6.8 spc brass to 5.45 x 39

[rrob692326]

It's been 4 1/2 years since anyone in the state has carried any 5.45 x 39. We are not allowed to order ammo ,primers or powder ourselves and gun shops refuse to special order even with full payment so I'm down to reloading only. I tried 222 rem cases, really thin, and cases separate even after annealing twice. I have special ordered a forming die from Hornady to form thicker L.C. 5.56 NATO but the 17 thousandths difference in base measurements has me concerned for safety and kabooms, despite the few testimonies that it works. I understand that a couple of companies have produced 5.45 brass from 6.8spc, and 30/30 but not about how it was done. My Hornady brass has long since died, after 6 reloads, and alas there is no more to be had. Do any of you know about the 6.8SPC conversion process? what is required? I can't see spending 3 bucks a case (not counting damn shipping) to get some. I tried asking on several sites and sellers of once fired brass to buy once fired steel cases even offered .50 cents a steel case, but not a single nibble! I have the dies, berdan to boxer conversion equipment, and bullets but s-%$ outa luck for any cases. Any and all help appreciated. Stinking Hawaii government wants to kill gun ownership with red tape laws, never use to be so bad as it is now.
Thanks again
PS
Flying to the mainland at a thousand bucks a pop round trip just to get the 10 lbs, of ammo(no separate primers, or powder allowed, (stupid ********) the airlines allows to be carried in checked luggage by each passenger is a no go.

[BK7saum]

350 legend would be close to same base diameter, but necking down from .35 caliber to 5.45x39 would be tricky, probably crease the neck even with multiple steps, and would also require neck turning.

If I were to purse 350 legend to 5.45 case forming and didn't have a lathe, I would by a few surplus dies in 8mm, 7mm, and 6mm so I could cut them off and use then as neck sizing dies. Maybe a .308 and a 6.5 caliber die as well. Somewhere along the way, I'd anneal and neck turn.

A lot of steps, but it would make usable brass.

I do see 350 legend available in a lot of places.

[rrob692326]

Thank you BK! I have not had any experience nor knowledge of the 350 Legend, but looking over the specs it looks very good and your multiple die idea is a good one. At least now I have a viable solution. Hey shoot me your address I'd like to show my appreciation, I'll send you some real Kona coffee.
Aloha No

[Mk42gunner]

You might look at the CH4D website to see if they offer any forming dies for the 5.45x39 too. It may take a while to get them.

If you already have 6.8 brass, the same cut down orphan die trick may let you form them with little or no cost.

Robert

[deces]

I really wish Starline brass would get on the ball with 5.45mm, instead of jumping on every new gucci AR caliber that comes out every couple years.

[rrob692326]

Thanks Robert, but I discussed using the 6.8SPC with Ben The form die expert at Hornady, and he ran the numbers through his software and with his prior work and said forming 5.45 x 39 from 6.8 is dangerous, as the brass become too thin at the base where the rim begins from the forming operations. I thank you for you input, but gotta accede to their expert here, and error on the cautious side as he has decades of experience and is Hornady's only case forming expert. I spoke to CH, and they put me on the list. The cost of 3 forming dies that are needed is $270.00 and expected delivery date is for late 2025!! Going to try Redding, maybe better luck there, but I intend to try a series of sizing dies like BK suggested I ordered some 350 Legend Starline cases today.

[deces]

Did you ask Hornady why they quit offering virgin 5.45mm brass while you had them on the phone?

[Mk42gunner]

No problem. I only suggested the 6.8 idea because you had already brought it up, I don't have my load books here to actually look at dimensions.

$270 seems kind of spendy, until you stop to think about it. You are pretty much guaranteed a workable set of dies and procedure.

Robert

[barnetmill]

Can 5.45 be re-barreled to some other caliber. If it is a bolt gun it surely can be done. A 6.5 G might work assuming you can buy that ammo in your current local.
Come to think of it if you can buy 6.5 x39 it should be possible to make 5.45 from it.

[rrob692326]

Yea, I did ask was told demand for the 5.45 was not good enough, and some big shot Hornady bean counter decided it was better to axe the production. They have no intention of starting up again. I keep bugging Starline but no go. $270.00 isn't bad at all, at least I can shoot my AK74's again. I've lived here all my life, since before Hawaii became a state, and you get use to having to pay through the nose for everything. Just to give you an idea how things are here, a family of 4 with a $65,000.00 yearly income means that family will be homeless, or living in a car, and eating a lousy $10 and change meal of a McDonald's quarter pounder and cheese burger and an order of fries every day! A crappy 1100 sq ft 3 bedroom 2 bath tract home in the suburbs will cost you an easy $1.25 million and up. Everyplace has its drawbacks, as they say, no free lunches.

[wyowillys46]

Can 5.45 be re-barreled to some other caliber. If it is a bolt gun it surely can be done. A 6.5 G might work assuming you can buy that ammo in your current local.
Come to think of it if you can buy 6.5 x39 it should be possible to make 5.45 from it.

The base/rim diameter is different. The 5.45x39 bolt face is too small, and the 5.45 magazines will not accommodate the larger diameter cartridge.

[Texas by God]

If your 5.45x39 rifle is an AR15, $200 for a 5.56 barrel, BCG, and magazine will solve your problem.
Use that money that you saved when 5.45 ammo was cheap!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[barnetmill]

The base/rim diameter is different. The 5.45x39 bolt face is too small, and the 5.45 magazines will not accommodate the larger diameter cartridge.

Well I learned something the 7.62x39 and 6.5 grendel are the same case head, but that of the 5.45 is different. It will not work. I am glad I never purchased a gun in that caliber.

[wyowillys46]

It's definitely something of an orphan case although it shares a similar base diameter to the 9x19 family of cartridges. I'm surprised no one has tried to convert a 74 type rifle to one of the 9mm Magnums that are out there or even 7.62x25.

[rrob692326]

Got a thousand Starline 350 Legend brass cases today, and ordered a set of custom forming dies from Hornady for $335.00 with an ETA of Christmas. In the mean time. I went on GUNBROKER AND Eee- BAY and rounded up 10 sizing dies to cut down along with a rethreading die to make neck down dies from the 350 Legend, on down to 222 mag stepping down in most instances 10 to 17 thousandths per die with an exception or two of 23 thousandths or so, along with an RCBS .220 Swift neck reaming die along with a custom.220 reamer. My question is: how many times, and at what intervals should I be annealing the brass? Should it be every step down? every other step down? or what? This is new territory for me, and I would appreciate any guidance before sacrificing brand new Starline brass cases ,when a few experienced words of wisdom, may make the sacrifice unnecessary. Will consider outside neck turning brass when the situation comes up.
Aloha No

[BK7saum]

Depending on the factory annealling, I would try one or two cases through the entire process without annealling. You cannot unanneal them if they are soft and collapse the shoulders.

[BK7saum]

You will probably need to anneal after they are formed and before firing the first time. You may trying firing first unnannealed to see if a neck splits and then anneal before reloading.

Short answer is it really depends. Sometimes it works one way better than another. Sorry I cannot be more helpful or specific.

[BK7saum]

I would not add an annealling step until the process shows it is necessary by getting a case failure, split neck or creases in neck. Very small batches or singles until you validate the process.

[BK7saum]

0.023" is not too big of a step. I have gone ½mm increments many times forming cases. Less is better but 0.023" is not a problem.

If any of your dies have a sharper or steeper shoulder, 35 or 40 degree,. you might consider polishing/honing/rounding the neck/shoulder junction to get a more gentle transition. A steeper angle could and probably will collapse a neck on an annealed case, but may or may not negatively affect an unannealed neck. These are forming dies and no longer for loading a specific cartridge. This may not be necessary, but may help.

[deces]

I sure hope you are going to post pictures of your new dies and the ones you mod.