M206 Rock Island--Warranty "repair" still not working

[John in WI]

About a month ago, I wrote regarding an M206 that seems to be having a timing problem. Occasionally (around every 3 cylinders), the cylinder doesn't lock up. It's a little scary, because it will actually drop the hammer and strike the primer--but about 1.5mm off center.

I explained the issue to RIA. They sent a shipping label, I returned it. I just got it back--and now I'm annoyed. They replaced the hammer spring (why? What would that have to do with the timing?). But the timing is still not right. It needs to advance the cylinder just a hair further.

I'm annoyed with this thing. I thought I'd be saving money, by buying a used but solid revolver like this. Cheap enough that I didn't have to sweat any wear or use. I got it for $240 which was a pretty good deal (I thought). Except now it's not even safe to use. So, since it isn't safe, I also can't sell it (not in good conscience at least).

Anyone have ideas what to do with this thing? Maybe a new cylinder or cylinder cog?

I need to contact them again. But they (RIA) require the shipping go through an FFL, which has already cost me $50.

Annoying. I try to never slam anyone on social media. But do yourself a favor, and if you find one of these walk away from it.

Annoyed.

[Remiel]

Buddy sent his Smith and wesson pro series 686 because after each shot the trigger locked up in the back/fire position and had to be forced to reset, they replaced the ejector assembly, and he probably still has the issue, he hasn't shot it since, but when I looked at I I noticed that the hammer block was just a rough stamped piece and was hanging everything up, I didn't have the confidence to stone it, but now I wish I had.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

[John in WI]

I just spent the past hour with the RIA M206 loaded with snap caps. It's the wierdest thing. If you run SA, but quickly cock the hammer, it locks up 100% of the time. If you cock it very slowly, it almost never locks up.
Same thing with DA. If you pull the trigger quickly, the lock engages. If you pull it slowly, it malfunctions about 50% of the time. Does that seem weird? It seems like when the cylinder is moving fast enough, momentum is enough to carry the cylinder through to the locking point. If you do it very slowly, it stops just a few thou short of locking.

This is annoying. Why they replaced the hammer spring, and then reported "inspected and fully tested"? They obviously didn't test it. It was malfunctioning right out of the box when I just received it today.

I really don't want to be dropping $50 and waiting a month while we go through this. "Inspected and fully tested".

Why would a firearm company send something that clearly is not safe to operate? Think of the liability of that.

[ShooterAZ]

If it were me, I would keep the complaints coming and request a new gun and/or a refund of the FFL fees or at least free shipping next time around. The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Some states have "lemon" laws, something you might want to look into. I'd be annoyed as well, and would let them know in a diplomatic fashion.

[John in WI]

I was very polite in my response to them. I guess it's my only option. If I take it anywhere else, it's going to be expensive, and it will also void the warranty. It just bugs me--I got the revolver cheap (I mean, used, and it was not expensive to begin with). But this kind of stuff is really offsetting the low initial cost.

Anyway, I just explained that the timing is clearly not correct--ie, it should lock up whether I slowly or quickly cock it, or slowly or quickly pull the trigger. The condition is just not safe. Some of the hammer strikes are WAY off center--it is dropping the hammer, even if the cylinder is out by several degrees. Not a good situation.
I'm not sure what else I could have done. I sent pictures, and explained exactly how I tested it. If you apply a little bit of drag to the cylinder, it fails to lock nearly 100% of the time. The only time it does lock is if the cylinder is rotating fast enough to carry it through.

Anyway, I think you're right. Just tell them, listen. I either want my money back, or I want a functioning replacement. It only has about 100 rounds of standar pressure ammo through it. It shouldn't even be broken in yet.

[LAGS]

From my experience with revolvers that don't advance all the way when cocked slowly.
Or under slow double action cocking.
It is usually a hand that is too short , or has side to side play.
Or maybe too weak of a hand spring.
I agree that have the manufacture repair it if it is under warranty.
But it might be worth it to get an opinion from a pistol smith before you return it again.
The hand should rotate the cylinder far enough for the cylinder stop engages to lock the cylinder in line with the barrel.

[Recycled bullet]

+1 to lags exactly right

[charlie b]

I am surprised RIA has returned a gun that may not be safe to fire. I'd be tempted to make a short video showing the problem with a nice letter asking them to please make the gun safe enough to shoot. Inform them a copy of the letter (and video) will be held in the event a malfunction causes injury. Keep in mind that their response may be to keep the gun and reimburse you the current gun value (determined by them).

[shooting on a shoestring]

John, sorry for your disappointment. The brand you bought and the price you paid don’t really matter when a revolver cylinder doesn’t carry up properly. It would have been better for you to have discovered this issue before you bought it.

There is a thread in the Stickies above called “Revolver inspection -the right way - aka wheel gun 101”. It was started by Outpost75 who put in a long career in the firearms industry. He covers inspecting for carry up about halfway down his first post. It’s a good read. Good info.

Slow cocking SA or slow trigger pull in DA are the bane of revolver function. It’s not uncommon for revolvers to not carry up properly as yours is doing. It often goes un-noticed bc as you find, cocking quickly or pulling the trigger DA quickly allows the cylinder to carry up by momentum.

The cause for poor carry up can be the hand is too short or there is too much end shake or a combination of both.

The DA Colts are notorious for having poor carry up due to their design where the hand is actually under load locking the cylinder at firing as opposed to the S&W and Ruger design where the cylinder is locked entirely by the bolt/cylinder stop.

If an old Colt hand is peened too short due to repeated firing (normal use) often the best fix is to lengthen it back to proper length by peening the sides of the hand’s body.

If end shake is allowing the cylinder to move too far forward for the length of the current hand, often the fix is to use cylinder shims to hold the cylinder rear ward. Or the yoke can sometimes be peened enough to increase its length and keep the cylinder from moving too far forward where the hand can’t reach it to carry up properly.

MIM parts cannot be peened. I would expect Rock Island to have MIM parts throughout. But I really don’t know bc I’ve never had one apart to see for myself.

I hope you can get your revolver carrying up properly either by fixing it yourself or getting it fixed. It’s certainly fixable and is a common occurrence for revolvers at some point in their lives.

[FergusonTO35]

If you have access to a bona fide gunsmith, have them certify that the gun is not working right and contact RIA on your behalf. Otherwise, I would list it on GB "as is- for parts/repair" and cut your losses.

[Bmi48219]

Try writing a cover letter about the issue and attach all previous documents, including the “inspected and fully test” document. Address the whole shebang to their legal department. That “inspected ….” document would wind up costing RIA big $$$ in the event of a subsequent catastrophic failure.