Norwegian Krag hard to eject fired casing….

[Dante]

I have a cavalry carbine in 6.5x55. It has been sporterized by having the stock cut back but otherwise is all original. I started out with light loads using 2400 and SR4759. Bolt was a bit sticky on extracting spent cases. It required a bump with the palm of my hand. Loaded cartridges cycled easily and normally but fired casings did not. When I loaded up some with 4831 extraction became almost impossible. I took advise from a member on another forum and spun some emery paper in the chamber with a wooden dowel split on the end to hold the paper. On my next range session it seemed the extraction issue was solved but….today…NOT! Back to sticky extraction again. I have examined the casings and find no obvious marks to indicate the issue but I did note that the primers are slightly backed out. Todays load was 13.5 gn’s of 2400 under an 82 grain hollow point jacketed bullet. I will be loading using cast gas checked bullets next. I am wondering if the light loads are causing some problem? Looking for input from experienced reloaders. Dave

[WILCO]

Time to stop and go back to square one.
You're seeing signs of excessive pressure.

[TD1886]

With the fast shotgun/pistol powder in light loads you can see primer back out like that, but not with that 4831. What was the 4831 load? I hope it was enough that wouldn't cause a SEE event.

I would have polished out the chamber with 0000 steel wool with oil on it.

If and when you try the lighter fast powder loads put a little oil on your finger and rub it on the case. that will keep the case from obturating to the chamber. Also you should back your sizer die out and because you may be sizing the shoulder back too far. Load up a slightly hotter round and oil the case as I said so that you can get an empty that represented of whole chamber, in other words it expanded out to fill the entire chamber. On that fire round the primer shouldn't be backed out. If it isn't clean the case and marker up the shoulder with a marker pen, while your sizer die is backed out some, and size the case and see how far the die sizes down on the neck. You want to barely kiss the shoulder. So keep turning the die in until you get that.

[LAGS]

I would suggest you do a Chamber Casting.
It will show you if you have any deformation or roughness in the chamber.
I always recommend doing that on guns that are built out of military surplus rifles.
If the casting seems the right measurements.
And doesn't show scratches from scratches or pitting.
Then I would suggest you run a chamber reamer into the chamber by hand very gently just to confirm there is no carbon build up.
I do that on Mosins Nagants because most of them have a hard opening bolt after firing them.
It does make them operate a little smoother.
BUT.
Do Not run the reamer in Hard or you will increase the headspacing.
BTW,
Did you check the headspacing ?

[WILCO]

Did you check the headspacing ?

That's a valid question.

[WILCO]

Another question is, have you fired commercial ammo out of it?

[TD1886]

I would suggest you do a Chamber Casting.
It will show you if you have any deformation or roughness in the chamber.
I always recommend doing that on guns that are built out of military surplus rifles.
If the casting seems the right measurements.
And doesn't show scratches from scratches or pitting.
Then I would suggest you run a chamber reamer into the chamber by hand very gently just to confirm there is no carbon build up.
I do that on Mosins Nagants because most of them have a hard opening bolt after firing them.
It does make them operate a little smoother.
BUT.
Do Not run the reamer in Hard or you will increase the headspacing.
BTW,
Did you check the headspacing ?

If he fires that moderate load I suggested with an lightly oiled case it will obtruate the whole case and any roughness in the chamber will leave an impression on the case. I would suggest a pound cast if he wants to get model of the chamber. Easier then Cerosafe and lasts forever.

[Dante]

Thanks gentlemen for all the ideas. I do not have headspace gauges or a chamber reamer. I have also never done a chamber cast. The brass that I am using was used brass so I full length sized all of it. I also have a collet die so I will be neck sizing as I go along…..in fact I did neck size some prior to this last lot and it ejected more easily. At the time I never considered that neck sizing could make a difference in ejecting a fired case so I pulled the remaining bullets in this lot and I neck sized the fired ones and have loaded with the same load. Testing tomorrow so I will report back. I will also put a light coating of oil on the last one I fire to see of that makes a difference in filling out the chamber.

[LAGS]

If you do not have a Headspace Gauge and don't want to buy or rent one,
Just use a "New " Casing and layers of Scotch tape on the face of the case head.
It ain't Perfect.
But it can get you close headspace dimensions.

[TD1886]

Do as I said ligthly oil up a case with a moderate load and fire it. Then compare it along side an unfired factory round lining them up and paying attention the shoulder. Let us know what you find.

[Dante]

Well, just back from the range. I had three neck sized cases loaded with 13.5 gns. of Alliant 2400 and a 92 grain hollow point jacketed bullet. I fired the first and it was the same as last time….very hard extraction and a slightly protruding primer. So, I lightly oiled one and fired it and it ejected easily and did not have a protruding primer. I repeated the oiling with the last and it ejected easily with primer still flush. Following orders I then compared the oiled casings with a factory cartridge and found no noticeable difference in the neck area. Dave

[TD1886]

Well, just back from the range. I had three neck sized cases loaded with 13.5 gns. of Alliant 2400 and a 92 grain hollow point jacketed bullet. I fired the first and it was the same as last time….very hard extraction and a slightly protruding primer. So, I lightly oiled one and fired it and it ejected easily and did not have a protruding primer. I repeated the oiling with the last and it ejected easily with primer still flush. Following orders I then compared the oiled casings with a factory cartridge and found no noticeable difference in the neck area. Dave

Thanks for doing that. Those that were oiled and the primer stayed flush are the ones you want to set you sizer die for WITHOUT it setting the shoulder back. You're not out of the woods yet. We have to figure out why your chamber is rough because you not suppose to oil your ammo unless you have a WW2 Japanese 7.7 machine gun LOL. You need to make a pound cast or Cerosafe. I prefer the pound cast procedure.

[Dante]

OK! Now to reveal my ignorance….pound cast? The only cast I know is one I had on my leg when I was thirteen when I had an ankle repaired which polio had messed up. So there! Dave

[LAGS]

Pound cast is made by putting lead into the chamber and pound it in with a dowel to make it form to the chamber.
Then pound it out from the muzzle end.
It can be a little tricky the first few times you do it.
But is something you can do at home.
Did you check the headspace ?
That would be a good place to start.
Scotch tape is about .003" thick.
So the bolt should close easily with one layer on a unfired factory case, on the face of the case head.
The bolt should not close with 4 layers of tape on that new factory case.
If it does then the headspace is excessive.
If it has excessive headspace.
You can then shoot cases that are Neck Sized only and the shoulder is not moved back when resizing.

[uscra112]

A cast, pounded or otherwise, isn't going to show up the surface conditions that are causing his hard extraction. Evidence will be scraped off as the cast is extracted. What he needs is a borescope.

A pound cast might be useful as a lap to smooth out the chamber walls.

[TD1886]

A cast, pounded or otherwise, isn't going to show up the surface conditions that are causing his hard extraction. Evidence will be scraped off as the cast is extracted. What he needs is a borescope.

A pound cast might be useful as a lap to smooth out the chamber walls.

I disagree with that, the pound cast shows every detain. It's forced into the chamber walls, throat, leader, and rifling. It's not some little imperfection that giving this gentleman a hard time extracting his fired cases.

I'm going to explain how to do a pound cast. First clean the bore and chamber, leaving the chamber slightly oiled. Next prepare the case. I like to use a cast that is longer suitable for reloading. You have to have something inside the case that comes up the little past the base of the neck. Most fill the case to that point with molten let or alloy. If you use that way make sure it has a dead primer to prevent molten liquid escaping. I have a lathe so I lathe at steel rod as it's more solid. Next you need an appropiate core that will be tapped by the metal rod. I like to make my cores by drilling an oversized hole in a piece of oak or hardwood. I pour molten lead in it and let it cool. Then I wack that piece of wood over my anvil and the lead core pops up and I catch it in a box with rags in it. Next I put it in the lathe and turn the end that goes in the case neck so that it will just enter. Then the rest of it I machine so that it will slip into throat, bore. I do all this so that I only have to do minimum tapping with my light hammer. You lightly oil this lead core too. Now you can use a cast bullet from the correct size mould that let the bullet chamber and also slips into the neck. Most people do it that way, as my way is more elaborate. Then you need a suitable steel rod that is the largest that will fit in the bore and one that's not forced. I round of the corner on the end that will be against your lead core and polish it up some with fine sand paper. Then clean it. Don't use your cleaning rod!! Okay now we have the rod in the barrel and I like to put a mark right at the edge of the crown with a fine marker pen. This shows me how much I'm collapsing the lead core through pounding. Fold a towel few time and place it on the floor and your buttstock goes on that. You want a light hammer and definitaly not a sledge hammer! You begin your tappings. It won't feel solid at first because the lead core if giving some. As the core start to fill out the neck, chamber, throat, leade, and rifling the tapping begins to feel more solid. Also listen to the sound of your tapping. It will change sounds at the lead gets compressed, also pay attention to that marker pen line. I should be disappearing some in the muzzle. Another reason I lathe my core is it's let tapping. With the cast bullet you have to compress the lube groove. Takes more tapping and the rod goes down further. When you are sure it's done open your bolt and at the same time pull on the bolt handle to extract the case with pound cast and tapping on the rod at the same time. Capture it so it's not damaged. Now you will have a good representative of what we discussed you're measuring and it will last forever. CerroSafe has a time limit to where it's measurements are good, then it changes over time.

Now this sounds like a lot, believe me it's NOT. Once you've done it's a breeze from there on and hell you maybe do a pound cast of your son's pellet gun!!! Any questions just ask.

[Texas by God]

A bright light, good reading glasses, and a dental mirror can tell you a lot about a Krag or Lee Enfield chamber- because it’s more exposed than other actions.
I may have missed it, but what does factory ammunition do when fired?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[TD1886]

A bright light, good reading glasses, and a dental mirror can tell you a lot about a Krag or Lee Enfield chamber- because it’s more exposed than other actions.
I may have missed it, but what does factory ammunition do when fired?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah I was wondering that myself. Why doesn't he give the bore and chamber a good scrubbing and
then look at the chamber with a bright light shining down the barrel. On a Krag type action you can see the chamber better because it's not hidden like on a Mauser.

[uscra112]

Something that is simple and might be rewarding would be to coat a loaded round with Dykem or just Magic Marker ink, fire it and extract it. Roughness in the chamber that is preventing extraction may be revealed.

BTW I stand by my post #15. Extracting the pound cast is going to wipe away the surface roughness information you're looking for. OTOH a Cerrosafe cast will shrink a bit if you don't rush to extract it, thus preserving some of that information.

Spinning coarse crocus cloth will leave circumferential scratches which will impede extraction. Must follow up with much longer polishing with fine abrasive, say, 600 or 800.

A fired case can make a good lap. Drill out the primer for a 1/4-20 threaded rod. Spin slowly and reverse direction frequently.

N.B. I've got a Norwegian in 6.5x55 myself. Shot it very little after I got it; never had any trouble. Been back in the safe for at least 15 years now.

[TD1886]

Something that is simple and might be rewarding would be to coat a loaded round with Dykem or just Magic Marker ink, fire it and extract it. Roughness in the chamber that is preventing extraction may be revealed.

BTW I stand by my post #15. Extracting the pound cast is going to wipe away the surface roughness information you're looking for. OTOH a Cerrosafe cast will shrink a bit if you don't rush to extract it, thus preserving some of that information.

Spinning coarse crocus cloth will leave circumferential scratches which will impede extraction. Must follow up with much longer polishing with fine abrasive, say, 600 or 800.

A fired case can make a good lap. Drill out the primer for a 1/4-20 threaded rod. Spin slowly and reverse direction frequently.

N.B. I've got a Norwegian in 6.5x55 myself. Shot it very little after I got it; never had any trouble. Been back in the safe for at least 15 years now.

Firt off the pound cast doesn't do the chamber. It does from the neck forward. In his case it's not a solution for his problem. What's puzzling is when he oiled his cases like I suggested they extracted normal. I just hoping his chamber doesn't have a swell in it. Remember it a Krag not a M96 Swede Mauser. That Mauser has more steel around the barrel and action. I'm sure if he cleans it and looks at the chamber he should be able to see something.