Winchester 400 Legend

[Bmi48219]

What do you think of the new cartridge? I’ve yet to see / shoot one but as with everything new and improved, I wonder how much of the introductory hype is marketing vs factual. After a century and a half of developing metallic cartridges, manufacturers must be running low on superior performance comparisons.
I do like the comparative simplicity of straight wall cartridges, both from a reloading perspective and feeding from a box-type magazine. But neither of these virtues are game changers. It does work in the AR-15 platform. I don’t know if it will be accurate enough for 300 yards shots with the only bullet weight offered so far, but that’s not to say a lighter or sabot projectile couldn’t improve accuracy at distance. The COL looks to be similar to a 30 carbine so it certainly could develop into a rifle & pistol cartridge.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.400_Legend

[Ajohns]

The nitch is being filled for the straight wall cartridges. I don't suppose it's bad at all.
Should hopefully put some more bullets out for 38/40 shooters also.

[fixit]

I find it annoying that they appear to be going after bullets diameters that aren't in common use for the application.
355 for the 350, requiring a new series of bullets, and .408 for the 400. Sounds like an attempt at expanding sales. Risky!

[CWME]

SAAMI drawing is showing .4005?

[fixit]

My bad! I'm not sure where I got the .408.... Still, is the .4005 a standard size? I've not looked at the .40 calibers.

[M-Tecs]

https://www.outdoorlife.com/guns/winchester-400-legend/

[Hickok]

Kinda' like a 10mm magnum!

[TurnipEaterDown]

Kinda' like a 10mm magnum!

There was a 10mm magnum, but that's not to dismiss the reference. How about 10mm super magnum, or 10mm maximum...
Wildcatters will take down to...???

[skeet1]

How much difference is there between the Winchester .401 Self Loading that was designed around 1910 and the "new" 400 Legend?

[DougGuy]

How much difference is there between the Winchester .401 Self Loading that was designed around 1910 and the "new" 400 Legend?

The guys that were around then aren't around now so the 400 is new..

On paper compared to the 350L and 450BM the 400L looks like it hits a completely practical spot between the two and taking the best parts of each and sticking them in the 400L. Might turn out to be the best large hog round in the Winchester catalog.

[Fishman]

According to the Outdoor Life information, it doesn't appear to offer much of an increase in energy over the 350 except at shorter ranges where the 350 has enough for deer-sized game anyway. The same reason I haven't abandoned the .300 blackout for the 350 or similar, because at the ranges I shoot deer, the extra power isn't needed. That said, it is an interesting round for close range hunting in straight-walled only states.

[Jedman]

Several articles that I have read state the bullet dia. is .401 ?

Jedman

[rbuck351]

Fortunately I can use most any cartridge I want in Montana for deer hunting. If I lived in in a state with straight wall cartridge rules, I would use my Puma 92 in 454 Casull. If I thought I needed more, I would probably chamber a rifle for 460 S&W and load a 250 bullet. That should give plenty of range and knock down. There just aren't a lot of empty niches left anymore.

[Jungle Dave]

I find it annoying that they appear to be going after bullets diameters that aren't in common use for the application.
355 for the 350, requiring a new series of bullets, and .408 for the 400. Sounds like an attempt at expanding sales. Risky!

I agree. I'm staying away from all of it just because of that. There is no reason to not use bullet diameters that are proven already, and might I add, sorely needed by many. In my mind, a .360 is the 9.3's, not .358. I was looking forward to seeing more 9.3 bullets to use, and barrels most importantly, but, oh well. I have no idea about the .400 "legend" yet, as I've not even looked at it. But I knew right away there would not be any .409's or .411's to come of it. I will continue with my rant because I have to let this out, and then I'll feel better. What is with the names? "Buckhammer", "Legend"? The only legends I know of already exist and ARE legends, so they can shove that marketing where the sun won't shine. Lets speak of high pressures as well. 50,000 psi range in these little things. I guess it's the marketing that sets me off, it's so blatant, and the fact that they feel they must re-invent the wheel instead of producing something that is tried and true. Not wasting a dime on any of it.
p.s.-I saw where that new .400 was .4005 bullet....I don't know....and don't care, to be honest.
I suppose the ammunition packaging will have all the new super-duper 3-D images and flashy things. It's hard to find what I need on the isle anymore due to the flashing, I have to look close for the numbers before succumbing to blindness.

[Bmi48219]

……There just aren't a lot of empty niches left anymore.

That’s the truth!

[cwlongshot]

Hahaha. Some of you guys completely miss the point

I completely understand one argument about not making enough of what we have.

But the "Straight Wall" Rules are very new and as for Cartritages, its a relatively UNPLOWED field! The 350 & 450 and a hand ful of what we HAVE HAD in hand gun stuff.

CW

[charlie b]

How much difference is there between the Winchester .401 Self Loading that was designed around 1910 and the "new" 400 Legend?

The 401 Self Loading is 1.5" case length, 39kpsi, 200gn, 2141fps, 20" bbl. .400 Legend is 1.65", 45kpsi, 215gn, 2250fps (barrel length not listed, but, since it is designed for an AR I would guess 16").

[beltfed]

I wonder if a person can make 401 SL brass from the 400 L brass?
beltfed/arnie

[Kerry Conklin]

I am going all in, I am ordering my barrel today 07/21/2023 or Monday, I am waiting on a call back from Mos-tek about what handguard to send for them to build and test fire the upper. They offer all the headspacing and fitment with some of their parts and mine so I am going to take advantage of that. I already have the 350L, 450BM, and the 50BW so this will fit in pretty nicely with my staightwall AR family. Robs bullets makes all my powder coated projectiles for these others so I imagine he will make some 40/10mm for the 400L as well. He is really good at making them to my specific OD if its other then what he advertises. He makes my 465GN 50BW to .502 for me as my barrel likes that OD.
Anyway, I think I am going with the 20" barrel unless they have a better suggestion.
Does anyone have an load data on the 400L, I would like to use Lil' Gun, I use that in my others listed above. (Yes, I know some folks dont like it, but I have a lot of experience with it so I know to avoid the pitfalls with it.)

[TD1886]

Can't wrap my brain around this one. The 450 Bushmaster is the way to go.