Low wall action repair lower tang - help request

[JDHasty]

I think I’m about as far along on cleaning up the frame and lever as I want to go right now. I got some done early this morning and it’s looking a lot better than it did. There are a few rust pits that I still need to work on and a few I’m thinking about leaving, so to not mess up any of the sharp edges.

I’m not having much success in getting a nice photo of the right side. Glare from the lights in my shop make it hard to see the transitions. The right side photographed better when I had it in the big machinist vise in the garage.

The barrel looks to be 1:14 and tapers to .55 @ 22 inches. My first choice was half octagon with wedding ring transition, but this would be my second choice if I were going to purchase a barrel. There is no real reason to slug it now, it’s a CF barrel. I prefer 40 grain V-max and this should be a dandy.

The rust pits on the barrel exterior cleaned up nicely with 320 then 400 wet/dry sand paper. The bore is pristine. I’ll pull the barrel off and clean up the breach end after I get the stock inletting and fitting done. It makes too good of a handle to pull it off now.

My work bench is cluttered with three model 43s, two Remington 580s that have been converted to CF, a BRNO model 5 and a Model 69A plus magazines and ammo for the above sitting on it that I need to get to the range with. I’m slowly getting some new shelving units built and once I get them in service life is going to be good. I’ve got such a clutter of stuff from my garage in my shop it’s hard to get anything done in there. I’ve only got a single car garage and in order to have room over there to build the shelving I have to either have it in the shop or the house temporarily.

[gnoahhh]

Looking good!

[Chill Wills]

If anyone can give me a measurement between the bottom tang screws center to center and a hole size on the rear hole it would be mucho appreciated. I’ll worry about the countersink angle once I get my screws. Had a lot on my plate today and headed to church shortly. If I get a chance to get a few photos when we get home I’ll post them tonight or tomorrow morning.

Sorry, I had not looked back for a few days. Looking like great work on the clean-up!

I measured a few and I come up with 1.880" to 1.890" using a good dial caliber. This is eyeballed on 6-8 tries. This is very close but I am sure there is a better known measurement published.

By pin-gauge, the largest pin pass is .340" on the screw head and .218" on the screw shank.
Michael Rix

If you want some pictures, PM me with an email and I can send you a few.
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I measured the two outside holes - I got going too fast.
I think you wanted the distance from the stock Machine screw to the rear stock WOOD screw. (different hole)
That measurement is 1.526" center to center.
I will send you a full set of pictures and measurements.

[JDHasty]

Thanks so much. That is what has been holding me up in fabricating a jig to hold the tang in place until it's tacked. I have a lot on my plate and never made it to my buddy's house to look his 1885s over and take measurements.

I'm a little hung up right now in getting the wood ordered and for the most frustrating reason. Lost the primary keys to both of my vehicles and if they aren't found I'm going to be paying about a thousand dollars for a couple digital keys. This is going to delay me ordering wood until they are found or have been replaced. That money has to come out of my entertainment budget if they are not located in the next few days. I sure hope I find them. I have a Tile app, but it is on my old iPad that went TU and I forgot to put it on my replacement iPad. It may be cheaper to get the iPad repaired and locate the keys.

[JDHasty]

I really had to search to find a piece of steel that was about the right thickness. This piece is just a hair thinner than I would have preferred, but every other alternative was way thicker. I think it will be just fine though. I’ve got it cut down and drilled and jigged up to weld Wednesday.

We will then be able to level it in my buddy’s mill and cut the sides to mate up. Once I get there and get a countersink on the wood screw hole I’m thinking we can drill a couple holes in a half inch piece of square bar stock and tap the one for the wood screw and use a machine screw to screw it down to something we can get hold of to taper it but leave it a bit thick and I’ll radius and finish it with a draw file. If we machine off the slot in the machine screw in the process, I’ll just drill the head off.

[marlinman93]

I've just shaped the metal by hand with a mill file myself. In the last one I did the donor metal was too thick by about .010" so I matched up the inside to the tang, and just filed down the outside after it was welded. Then filed the taper into the donor piece until it fit. I had to do all this to an existing original stock I found and bought, so it was file and fit until it fit the existing inletting, and depth of the inletting.
I actually found it much easier to fit metal to wood than it's been to fit wood to metal for me! Seems like it's always a tough thing for me to gradually remove wood in the tangs, and not make a mess of it. But removing metal with a file slowly was easy.

[JDHasty]

Slow and easy is my constant reminder to myself.

I pretty much use my old Jerry Fisher scrapers, a Grobet swiss pattern file that is football shaped and occasionally an X-Acto type tool handle with V-gouge or chisel blade on wood and it takes me 15-20 hours minimum to sink a bolt action into a 90% stock. I imagine this tang area on this rifle will take nearly that amount of time to inlet. Milling the sides and extra metal off the taper is pretty low risk. Once we have it dead level to the existing flat on the tang the sides should be pretty straight forward, I'll hand file the angle on them. The taper I'm going to leave high and just get some of the extra metal out of the way and draw file the radius. We have a good supply of wedges and blocks to get it clamped up solidly before milling it. If I have any doubts I will go back to my hand files.

I talked to Jim Wisner over the weekend and he tore his Low Wall down and got back to me with some measurements form CL of bore and face of breach for the spring perch. It looks good to me, but I want to double check. He is going to get a couple wood screws for the tang out to me today. Doesn't hurt to have a spare.

[JDHasty]

I buy used files in as good a shape as possible. Often at garage sales for $.50 to $2 each. Then send them to Boggs to have them sharpened at around $3.50 each.
Boggs also sells files, and have new files for sale at their site too. The files they sharpen are excellent quality when returned. New Nicholson are still better than most files, and Boggs prices are fair for them too.

https://boggstool.com/file-%26-rasp-services

Boggs is going to hand select a smooth, 10" single cut mill file and send it out with an invoice. I have an eight incher that is a beauty, but I want more width. Great people to do business with.

[Chill Wills]

Looking forward to seeing how the tang weld up goes. TIG I assume?

[JDHasty]

Yes.

I’m back on track to order the stock and checkered steel butt plate from Treebone. My eight year old daughter found the missing keys for the F150 and Explorer. If the keys weren’t found I would have had to replace them out of my play money.

I should have hardware from Wisners and MVA showing up here tomorrow and/or Friday.

[JDHasty]

Got the stock ordered, it will be here in a couple weeks. Meanwhile, thinking of scope bases. I'm partial to Burris Zee Rings and Leupold deluxe steel Weaver bases. I'm thinking looking at the Remington 541 base might be a good place to start. If it is pretty close it won't be a big deal to attach a set of rings to a one inch steel rod and mount the basses then contact cement sandpaper to the barrel and work the bases down to a nice fit. Once I get close I can replace the steel rod with an old Sportview or some such and finish it up checking alignment using a laser bore sighter.

[Chill Wills]

You might enjoy looking at this web sight for Steve's products. He makes the highest quality products and he is 100% a straight shooter. Look at the scope base options for singleshots.

https://www.steveearleproducts.com/

BTW- Did you get the tang welded up? Pictures?

[JDHasty]

Not welded yet. Maybe tonight. I'm at the mercy of my neighbor's schedule.

Very interesting to me:

Cross-dovetail blocks

Meant to go into a standard 3/8" x 60° barrel dovetail. The lower ones are either 3/16" or 1/4" high. The higher ones are duplicates of the Unertl BK, K and KK blocks - .365", .420", and .470" respectively. Provided with the brass set screw. I have some that are intentionally .005" larger, to be filed to fit.

Price: $30.80 each

I have an exceedingly rare sightless Winchester Model 43 that has a dovetail cut in the barrel that has never had a sight inserted in it. Proof marked on the side of the barrel, not on the top. My inclination is that this dovetail was cut so that the purchaser could install a scope w/o having to drill and tap holes in the barrel by using a dovetail cross slot scope block in it. I had never thought that I would ever find the proper cross slot scope block to set it up with a target scope w/o altering the original condition of the rifle.

Unfortunately we traded off our Jr Targetspots and Unertls. I will have to go shopping for one now that I know these exist.

[JDHasty]

I did some block polishing tonight and then gave it a rub down with my carding brush just to get an idea how it’s coming along. I’m pretty OK with it. I might have to wait until Saturday morning to get the tang welded up.







I’ll put the carding wheel on the bench grinder and get the final polishing marks all going the right direction before sending it off to be blued. I’m new to having to deal with large flats and keeping the edges straight and am learning as I go. They really haven’t given me as much trouble as I had been expecting.

[JDHasty]

Well, for our first shot at something like this it’s looking pretty good to me at this point.





The guy who promised to TIG weld it flaked out, so this evening my neighbor welded it with a MIG welder I gave him. I went by the welding supply shop and they gave me a spool of wire they sell to a couple gunsmiths. We got some splatter in the serial number and it looked pretty sad after I tried to clean it up. Jim Wisner has a friend who does engraving, I might pay him to put it back. I’ve got the right side looking pretty good, the left is coming along. Slowly but surely I’ll get it. Once I get the extra cut off the tail end and shaped and the screw hole finished out it’s going to look pretty decent. It still needs to be tapered and that comes off the top side. Once I get that done I’ll get the radius looking better.

I forgot I took an elk tenderloin steak out to thaw. When I came upstairs at eleven PM I was thinking I would have a bowl of cereal and call it a day, but went ahead and made it with some taters and these carrots that are kind of like a rutabaga cross and an onion from our garden. That turned out to be a nice reward for a decent day’s work. I’ve been up and busy since 05:00.



Once I get the tang wrapped up, I’m kind of stuck until the stock blank shows up.

[JDHasty]

The serial number area had a bunch of waves. I didn’t notice them before we welded it, so I’m guessing we were the cause. I worked the taper down by draw filing and block sanding and we had the hole perfect until I decided to work the taper down a bit more. But over all it’s looking good. I’m going to leave the feint serial number for the engraver to use as a guide. We will re do the screw countersink hole last thing before sending the parts out to be blued.









The wild end makes a good handle. I’ll get it cut to length and radiused before the stock blank gets here.

[Chill Wills]

Looking good! Keep the pictures coming, please.

[JDHasty]

Looking good! Keep the pictures coming, please.

Thank you for the encouragement. I can be really critical of my own work, it's good to hear complements. It is a lot of fun, that's for sure.

My neighbor across the street hasn't welded in nine years, we practiced on a couple pieces of scrap and one thing I can promise is that tang isn't going to break at the weld. I gave him my new 180 AMP Lincoln MIG Welder and everything I bought at an estate sale with the intention of teaching myself to weld. It sat in my garage for a couple years before giving it to the two brothers. There are some holes in the weld, but hey it's not bad for a first attempt at something like this. These two single shot projects are for me to learn on and I could have bought a tang, but keep reminding myself what it's all about. They are really nice kids and always help me out when I need a hand.

I suppose that what I can do now is get something going for scope mounting. I also either have to cut a dovetail with a milling machine or file one for the fore end hanger. I want to get the stock blanks in hand before that happens.

[JDHasty]

The guy I consider my mentor said: I guess it’s good enough. Between him and I that means I’m being lazy. So I did some more draw filing and what are left are not going to come out. I looked at under my magnifying hood after finishing up tonight and they either have to be ground down and welded or left. If the opportunity presents itself, I’ll have him weld them in.

[JDHasty]

I’ve been just poking around a bit at the parts waiting for either the stock or scope bases to arrive. I’m going to use Leupold QRW 541 bases and Burris Signature Zee rings. The Remington 580/541 receiver is probably about as small diameter as any that this base is made for. It’s just over an inch and my barrel is just under an inch. I will drill a depth stop hole in the bottom of each base after I decide exactly where I want them placed on the barrel and doing the math. Then I’ll put the bases and rings on a one inch aluminum rod I have and glue sand paper to the barrel and after roughing the bases down with a half round file will work them down on the sand paper. Rubber cement or contact cement works good to glue the sand paper in place with. We have used that method in the past and I don’t know how other people do it, but that works very well for us.

I’m going to polish the bases up after fitting them. I’ve changed my mind and am going to have the action color case hardened. I’ve got a couple sets of Talley two screw sling swivel studs on the way and will inlet one set into the stock and am going to have the butt plate, sling swivels and rings & bases color case hardened along with the action. I’m going back and forth on if I want the hammer and trigger blued or color case hardened.