What do I have? Antique, or Franken-Gun?

[TheAbe]

Bought my first muzzleloader on GB last week, and it arrived today. It was advertised as a .40 cal, ~1850 target rifle, likely for Picket bullets. Lock works only intermittently, and there are some other issues, but now that I have it, some of the parts seem to not quite match (perhaps later modifications or add-on’s?) though overall, I’m pretty pleased with it as a project.

However, anyone know why my bore is hexagonal? Or more about what I might actually have here? Is that just how rifling looked back in the day?

[Rockingkj]

Got one with muzzle like that. When scoped really looks like regular bore. Mine shoots just fine.
Figure 1840-50’s vintage. Take the lock off and give it a good cleaning likely to work fine.

[Gtrubicon]

I like it!

[TheAbe]

Got it. Yes, that looks very similar. For removing the lock and stock, just start removing screws? I was going to avoid the one holding the hammer on, but those on the tang and so forth seemed like fair game.

[nicholst55]

It appears that there are two screws running from left-to-right that are holding your lock in place. Don't mess with the hammer screw for routine disassembly.

[TheAbe]

So perhaps if I remove the barrel/tang those screws will become exposed? The other side of the stock is solid wood...
Also, Rockingkj, what load / projectile do you use in yours, if you shoot it?

[TheAbe]

I stand corrected: there was one screw that went all the way through the stock to the lock plate. Upon removal of the lock and the barrel, I have concluded that the stock was originally built I to a flintlock, and later re-used with a new barrel and percussion lock. The plate itself is pressure-fit into the stock inlet, and there are the cuts in the stock that don’t line up with shapes in the current lock. That being said, does anyone recognize the maker mark on the plate and lock internals? As previously suggested, it appears the lock will be fine with some cleaning, lubrication, tightening of loose screws, and perhaps a bit of filing/debris removal around the triggers.
My bigger concern is the breach plug. Should it have been loose once the tang screws were removed? I was able to easily remove it by hand once the barrel was out, and it just seems....I sufficient. Thoughts?
Incidentally, the rifling looks good even though the bore has a lot of dust and dirt inside.

[Rockingkj]

I also would be concerned that the breach plug so easily unscrewed. Maybe one of the gunsmith fellows can weigh in on that. I would like a firm snug fit before I would be comfortable shooting it.

[Rockingkj]

Unless the lock has been replaced thinking this was a percussion gun from the beginning. If the lock had been flint there would be some extra holes in the lock plate. Appears the drum has been replaced and that’s normal in the life of an old rifle.

[725]

No marks or names under the wood or elsewhere on the lock?

[TheAbe]

It didn’t show well in the original photo, but there are some marks on some of the lock parts. Let’s see if I can make it clearer...

It’s just to the right of the upper most screw and then on the lock just to the left of that screw, a sort of stylized S or K or hourglass...

[Gtrubicon]

How hard was it to remove the breech plug? Are there index marks on it anywhere? I’ve read many accounts of original rifles that had very easy to remove breech plugs. I wouldn’t let that deter me. I’d clean and lightly oil that lock, re install the breech plug with anti seize and enjoy that beautiful gun for what it is.

[Rockingkj]

So perhaps if I remove the barrel/tang those screws will become exposed? The other side of the stock is solid wood...
Also, Rockingkj, what load / projectile do you use in yours, if you shoot it?

I call mine a 38 although technically it about a .40. I shoot .375 round ball with .20 patch. Fairly mild load of 30 gr of 3f. In the muzzle loader thread there was pics and description of mine under “old eye candy”. I posted again on that thread so you can easily find it. There is information about bores there you might find interesting

[pworley1]

That is an unusual and interesting find.

[TheAbe]

How hard was it to remove the breech plug? Are there index marks on it anywhere? I’ve read many accounts of original rifles that had very easy to remove breech plugs. I wouldn’t let that deter me. I’d clean and lightly oil that lock, re install the breech plug with anti seize and enjoy that beautiful gun for what it is.

Not difficult at all, as in it was wobbly once the tang screws were removed. I think that may be a design feature, as the tang was held under tension with the screws in, making the breach plug unable to turn under that axial torque. No index marks that I can see, and the tang/plug appears to be cast and forged from a single bar and then the threads were cut and the flash hole created. Since the whole thing screws down to the stock, where there is a tight inlet for the tang, I think it was presumed that if someone managed to get the rifle fully assembled, it would automatically be indexed as both plug and barrel only fit the stock one way, to a tight tolerance.
By anti-seize, did you mean lock-tite? I was thinking I’d want something to secure it and seal the threads while protecting the threads, but which I could remove with some force if I were so inclined. Then again, maybe some sort of pipe thread sealant would be best. If this setup actually holds pressure as-is it makes breach plug removal for cleaning a breeze.

[Rockingkj]

Not lock tite. Anti seize is a product like used in breech plugs on in-line muzzleloaders or nipple threads. Keeps the threads from rusting in place for lack of a better term. Allows for sealant but easier removal when desired.

[ascast]

NAPA has an "ANTI SEIZE" product in a blue gray bottle. Great for any threads you want to get apart in 10 to 100 years. Very odd with such a loose breach plug. Should have been fouled by black powder residue if nothing else. nice piece Enjoy

[dogrunner]

I have personally never seen a breech plug as loose as you describe. "Wobbly" tells me that the threads are either badly worn or mismatched.............I strongly suggest you have a competent gunsmith check that piece out prior to using it!

[TheAbe]

Not lock tite. Anti seize is a product like used in breech plugs on in-line muzzleloaders or nipple threads. Keeps the threads from rusting in place for lack of a better term. Allows for sealant but easier removal when desired.

I’ll have to look for that. Will likely need for the nipple Threads as well.

[TheAbe]

I have personally never seen a breech plug as loose as you describe. "Wobbly" tells me that the threads are either badly worn or mismatched.............I strongly suggest you have a competent gunsmith check that piece out prior to using it!

A good suggestion, and one well taken. Thanks!