HR Handi R 45-70

[Dieselhorses]

So, I decided to sell my S&W 500, and in exchange for the ammo I supplied with it, I am now the owner of an HR 45-70 Gov. SB2 w/22" barrel. So, upon referencing some load data in Lyman 51st, I discovered 3 different sections. One for the Springfield 1873, one for the Winchester/Marlin and one for the Ruger no. 1 & 3. I was told by a friend who has reloaded for quite some time, to NOT use the Ruger loads because of the pressure only the Ruger can handle.

If you reload for 45-70 and own a handi-rifle, just point me in the right direction, pls & thx!

[725]

You'll get varied responses for this but even if the H&R doesn't disassemble with Ruger loads, you still won't want to hold on to it when it goes off. I've loaded to the H&R and, frankly, anything beyond trapdoor is unnecessary. Lots of good boolts and bullets shoot well in that gun. I am happy with between 300 & 400 grain bolts. So many of them do well. My favorite is from an old group buy (IIRC - 460-420 but I could be way off on that). Flat meplat, about 415 grains, big lube grooves. I've given it to several other in my area and they jokingly refer to it as the "matrix bullet", because it just turns the life force off on game. Accurate, too. The Gould bullet is good. Anything around 400 / 405 grains work well. Just find accuracy around the top end of trapdoor levels and you'll have all the fun you can stand. Good luck.

[pworley1]

The Handi rifle is a strong action but your shoulder will let you know what level of load you need. Load 10 450-500g of each level and by the time you get through them you will know.

[elmacgyver0]

Personally, I would not even shoot the hot loads in the Ruger.

[Midohhntr]

I've had a Handi-rifle in 45-70 since 2014 when Ohio first went to straight wall cartridges and used the Hornady lever revolution ammo.
Now I have learned to download a bit and use the Noe 315 RF loaded to 1300-1500 fps. Evan that is more than enough. The deer don't need water buffalo level loads.

[Head Shot]

Hello:
I can from experience tell you that the Handi Rifle can and does handle the ruger hi pressure loads just fine.
And i can also tell you that what others already stated that recoil can be right up there and beyond for some is true.
I personally am loading hot with a 250 gr hornady monoflex spire type red plastic tip slug not so much for punch but for flatter trajectory further out .
I load for accuracy at the higher velocities if i can get the groups so that i can for example sight in at a given yardage so that i can aim dead on from muzzle to the best trajectory that will still land in what i refer to as PBR (Point Blank Range)
Meaning say a 8 inch kill zone for example so ill set scope so its hits no higher than 4 inches but yet no lower than 4 inches and compute how far that may be per the loads specs etc.
So as an example the 45-70 hot load might say shoot to dead on center but still be plus or minus 4 inches of bullseye kill zone from muzzle to say 300 yards as an example but still stays within the 4 low to 4 high 8 inch kill zone out to say as just an example here 300 yards.
No hold over just aim straight dead on let the slug do its job by landing in the 8 inch kill zone.
I have a computer ballistics program that gives me the info after ive found the best accuracy at the fastest fps loading but yet within sami chamber pressures.
Head Shot

[lar45]

The SB2 was supposed to be rated for the higher pressure rounds like 30-06, the SB1 wasn't made of the same materials, or heat treated the same... Atleast that's what I remember from way back when they were still being made...
I corrected the above numbers.
Sorry for the misinformation

[Michael J. Spangler]

It depends on the frame. One is much stronger than the other but I don’t recall which. I’m sure a little googling will help.

I can say I’ve fired full snuff loads in a 500 S&W H&R Handi Rifle. So the right frame can take the pressure for sure.

That being said, as noted above, in that light rifle you’re going to give up before the gun does. Wether it’s the soft frame or the heat treated frame. ��

[Dieselhorses]

It depends on the frame. One is much stronger than the other but I don’t recall which. I’m sure a little googling will help.

I can say I’ve fired full snuff loads in a 500 S&W H&R Handi Rifle. So the right frame can take the pressure for sure.

That being said, as noted above, in that light rifle you’re going to give up before the gun does. Wether it’s the soft frame or the heat treated frame. ��

I did some research and was actually explained on CB’s.

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...s-a-Difference!


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[Jal5]

In mine I shoot trapdoor type loads. Recoil is about the same as a 20 ga. Slug. 350 gr lead or 405 gr both will kill deer to 100 yds if I do my part. Good fun!


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[Dieselhorses]

The SB1 was supposed to be rated for the higher pressure rounds like 30-06, the SB2 wasn't made of the same materials, or heat treated the same... Atleast that's what I remember from way back when they were still being made...

As per link I quoted further down and many other sources, SB1 is mainly for shotgun barrels, and .357 and .44 caliber. From what I’ve read the SB1 is cast and the SB2
is forged.


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[Dieselhorses]

Hello:
I can from experience tell you that the Handi Rifle can and does handle the ruger hi pressure loads just fine.
And i can also tell you that what others already stated that recoil can be right up there and beyond for some is true.
I personally am loading hot with a 250 gr hornady monoflex spire type red plastic tip slug not so much for punch but for flatter trajectory further out .
I load for accuracy at the higher velocities if i can get the groups so that i can for example sight in at a given yardage so that i can aim dead on from muzzle to the best trajectory that will still land in what i refer to as PBR (Point Blank Range)
Meaning say a 8 inch kill zone for example so ill set scope so its hits no higher than 4 inches but yet no lower than 4 inches and compute how far that may be per the loads specs etc.
So as an example the 45-70 hot load might say shoot to dead on center but still be plus or minus 4 inches of bullseye kill zone from muzzle to say 300 yards as an example but still stays within the 4 low to 4 high 8 inch kill zone out to say as just an example here 300 yards.
No hold over just aim straight dead on let the slug do its job by landing in the 8 inch kill zone.
I have a computer ballistics program that gives me the info after ive found the best accuracy at the fastest fps loading but yet within sami chamber pressures.
Head Shot

Just watched a YT video where a fellow was driving the Hornady Monoflex through almost the same hole!


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[Dieselhorses]

Thanks for everyones replies! Will get a box of factory to check scope and than start developing. But first have to put the icing on this rabbit hole and get dies, brass, mold etc. I successfully loaded for the 500, I can do it for this one.


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[Walks]

I've had and H&R SB-2 in .223Rem for almost 30yrs. Had a .45-70 and .30-30 bbl's added a few years later.
I was used to recoil from a Trapdoor Carbine, the H&R .45-70 was much heavier. I tried the M1886/M1895 loads. Nope not for me.
I stick to light loads, after 50yrs of Trap shooting, My old shoulder prefers it.

[murf205]

Don't worry, the Handi Rifle will tell you when to stop. When it detaches a retina and you have a really difficult time keeping the fore end in your hand, that's about it. My son is a big man and he is strong as dragon breath, but when he shot mine, he said "find someone you hate and GIVE it to them"! He has a 458 Win Ruger and I swear the HR 45/70 is more painful WITH full house loads. Trapdoor speeds will shoot through a buffalo anyway. Good luck

[Head Shot]

The SB1 was supposed to be rated for the higher pressure rounds like 30-06, the SB2 wasn't made of the same materials, or heat treated the same... Atleast that's what I remember from way back when they were still being made...

Hello:
CORECTION RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED
The SB1 is low pressure receiver for shotgun and yes even the 357 mag and 44 mag but thats the only exception im aware of.
The SB2 receiver is high pressure receiver for the 30-06 and 45-70 larger cal rifle cartridges.
Head Shot

[Dieselhorses]

I've had and H&R SB-2 in .223Rem for almost 30yrs. Had a .45-70 and .30-30 bbl's added a few years later.
I was used to recoil from a Trapdoor Carbine, the H&R .45-70 was much heavier. I tried the M1886/M1895 loads. Nope not for me.
I stick to light loads, after 50yrs of Trap shooting, My old shoulder prefers it.

Really nice having that option to add barrels/calibers! As far as 45-70, will stick to moderate loads which I'm sure will drop a deer at 100.

[Dieselhorses]

Hello:
CORECTION RESPECTFULLY SUBMITTED
The SB1 is low pressure receiver for shotgun and yes even the 357 mag and 44 mag but thats the only exception im aware of.
The SB2 receiver is high pressure receiver for the 30-06 and 45-70 larger cal rifle cartridges.
Head Shot

What ballistics program do you use? Yes I'm glad I got the SB2. I wonder if they make a .50 barrel?

[Skipper]

Years ago I called NEF about handloading the 45-70. The nice lady on the phone said "we rate our rifles with the lever action data".

[wallacem]

First I need to know how you know yur frame is a SB2? Did you read it on the barrel? If so, that means nothing. You have to remove the stock to find out which frame you have. If the part of the frame that fits to the stock is hollow, it is a SB2. If it is solid it is a SB1. This is important. Wallace