9mm and 45 not worth reloading?

[45_Colt]

I think that one thing missing here are the loads themselves. If one wants to shoot full-on ball 230 gr FMJ, can just buy it easy enough.

But since I've been shooting a lot, and with reduced loads, say 185gr and 200 gr with 5.2gr of 231, or Bullseye (among others). Don't we need to reload? I don't know of how else to get these (somewhat lighter) loads.

Here is another load, for 50ft indoor use:

Bullseye 3.0gr 185gr SWC (183gr bevel base)

Unless self loaded, I don't see purchasing these rounds.

As for cost, umm..., what difference does that make? I'm shootin', ain't I?

45_Colt

[dverna]

A difficult discussion. We cannot agree if the primers we bought years ago for $20/k are $20/k or $80/k.

A person who enjoys reloading and casting has a different perspective than someone who only does it to save Monet.

A person who can spend their spare time making $25/hr doing something they enjoy may not want to save $12/hr by casting.

More importantly, we have the ability to justify whatever we want to. What “works” for one person, may sound silly to another…and we all want to think we are right.

Asking the question shows a lack of critical thinking skills…sorry OP. If someone cannot calculate what it costs to cast and reload, they should not be reloading. Determining cost is simple. Then each person can put a value on their time, enjoyment and or drudgery, and special needs.

[Three44s]

There are folks who like to restore automobiles or trucks. Do they make wages doing that?

There are people who golf. Are they keeping up with Tiger Woods? Do they even get a dime for their efforts?

Three44s

[armoredman]

A coworker called me a few days ago asking if I would go shooting with him, since he has Dept Range Qualification on Monday. So, I met him at the local range today, and I brought the ammo. He has a family and bills while I am sitting much better than I have been for a very long time, so he got to burn up 200 rounds of 9mm today at targets my wife bought years ago on the target stands I bought years ago. I didn't ask him for squat. However, he brought his mother, a wonderful older Indian lady, (dot, not feather), and SHE decided to pay me with home made curry, the whole works, chutney, rice, all of it, enough for two meals for me and my loving wife! Now THAT was a good deal! She and my wife spent the time getting to know each other while we shot. Was a great way to start the day. Did I worry about the cost of the ammo or my time? Not one bit, especially since I might need to have this guy back me up at work!

[barnetmill]

A coworker called me a few days ago asking if I would go shooting with him, since he has Dept Range Qualification on Monday. So, I met him at the local range today, and I brought the ammo. He has a family and bills while I am sitting much better than I have been for a very long time, so he got to burn up 200 rounds of 9mm today at targets my wife bought years ago on the target stands I bought years ago. I didn't ask him for squat. However, he brought his mother, a wonderful older Indian lady, (dot, not feather), and SHE decided to pay me with home made curry, the whole works, chutney, rice, all of it, enough for two meals for me and my loving wife! Now THAT was a good deal! She and my wife spent the time getting to know each other while we shot. Was a great way to start the day. Did I worry about the cost of the ammo or my time? Not one bit, especially since I might need to have this guy back me up at work!

That is how people should interact and we certainly need more of it for sure.

[AnthonyB]

All:
This has been a very interesting read (to me) and I thank everyone for their thoughts.

As with most threads here, this one took a turn I never intended, and I even tried to get it back on track! It became a thread about ammo cost, reloading costs, and the value each of us puts on our time. That was not the point of the post, but I understand how the "title" I used turned the thread that way.

A few posters understood the question I intended; most went down the cost/time/opportunity cost rabbit hole. That was not my intention, and I apologize if poor written communication skills led to that discussion.

I asked only one question in the OP:
"My question - are people who feel this way just loading FMJ or RFN cast for blasting ammo?" I even wrote in my clarification post that "Your value for your time is yours, not mine to decide."

1. All of us here have the capability to cast any shape or style of bullet we want, to include HPs.
2. Casting a FN/cast HP costs no more (assuming equal weight, for the opportunity costs guys) than casting a RN, and can be done at the same speed. Casting a HP is a little slower with a Cramer-style mold from MP, but not a great deal. "Your value for your time is yours, not mine to decide." I took time costs out of the equation.
3. Loading a FN/cast HP takes no more time than loading FMJ or RN, no matter how they were obtained.
4. I would rather cast and load the more effective bullet than a purchased FMJ or cast RN.

Comparing a round loaded with FMJ or cast RN to one with a cast WFN/WLN/SWC is comparing apples to small furry marine animals.

5. I can load a more effective bullet for less than I can purchase FMJ factory ammo. That more effective bullets makes the loaded ammo "worth" more to me, so why not do that? That increased "worth" changes the "opportunity costs" versus purchased ammo equation, but remember I never put time into the equation anyway, and explicitly took it out.

I assumed posters spending time (opportunity cost; that time could be spent elsewhere) on a board dedicated to "Cast Boolits" enjoy casting and loading, or at a bare minimum, don't equate it with sheer drudgery or painful labor. Apparently what I learned about assumptions in the Army still holds true today.

Don, you have 2000 XTP's in stock ready to load should need arise. I'm glad you are guaranteed the time to load them when you realize the need is approaching. My crystal ball stopped working long ago, so I'll be forced to face the unexpected with what I have at the time. That ammo will be loaded with a more effective bullet than a FMJ or cast RN. I'll work on my critical thinking skills while you will work on your critical reading skills, okay?

35 Rem, check out the RCBS 45-230CM. It has proven to be as reliable as RN in every 45 ACP I've tried, so I get that same reliability with a more effective bullet
Tony

[Dusty Bannister]

While I do agree it is necessary to have ammo loaded ahead of need, perhaps some have found the need to break down those loaded rounds and use the components (powder and primer) in a different caliber. That generally ruins the cast bullet until it has been cast again in a usable form. I tend to cast and load for anticipated use, not just blasting ammo. That is the benefit of casting and loading for the common calibers.

[dverna]

Anthony, this is the question posed in your first post.

"Fellas:
I see a lot of posts about particular caliber not being worth reloading given the current cost of components and the CURRENT availability of factory ammo at a certain price level. That level seems to be around .26 per round for 9mm, haven't seen many numbers on 45 ACP.

My question - are people who feel this way just loading FMJ or RN cast for blasting ammo?"

The vast majority of 9mm reloads are practice ammunition. In my case, I have never fired a 9mm at a person or critter. IMO premium jacketed bullets are better for "serious work" so I do not use cast bullets for self-defense loads. For "blasting ammo", I do not need a HP or specific bullet profile/alloy. I buy whatever bullet is economical or cast whatever is easiest to cast.

Changing the initial question to justify what you are doing is "stacking the deck". You do not place a value on your time, but it does have value for others.

If you want to use the same bullet for blasting and self-defense you have made the right choice. It is not the right choice for everyone.

[wwmartin]

I reloaded the original 1 fired 9mm brass I purchased 50 years ago, I believe I paid 3 cent a piece for them and shot them for the next 40 years. The same with 45 acp at 4.5 cent each. It was getting old after reloading only the tooth fairy knows how many times over 40 some years. So I looked at replacing them. Winchester white box, Remington 115 fmj 9mm were selling for around $80 a brick, 45 acp $30 a box of 100. The cost at that time for components cost more than factory loads. If you buy all your components it's still that way for 9mm.
But!
Cast your own and recycle your brass you have a large part of the cost controlled for the next 40 years. You'll loose the brass before you wear it out.
If you have brass and a supply of lead to cast your own yes reloading 9mm &45 acp makes economic sense. I only bought new to accumulate the components (brass).
Lee 6 cavity molds make short work of casting large quantities, I can manage 2 molds at a time once I get them up to temperature.

Bill

[35 Rem]

Yeah, I can see where that RCBS 45-230CM might be a real good 45ACP bullet. It has a nose profile behind the meplate that looks like it would feed in a semi-auto. I had always overlooked it since it's advertised as a cowboy bullet which makes me immediately associate it with the 45 Colt and revolvers.

[txbirdman]

Yeah, I can see where that RCBS 45-230CM might be a real good 45ACP bullet. It has a nose profile behind the meplate that looks like it would feed in a semi-auto. I had always overlooked it since it's advertised as a cowboy bullet which makes me immediately associate it with the 45 Colt and revolvers.

I’ve used that bullet quite often in my Combat Commander and it works very well. Also the weight is “spot on” using COWW.

[fredj338]

While I do agree it is necessary to have ammo loaded ahead of need, perhaps some have found the need to break down those loaded rounds and use the components (powder and primer) in a different caliber. That generally ruins the cast bullet until it has been cast again in a usable form. I tend to cast and load for anticipated use, not just blasting ammo. That is the benefit of casting and loading for the common calibers.

Agree. I keep about 500rds max of any caliber i shoot often. Stock piling 1000s of rds is reducing my primer supply for no real good reason. Shtf, i can only carry so much & then if staying in place, plenty of time to reload.

[quilbilly]

I guess it just depends on what you are asking the projectiles to do.

[BNE]

I take a different point of view: I cast bullets and reload ammunition because I like doing it. The economics of cast loads vs factory ammo never enters my mind. I try to spend my free time doing things I like, and it is restful and restorative to craft my own ammunition. Shooting is fun, but reloading is also fun. I don't reload as a necessity to go shooting; casting & reloading is a goal within itself. I reload lots of calibers, 45 acp and 9mm included, and even if it cost more to cast my own I'd still do it.

Same. I started reloading 9mm ammo at first just because I could.....My daughter shot in college competitions and I started loading for her (and Me) then. Now I just enjoy making my own. I think my thinking is also that I want to BE ABLE TO HAVE ammo if I can't find it.

BNE

[AnthonyB]

Don:
It is obvious you refuse to read my original post in its entirety, along with the others I made to clarify where I might have been unclear. That is ok; I'm not looking for your approval nor trying to justify anything to anyone. However, even a very brief reading of the first few posts would reveal that I took time out of the equation, and I did not change the question.

I get it; you don't like to cast or load ammo. But, you make my point for me when you write that you "...cast whatever is easiest to cast." A FN is just as easy to cast as a RN, so why bother with the less effective bullet? That was my point. And I can load the more effective bullet for less cost than the standard cheap FMJ ammo, so consider that a win all-around.

I don't really "choose" to use cast for defense. I will use whatever is in the pistol when it is needed. That may be at the range when I am practicing, and is as likely a scenario as any I may encounter other than an animal attack while I'm loafing in the woods with a handgun loaded with cast bullets. The Army teaches that the enemy gets a vote, and I don't get to differentiate between "practice" and real world ammo. With no additional costs to me, why wouldn't I want the more effective bullet with all else being equal?

I wasn't trying to convert the world to my point of view. I was just trying to understand a point of view that didn't make sense to me. Others apparently understood, and I'll let this conversation go now.
Tony

[barnetmill]

Agree. I keep about 500rds max of any caliber i shoot often. Stock piling 1000s of rds is reducing my primer supply for no real good reason. Shtf, i can only carry so much & then if staying in place, plenty of time to reload.

Storing ammo for bad stuff hitting the horizontal ventilator I prefer jacketed ammo with a primer and bullet seal. For such I prefer 9x19, 5.56x45, 7.62x39 & 54 and also 7.62 nato.

[sigep1764]

I don't load 45, but I load 9mm. I cast HPs and only load them. They are my self defense loads and practice ammo. Brass was bought years ago and some I can't even read the head stamp on any more. My time has no value for me when casting or loading. Current component cost for me is makes it cost effective for me to do this. I haven't fired a jacketed or factory produced round in a few years outside of 22lr or shotgun shells.

[fredj338]

Storing ammo for bad stuff hitting the horizontal ventilator I prefer jacketed ammo with a primer and bullet seal. For such I prefer 9x19, 5.56x45, 7.62x39 & 54 and also 7.62 nato.

I get that, but one can seal primers & bullets in handloads. Cast/coated, just as good as jacketed for almost free. I have couple cases of 223 in ammo cans, same for 9mm & 12ga but unless i am staying put, not hauling much ammo in a back pack, which is what happens when you can longer drive the 4x4.

[armoredman]

I have fired reloads I made 17 years ago without issue. No sealant on the primer/bullet other than friction, just put in either plastic boxes or plastic baggies.

[trapper9260]

I have ammo that I loaded back in the mid 80s and it is cast and nothing else was done then just load them and they shoot fine. It all comes to how you store them. I also have 22lr that was bought in the 70s and shoots just fine. They are hollow points. also regular lead like Wildcats.