Cream of Wheat in Bottle Neck cases?

[Jungle Dave]

I had to use the dacron back when I had my .450 no.2 NE double. I can't remember the grains of dacron it took, I guess I still have it written down somewhere, but it's just enough to not have airspace. You definitely do not want airspace between a filler and a bullet. That's where dacron comes in, as it expands fluffy. Never had a single problem after years of shooting it with it's load of RL-15. A pleasant cartridge to shoot and low pressure compared to the others.

[GregLaROCHE]

I use COW as a filler with BP in both straight wall cartridges and muzzle loaders. However, my gut feeling tells me to never try it with bottle neck cartridges.

[Rockindaddy]

I have always used Kapok out of old life vests! It is light and fluffy. The stuff packs easy in big cases to take up space and keep the powder charge up against the primer. Kapok does not melt and does not make a mess. When fire forming 348 Winchester cases into 11mm Swiss Vetterli rounds or 11mm Grau; the kapok works good.

[fgd135]

If I have less than a full-to-neck load of BP in my bottleneck black powder cartridges, I now use foam backer rod to fill the space. It's easy to work with, and inexpensive, and provides enough of a platform to support grease cookies in the neck below paper patch bullets. There's no need for a thin card wad over the powder, saving a step over using COW, and it won't settle like COW and become a solid heavy mass when fired.
Do not discount shallow-appearing shoulders in BP cartridges like the BII; one of the reasons I switched to FBR was because of circumferential shoulder cracks resulting from using what turned out to be improper filler materials below the necks of BII cases.

[toot]

I have used TOILET PAPER or TISUE PAPER for over 60 yrs with out any problems for taking up the space in bottle neck cases.

[indian joe]

I feel like a heathen here - never used fillers in any cartridges
My blackpowder loading usually am trying to get a little more powder in rather than less - have never loaded for anything with excess capacity like a 450/577 but there my first approach would be to go to a FG or even cannon grade powder to quieten things down some. That and reducing compression to a minimum. If it still boots too bad ? add some weight to the gun - that dont work, sell it and get something more suitable.

Smokeless ? the manuals will tell what powder - I always looked for the slowest powder that would give best velocity - that gets us closest to full case - dont need fillers - Saving pennies on fast burning powders in large capacity cases is a mugs game I reckon - and then to have to fool around with pillow stuffing to make it work ? - play it at your own risk - I figure theres other things more fun to do.

[Boz330]

I feel like a heathen here - never used fillers in any cartridges
My blackpowder loading usually am trying to get a little more powder in rather than less - have never loaded for anything with excess capacity like a 450/577 but there my first approach would be to go to a FG or even cannon grade powder to quieten things down some. That and reducing compression to a minimum. If it still boots too bad ? add some weight to the gun - that dont work, sell it and get something more suitable.

Smokeless ? the manuals will tell what powder - I always looked for the slowest powder that would give best velocity - that gets us closest to full case - dont need fillers - Saving pennies on fast burning powders in large capacity cases is a mugs game I reckon - and then to have to fool around with pillow stuffing to make it work ? - play it at your own risk - I figure theres other things more fun to do.

I have messed with the 577-450 for several years and that case holds a lot of BP if you fill it up and the Martini is a pretty light rifle. The original load was 85gr of BP with a wool filler. Best groups I ever got were from a case full of Canon grade. Problem was that the gun was so fouled after 5 shots you had to clean it. The recoil wasn't bad with that either. Kapok works well as a filler but I never got good accuracy with it.

Bob.

[martinibelgian]

I feel like a heathen here - never used fillers in any cartridges
My blackpowder loading usually am trying to get a little more powder in rather than less - have never loaded for anything with excess capacity like a 450/577 but there my first approach would be to go to a FG or even cannon grade powder to quieten things down some. That and reducing compression to a minimum. If it still boots too bad ? add some weight to the gun - that dont work, sell it and get something more suitable.

Smokeless ? the manuals will tell what powder - I always looked for the slowest powder that would give best velocity - that gets us closest to full case - dont need fillers - Saving pennies on fast burning powders in large capacity cases is a mugs game I reckon - and then to have to fool around with pillow stuffing to make it work ? - play it at your own risk - I figure theres other things more fun to do.

When shooting 577-450, you don't even think about compression, you look for ways to keep the powder charge reasonable. FWIW, the only filler I use is air. 80-85 grs of Fg, grease cookie, 530gr .468 bullet. And no, they don't explode. FWIW, a full case without any compression would be close to 110grs of powder, and it hurts, I tried it... Also shoots lousy.

[indian joe]

When shooting 577-450, you don't even think about compression, you look for ways to keep the powder charge reasonable. FWIW, the only filler I use is air. 80-85 grs of Fg, grease cookie, 530gr .468 bullet. And no, they don't explode. FWIW, a full case without any compression would be close to 110grs of powder, and it hurts, I tried it... Also shoots lousy.

Did the old original foil cases hold that big charge or were they less capacity because of how they were made?

We used to see Martini cases around the shoots turned from solid brass and they had a straight cylinder for the powder charge -just bored same diameter as the neck - I think held about 75 grains.

Make your own powder and make it screened rather than pucked - best of all worlds - full case charge will be around 85 grains (weight) , 8 - 12 mesh (cannon granulation) grains are easiest to make, use decent ingredients and it will foul less than any commercial powder, once you get the gear together - cost is about 2 bucks a pound or less -- win - win - win all the way home!!!!!

[EdZ KG6UTS]

I have never used a filler, but how would using those puffed rice shipping peanuts work?

Wasn't Quaker Puffed Rice "Shot From Guns"?

EdZ (reference to old B&W TV commercials) ~8^)

[racepres]

Wasn't Quaker Puffed Rice "Shot From Guns"?

EdZ (reference to old B&W TV commercials) ~8^)

Great... Now that diddy is in my Head... I guess I do Not remember if B&W or Color... For Me...B&W as we did Not own a Color TV!!!
Don't remember watching the TV at Neighbors!!! Oh...Maybe McHale's Navy!!!!

[jonp]

I would not use them. They are waaaay too dense. The whole idea with things like dacron is that you can take a very small amount (I use 1/4 to 1/2 grain) and pull on it until it is very spread out and fluffy, then slide it into the case above the powder before seating the bullet. It provides virtually no resistance to pressure and readily burns with the powder, but still keeps the powder close to the primer.

Aren't they made of cornstarch? I would think they would work but I've always used Cream of Wheat.

[elmacgyver0]

Quaker Oats are shot from guns, the guns are what make them good to eat.
I guess that slogan would not go over so well these days.
I did love those commercials.

[elmacgyver0]

I have not used fillers, but how would those rice packing peanuts work for fillers?
For the green crowd, they are biodegradable.

[veeman]

Not all packing peanut are created equal. many are not biodegradable. I've seen some just melt into a glob and makes a mess of the bore. I myself use laundry lint from a load of towels.

[Washington1331]

Rob from the "British Muzzleloaders" YouTube page has quite a few videos on the use of fillers in both bottleneck and straight wall cartridges. For the 577-450 Martini Henry, he recommended a quarter of a standard cotton ball. For the 577 Snider, it was corn meal.

I'd take a look at his videos.

[Gobeyond]

Without a filler to lightly take up a little space how else you going to work up a load of black powder. You have to reduce some. Wads and grease cookie help a little. But 20 grains Ffg for a collar button. Just seat on top of powder way down in case. Full cases are not always accurate. As are not max loads. It’s about conserving powder sometimes. Everybody has their favorite. Everybody here is safe. I prefer a little tuft of Dacron for smokeless and BP. Below the neck.

[Larry Gibson]

I have pressure tested the use of COW in straight walled (45-60) and bottle necked cartridges (30-06 and 35 Remington. The pressures were dramatically higher. I do not recommend the use of COW as a filler. Dacron, yes.