many people do. In order to shoot heavy boolits a lot of times the twist on the barrel is so slow that it is a terrible performer for lighter boolits. Some of the barrels I've seen have had twists as low as 1/3.

I don't think any .300 Blackout rifles have a twist rate any tighter than 1 in 7 inches. My Handirifle is 1 in 8 and shoots like a laser at pistol range. With the light load I shoot most of the time I rarely shoot over 30 yards and it's wicked at that distance...

With as many options I have in .30 caliber, I don't see the need to load the Blackout any hotter. If I need a .30 with more power, I have 5 other rifles I can grab out of my safe...

[popper]

I have 1:8 and 1:10 BO barrels, all shoot 110 half jacket, 110 vmax or 180gr cast fine. Generally use 145gr cast @ 2100 fps. Cheap and fun to shoot. Kids (12-18) at thanksgiving shoot really liked the CVA SS with 145 PB and WSF. Out of all the pistols and rifles they shot, liked the SS best.

[jaysouth]

I have a handi with a sleeve job in .30 Badger. Fun gun. But I have a CVA Scout 300 BO that can be a 30 badger with reduced loads. The CVA is a better and more accurate platform.

[popper]

I was interested yrs ago in a small 30 cal RB or similar. I got the BO scout as it was very cost effective - I already have BO AR. Looking at loadings, I can do subs with lite/heavy bullets, equal any 357 mag and/or better loads. Works for me.

[jdgabbard]

Thought I would provide an update to this. I finally took this out to the range after installing a set of sights that Texas By God sent me.

That is 5 shots with irons at 25yds with my custom Mountain Molds 90gr RNFP I had made about 15 years ago.

[dverna]

Man, that turned out to shoot well! Nice job!!

[jdgabbard]

Man, that turned out to shoot well! Nice job!!

Yeah, I didn't think I was hitting anything at all. Pulled the target and was pleasantly surprised. This one is definitely a keeper!

[Texas by God]

I’m glad that it’s working out so well!
The target looks good; where’s the pic of the Rifle formerly known as the Shotgun?


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[jdgabbard]

I’m glad that it’s working out so well!
The target looks good; where’s the pic of the Rifle formerly known as the Shotgun?


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As requested! Thanks again for the sights!

[Texas by God]

Spring Turkey season is right around the corner and that would work just fine on old Tom!


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[jdgabbard]

Spring Turkey season is right around the corner and that would work just fine on old Tom!


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I’ve never been much of a turkey hunter. But if the 7.62x25 didn’t work I suppose I could always pull out the adapter and use a 3”

[Gtek]

Curious, how did you work the ejector/extractor issue out? I have several of these barrel/stub things going in the find the time get back to pile and thinking of which route to go. I have a factory NEF .223 bull and the extraction was and has been iffy at best, 300 BO still NIB and don't know how it goes. Pinging out shotgun shells is great but I am leaning into an extractor set up for Badger first.

[jdgabbard]

Curious, how did you work the ejector/extractor issue out? I have several of these barrel/stub things going in the find the time get back to pile and thinking of which route to go. I have a factory NEF .223 bull and the extraction was and has been iffy at best, 300 BO still NIB and don't know how it goes. Pinging out shotgun shells is great but I am leaning into an extractor set up for Badger first.

Well, that is something not quite solved. But not entirely necessary. There is no extractor for the barrel insert. The 7.62x25 round is loose enough to pull right out with the help of two little cutouts the manufacturer made. On calibers where an extractor truly is necessary you will probably have to come up with something.

[dverna]

Yeah, I didn't think I was hitting anything at all. Pulled the target and was pleasantly surprised. This one is definitely a keeper!

JD, when you started this thread I thought. "What a waste of time". Figured the contraption could never give decent accuracy...but I was wrong.

Not something I am interested in doing (have no need for it) but still learned from your journey.

[jdgabbard]

JD, when you started this thread I thought. "What a waste of time". Figured the contraption could never give decent accuracy...but I was wrong.

Not something I am interested in doing (have no need for it) but still learned from your journey.

Several felt that way I suppose. But I think there are some key differences between their own experiences and how I managed this.

First, I bought an 18” adapter. Not one of the short, and significantly cheaper, adapters. The longer adapter has a greater potential for developing accuracy over say a 2-4” barrel on the shorter adapters.

Second, this adapter has 3 grooves for o-rings at the end of the barrel. Using more than one significantly increases the rigidity of the adapter while in the barrel. This in my mind allows it to maintain it’s position much better, instead of moving around.

Third, I used a small jeweler’s file to remove the rim from the area where the extractor would interface with the adapter. I hand fitted this, so it is a tight fit, but allows the extractor to move freely. This allows the barre to index to a known position whenever it is removed and reinserted, enabling repeatable results.

The fourth, and greatest point in my mind, is the addition of the sights that were installed. Being able to have a front and back sight over just a bead greatly improves your chances of hitting what you’re aiming at. The fact that these are completely adjustable is a plus. They have a dovetailed front blade, and a rear notch adjustable for windage and elevation. Making fine tuning much easier.

All together, these points have appear to have produced what I would consider acceptable results, while still leaving me with the ability to use the 20ga shotgun barrel. Admittedly, I would still like to have a barrel made from a stub. But cat the moment I don’t see the cost benefit analysis making it worthwhile. A barrel or stub is going for about $100 these days. A barrel blank is another $50-100, and then the cost of having the work done, which I would guess to be in the neighborhood of approximately $300-400. I don’t have a lathe to do this myself. So it’s hard to justify $500ish for a barrel alone. If the cost were closer to $200-300 it might be a different story…

[Thom_44]

on that adapter, do you need to take it out of the barrel for cleaning? ANd if you remove the adapter, how exactly do you ensure that the adapter goes back into the barrel in a way that will leave the poi/poa the same?