Belgian SxS Proof Marks?

[TheAbe]

Parents came to visit this week, and as part of the visit, I have now officially inherited my great-grandfather’s shotgun. It’s marked Wilmot Gun Company, which as I understand was a name used by Henri Pieper in Liege for “trade guns” to be exported to the US. Anyway, it’s in nice shape, though the wood is dry (I will have to refinish it to ensure it doesn’t crack on firing), but am a bit confused by the marks on the barrel flats.

Not shown, there is the Belgian “tower” proof mark for black powder proofing. The confusion comes from my understanding that Wilmot Guns stopped being produced by that name around 1900, but the barrels have the post-1924 “12-65” size marking inside an omega, and nothing otherwise indicating nitro proofing or BP proofing, and would seem to be 25 years newer than the locks. Any insights?
I plan on loading it with some low-pressure loads in 2-1/2” shells that should be ok even for BP (~5k psi max). I’d also note that the barrels are “fake Damascus” in that they have Damascus patterns on the surface, but they were printed or acid-etched on very lightly. Some sanding and wear not done by me has revealed they are actually cast or drawn steel and not twist steel.

[skeettx]

https://www.shotguns.se/html/belgium.html



1852 ->


Liege


Provisional black powder proof for breech loading guns, since 1924 reserved for smooth bore barrels. Between 1847-1952 the stamp with the letter “F-J C” was used in the same purpose

[TheAbe]

So perhaps not the full story of the gun, but the barrels were proofed only for BP, and based on the inspectors marks, and the life-span of the original owner, the barrels were likely inspected between 1930 and 1952. Thanks!

Anyone have other insights on this one?

[2152hq]

'Fake Damascus' pattern was fairly common and offered by some mfg's and retailers.
It is a printing type process and usually holds up quite well.

That along with actual Damascus finish when removed from the surface of the bbl (polished off) will leave the surface looking the same as a plain steel bbl's surface.

Every one in a while on a true damascus or laminated steel bbl that has been polished but otherwise unfinished and is still 'in the white' you can sometimes still make out the twist pattern in the steel.
Usually you can not see any difference.

So a polished/sanded in the white bbl surface in this case could be a Steel bbl or a Damascus Bbl

One way to check is to apply a couple different soln's to the now polished up areas and see if the Damascus pattern re-appears.

One is Sulfuric Acid soln.
Another is a weak soln of common laundry bleach (sodium hypochlorite).
Either of these will lightly etch and brown the surface. If Plain steel, no pattern will emerge as there is no combination of soft iron & harder steel as used in the Damascus or other composition bbl material make-up.

If the bbl is a Damascus ,Twist,Laminated material, the pattern however faint will show as the iron content shows darker than the steel in the pattern.

After the 'test' the area can be scrubbed of the soln, deactivated with plain soap&water and rinsed. Then oiled.

[TheAbe]

I will check that! Thanks! My thoughts are that it is an applied print, as the pattern continues through the rib continuously....and there would be no reason to have such a pattern on the rib unless it was applied uniformly after construction. But why guess when a test is so simple?

[Squid Boy]

TheAbe, could you post another closer photo of the barrel flats? I tried blowing it up and it pixilates before my old eyes can really read it. I thought I saw a Crown / U on the right flat and that would be a German proof. It may be possible that it was reproofed at a later date in Germany. Thanks, Squid Boy

[TheAbe]

I can try, but my phone isn’t giving me great photos.

I think those are a *M a *J and possibly a *V near the top. Inspector marks? This photo does show the tower proof mark though.

[missionary5155]

Sure is a fine looking double to be the guardian off. Your family has done a good job taking care of that jewel.

[TheAbe]

Thank you, and yes for the most part it has been well taken care of. My grandfather had been in possession of it from 1956-2021, and took care of it as he’d been taught to care for firearms in the army. Fortunately the case-hardening of the main assembly remains intact, though some of the barrels have been sanded, I think in attempt to remove some of the light surface rust that is starting to show. Still, even without the pattern on the barrels, the carving stands out, and there are not many shotguns I’ve seen that have eyes that follow you around.

As for the barrel steel, I tested a sanded bit with bleach earlier, and there was no contrast that showed in etching. I will conclude that these are not true Damascus steel barrels, but fluid steel, albeit never proofed for smokeless powder. I have a load that yields 1200fps (7/8 oz) with a maximum pressure of I think 5,400 psi. Perhaps a bit more than what would be had by BP, but I could always reduce it further by switching to an even better wad.