Poll: The 32 Retinue

[rintinglen]

Well. I can affirm it goes bang and likes 98 Grain boolits! Unfortunately, I only had 50 rounds of 32 S&W Long with me--a mismarked box led me into mistaking some 380's for what i wanted to be shooting. But It shot the 314-100 MP boolits into 2 inches from a shaky rest, as well as the 32-98 SWC. I had high hopes for the 32-98 MP DEWC, but I didn't shoot it well. Whether due to the ammo, the gun, the weather or the nut behind the gun who can say. (But my money is on the loose nut...). Next week I hope to give it a more thorough test.

[Green Frog]

rintinglen,
Personal Message incoming re: Lee moulds.
Froggie

[rintinglen]

Had a chance to run a few more rounds down range--that Pseudo-16 has a very good trigger. I just wish there was a bit more daylight between the rear sight notch and the front sight blade. I am getting horizontal dispersion that I am sure is the fault of the operator. Groups look like Rosie O'Donnell--wider than they are tall. My surmise about the RCBS 32-98 SWC turned out to be pretty much dead on. It seems to want to shoot them. I'll try them from off the rest next time.

[Green Frog]

rintinglen,

You might be able to open up the width of the slot on your rear sight blade by a thousandth or two with a Swiss file. Alternatively a narrower front sight blade could be installed. Like you, I need some daylight on the sides of my front sight. Unless the sight blade is very wide though, I’d probably go with opening the rear sight slot… my old eyes can’t find a narrow front sight very well.

Froggie

[Outpost75]

Latest find. A 1943 Colt Official Police in .32-20

[Outpost75]

Latest find. A 1943 Colt Official Police in .32-20

[rintinglen]

Love those grips on that OP. Mine is a five inch, but not as nice as yours.

[Green Frog]

Ay to guys, feed my inferiority complex! I keep coming up short on DA 32-20s. Those both look pretty good to me. How would you compare strength and durability of those Colts to the late pre War issues of the S&W 32-20 M&P revolvers?

Froggie

[square butte]

Ay to guys, feed my inferiority complex! I keep coming up short on DA 32-20s. Those both look pretty good to me. How would you compare strength and durability of those Colts to the late pre War issues of the S&W 32-20 M&P revolvers?

Froggie

I've been wondering about that myself for years - I think Outpost75 says the hardened Colt may be better... But not sure what the serial or date would be for those Colts

[rintinglen]

My Colt out shoots its running mate by a fair piece, but probably more due to the better sights than any intrinsic superiority of the gun. (The Smith dates to cerca 1920, the Colt to 1926.) Both of mine are heat treated. Smith 32-20's over 81,327 or some such number have heat treated cylinders and Colt started heat treating cylinders in 1908 on the Model 1909 Colts at the insistence of the Army, though when it spread to the rest of their models I have never been able to ascertain. I have read that they started heat treatments from biggest to smallest frame size, but I have not found a definitive statement of serial cut-offs like those that exist for the Smith and Wesson Models. It is interesting to note that the first guns that Smith heat treated were the 1917 45 ACP's, again at the insistence of Uncle Sam.

I will say that both like the RCBS 32-98 SWC a bunch! Not going to win any PPC matches with either, but the groups are noticeably smaller than my other 32 boolits can produce in those guns. 4.5 grains of Unique shoots very well. The Colt feels larger and the cylinder walls are thicker and stronger thanks both to the offset cylinder catch, and the greater cylinder diameter. The Colt cylinder is a smidge more than a 1/16th of an inch larger in diameter than the Smith.'s The DA pull is better in the Smith, while the Single Action pulls are pretty much equally good. I would bet the farm on the timing of the Smith outlasting the Colt's. IME, a v-spring Colt starts spitting lead after 3,000 to 5,000 rounds, while my Model 17 has fired 4 or 5 times that many and is still solid. But at my age, I am unlikely to outlast any decent gun, so that has become a moot point for me.

[square butte]

Thank You Sir - Awesome post and assessment of two fine revolvers

[Rodfac]

Rintinglen & Outpost75's posts regarding their Colt and Smith .32-20's, brought to mind a 1905 S&W Hand Ejector 4th Type in .32-20, that I found at a Louisville gun show in 1997. That day there were two nearly identical guns for sale on the table, differing only in caliber: one in .32 Long & the other a .32-20. Both were in close to new condition & with the same bbl. length (wish they'd been 4 inchers). Priced the same, IIRC, I paid $350 for this one.

Ken Water's "Pet Loads" chapter on the .32-20 in a revolver had perked my interest years earlier and I'd subsequently been, off and on, idly looking for one to give the caliber a try in a handgun. This one is a pretty good match for his, being virtually the same make and model. Too I've always had an interest in rifle/handgun dual purpose cartridges, and already having a .32-20 Winchester, this Smith purchase seemed like a good idea.

Loading for it, I had far less difficulty than Ken had written about, finding good loads with Bullseye, Win 231 and Unique and generally I found little of the group destroying velocity excursions he had alluded to.

I already had Lyman molds 311008 & 311316GC (for the Winchester) plus a 500 count supply of Hornady's swagged LSWC's used in a .32 Long Smith, and used all to good effect with target level charge weights of Bullseye and Win 231. I did not try any of the then available JHP's, however. I also have RCBS's 32-98 LSWC which really does well in my Ruger & Smith .32 H&R's and a Smith .32 Long...have to try that out for sure.

Slugging the HE's throats, I got 0.313"-0.314", with one chamber that measured the same but which occasionally threw it's bullet wide of the groups (low generally), & which I attributed to Water's suggestion that powder location was the cause for dispersion due to the small charges involved. (3.1-3.4 gr of Bullseye and a bit more with Win 231).

At the time, I was using R-P brass with very thin, easily wrinkled necks, which may have been contributed to Ken's frustration with velocity excursions. Currently, I've got a life-time supply of Starline .32-20 hulls which I feed through a venerable Winchester 92. I'm also using the good Starline brass to form .25-20 cases for another Winchester. The newer brass seems a good bit thicker through the neck area than the older R-P and might make sizing/seating a bit easier...!! might have to revisit some of my old load data and give it a try. I've not spent any time with the old gun in well over a decade...time to change that!

The Smith in question dates to the 1938 production run if the guys over on the S&W forum are correct. Here are the obligatory pics...no real visible wear but for a thin line on the muzzle and a cpl miniscule handling nicks. The grip adapter, BTW, is a Pachmayr Gun Works model, and the field holster is one that I made up before the turn of the century (love that phrase).

Best regards, Rod

[Head Shot]

Hello:
Spose i can fess up too.
I have a Arminius HW5T double action revolver in a 32 s&w long.
Its not exactly top of the line like smith & wesson but its actually pretty decent for what it is .
But what actually got my attention on this 32 thread was im in the process of repairing a stevens favorite single shot drop block type looking rifle in 32 long colt rimfire.
Ive already repaired the trigger spring and hammer spring replaced the link pins to take the slop out of the block along with the flat band block tensioning spring so that's all done now.
My next move is to decide on reforming 32 sw long brass to 32 long colt brass specs and eighter do the 27 cal nail gun blank conversion or mod to centerfire which would mean moving the fire pin up to hit a center fire primer rather than hit the rim which a 27 cal power nail gun load would allow.
Sorta leaning towards making a longer link that would allow the drop block to travel just a tad higher so f pin would hit center rather than rim.
But haven't looked into that just yet.
What got me was the little petite rifle was in such nice shape just needed some repair and making flat band springs and shaping then tempering so stiff isnt all that hard to do so when the old gentleman at the gun show table said it was a shame no one wanted it cuz couldn't get all the parts and he offered it to me for $125 i took it.
So yeah quess ive been bit by the 32 cal myself
Head Shot

[uscra112]

Longer link works for the Hopkins & Allen 932, but won't for the Favorite. An interesting new approach for Favorites is to move the firing pin about .050" closer to center, and make Long Colt adaptors that use 6mm acorn blanks for the primer. Avoids the major surgery on the block that's required to move the pin all the way to center. Adaptors are easy to make, either on a lathe or a drill press. Starline brass is too thick for the Colt conversion. Jack Harrison uses PPU that he gets from Graf's. I didn't, and it cost me a lot of extra work.

The Long Colt version needs the proper heeled bullet Lyman 299153, which Jack sells on Gunbroler. If you ream the chamber for S&W, any bullet will do, but 90 grains probably best. '94 pattern Favorites are not as strong as the 1915 version. Keep loads for them subsonic.

BTW both Wisners and Jack First have most of the parts you'd ever need for Favorites.

[Green Frog]

“That day there were two nearly identical guns for sale on the table, differing only in caliber: one in .32 Long & the other a .32-20. Both were in close to new condition & with the same bbl. length (wish they'd been 4 inchers). Priced the same, IIRC, I paid $350 for this one.”

Oh my! You got a pretty fair deal on the 32-20, but IMHO left a real treasure laying on the table. If the 32 S&W Long was also a K frame, and in that same condition, it would bring a King’s Ransom today. Those 32 S&W L chambered M&Ps are highly sought after! I have tried to curtail my gun buying at the moment, but that’s one of the very few that might tempt me to “fall off the wagon” and revert to my spendthrift ways.
Froggie

[Head Shot]

Longer link works for the Hopkins & Allen 932, but won't for the Favorite. An interesting new approach for Favorites is to move the firing pin about .050" closer to center, and make Long Colt adaptors that use 6mm acorn blanks for the primer. Avoids the major surgery on the block that's required to move the pin all the way to center. Adaptors are easy to make, either on a lathe or a drill press. Starline brass is too thick for the Colt conversion. Jack Harrison uses PPU that he gets from Graf's. I didn't, and it cost me a lot of extra work.

The Long Colt version needs the proper heeled bullet Lyman 299153, which Jack sells on Gunbroler. If you ream the chamber for S&W, any bullet will do, but 90 grains probably best. '94 pattern Favorites are not as strong as the 1915 version. Keep loads for them subsonic.

BTW both Wisners and Jack First have most of the parts you'd ever need for Favorites.

Hello:
Glad i read your info on the link as id been sorta screwed since not working for a srevens 32rf favorite (1884 version )
Wisners i did find and called wiser on parts he had that my 1894 version with the main hammer spring not screw typw but held in place with a molded bump in the lower tang.
Jack First im not familiar with but ill search for his info see if i can come up with him.
I did find some new 32sw long cases that ill attempt to resize to a 32 colt long.
I read where simply drilling out a 32 colt long or short so a 27 cal power load would fit centered that it would be lg enuf that the rim fire pin would strike the 27 nail gun loads rim.
Ill use the short 27 power load crimped load rather than the longer on in hopes of the shorter load being just at 3/8 inch long that itll be easier to drive out over the longer 27 nail load of just over 5/8 inch long.
And im leaning towards drilling out centered primer hole to a 27 caliber nail gun power load and use number 3 or lower loads in the case with a 311419 lyman mold that is a 88gr but gas ckech base which just happens to measure right at .299 so going to try that mold and use the gas check as a heel to start the slug seating.
might scrape a little lead once beyond the gas check but wont know how bad or acceptable.
I also have an aluminum block 4 cavity mold that no name on it but is cut to 4 different slugs 2 in dif .284 and 2 in .311 dia slugs .
One of the 311 cavities is pretty much same shape as lymans 356402 mold but .311 dia and 85 gr with a pretty longer looking gas check but dtill not a heel but im thinkin it might just be the ticket or 32 long colt.
I also have a lyman 311252 at 77gr round nose ( Actually 2ct of these molds ones a hollow point other isnt)
A lyman 311245 at 87 gr round nose
A lyman 311227 at 90 gr round nose
And a lyman 313249 at 84 gr round nose but none of these have a gas check to use as a heel to start so ?????
Well anyway at the moment im waiting on the32sw long cases to be delivered so i can figure out best way to size to 32 colt since im still looking for dies for 32 colt log and only option might be ch4d if they have em in stock if not its a year wait list if special order.

[uscra112]

If you buy a hammer spring for that early Favorite from either of them, they will send you a spring for a Model 44. Believe it or not, the shape is the same, BUT the 44 spring is considerably thicker, and thus much stronger. It will take both hands to cock your Favorite. I dealt with this by narrowing the spring on a belt sander until it was something like reasonable for a Favorite. I took a good 1/8 inch off the width. Remember that the plan-view of the spring is slightly barrel-shaped - wider in the middle than on the ends. Preserve this.

Sizing the S&W cases down to Colt diameter uses a hardened steel drill bushing.

Read Jack Harrison's little tutorial here: https://www.gunbroker.com/item/976899429

If you have a little skill on a small lathe, I can show you a seater/crimper tool I made for the Long Colt. Once you have your cases formed, this is really the only tool you need to reload them, other than a way to decap/recap. Mine is built into a Lyman 310 tong tool dir body, but it could just as well be made for the Lee "Universal Expander" (which it ain't) die body.

[Head Shot]

Hello:
As a matter of fact i do have a mini lathe and use it quite a bit.
thinkin maybe taking a resizer decapping die say for a 22 hornet or size that that can drill out to 32 colt and polish ect.
I do have several reamers but not sure if i even have one thats .318 dia for finishing smooth .
Id have to look.
As a side note i do have gb sellers slugs ten mile on my watch list but thus far really wanting to mold my own if i can.
the 299153 mold hasnt been easy to find in my recent searches but still looking for that mold.
Head Shot

[uscra112]

Can you read a .dxf CAD file? P/M me with your email address.

[Head Shot]

Can you read a .dxf CAD file? P/M me with your email address.

Hello:
Yes i've dealt with cad files on 3d printers some and fewer on stuff id do with my mini lathe but i'm sorta up to speed on cad files and reading a cad file .
It be much appreciated to receive the cad file for consideration.
I'm not hiding from anybody so my emails available to those wanting to contact me.
Eklb1156@gmail.com
THANX A MILLION
Head Shot