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Thread: Lee mold simply will not work

  1. #1
    Boolit Master
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    Lee mold simply will not work

    Most people that follow my posts and threads will know I am not one to bash Lee's products. Most of their stuff works quite well and a lot more works well enough to get the job done. But mold, well, that is another story. I do have a couple Lee molds that work very well. I also have a couple that simply will not produce a good bullet no matter what you do. This mold I bought new so I started right out from the beginning and went by the book. Washed the mold with acetone to get all the oils off of it, and sat it on the pot for an hour. Now, A shiny aluminum mold sitting over top of a lead pot with just two skinny contact points will never ever get hot. After an hour sitting on top of the Lee Pro 20 pot at 750 degrees the mold was at 190 degrees checked with a contact thermometer. BUT, I wanted to follow the directions so when it did not work and I had to talk to Jerry I had all the bases covered. So then it went on the steel plate on top of my hot plate which is set at 450 degrees. Once up to that temp I did the corner in the pot test, not hot enough. Now, I have seen somewhere in Lee's publications that you are NOT supposed to put the mold in the pot and right in the directions it tells you to. But they do not tell you what to do if it is not hot enough. So, moving on. Like any other mold I start running lead through it to fully heat it up. Note, I purposely did not lube the pins or sprue plate hinge at this point yet because I want to see how long it takes to get rid of the wrinkles and I do not want ANY form of contamination. So, as usual with Lee molds I had wrinkles. 20 casts later it was exactly the same. I started at 700 degrees and I am using straight wheel weights. I have already been casting with several other steel mold today with no issues at all with this alloy. so I bump it up to 750. I am running a PID so temp is well controlled. No change after another 20 casts. Bump it up 800, no change in the wrinkles but the bullets are getting harder to get out of the mold. I should mention that from the beginning I had two cavities that simply would not release. I could beat the handles off of the mold and they would not come out without my prying them out. So the rest of the testing was done without using those two cavities unless I forgot and then they just stayed full until the run was finished. So last try was 850 degrees, everybody says Lee molds like to run hot, well this is almost 200 degrees over where I usually cast wheel weights!!!! Nada, still wrinkled. Ok, back down to 700 degrees, heat is not the answer. I cleaned the mold well with brake cleaner and lubed the pins and hinges and instantly had even more wrinkles. Cleaned the mold again and no more lube. Smoked the mold, Worked fantastic, for about 5 casts. Bullets fell out, except the same two cavities. There is a mechanical hang up there that I will look at later. But I am also not smoking the mold every 5-10 casts. And by now I am well over 100 casts through this mold. So, at this point I am fed up with their directions, and their molds and I bring out the spray weapon, Graphite spray. Spray it down, nozzle leaks, spray myself down, not happy. STILL will not release and still look like crap.
    Soooooo, Tomorrow I will call Lee Precision and I am sure I will be put through to Jerry so Jerry can tell me all the things I did wrong. I will simply refer him to this post.
    So now you can all say I am a Lee basher because I am bashing their molds. In this case, yes I am.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
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    I was frustrated at first, but I no longer have any issues with any of my Lee molds. I don't smoke them, don't clean them, don't do anything but cast bullets. If they don't drop out instantly, they usually only take a couple taps. So long as you stay in the zone and keep pumping out the bullets. I keep two bins to drop into. One for the sprues and for the first few dozens warmup drops, and one for the good bullets once they start dropping. As soon as you get the bullets out, fill 'er back up. Don't let the mold sit empty, and if you do, expect to warm it up again.

    I cast a batch of 2 different bullets the other month after years of hiatus, no problem. Didn't do anything at all to the molds that were sitting in the garage.

    One trick that keeps my Lee molds dropping good is to pour a healthy amount of extra hot lead on top of the sprue plate, about as much as will pool there without spilling over. This seems to keep the mold at the right temp. I don't go from one hole right to the other. I let the sprue plate fill over before moving to the next hole.
    Last edited by gloob; 01-03-2023 at 06:33 PM.

  3. #3
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    Winger Ed.'s Avatar
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    I had a burr on one that let the boolits hang up.
    Not wanting to use anything violent, I rubbed the open part of the mold on my blue jeans.
    That fixed mine.

    I tried the graphite a few times.
    It worked, but filled some details of the mold, like the sharp edges of the driving bands.
    Last edited by Winger Ed.; 01-03-2023 at 07:05 PM.
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  4. #4
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    Burrs in Lee molds have been common for me. Once removed they tend to drop well. I've also had a couple that had venting problems but that was a long time ago. Haven't had any venting issues since switched to the crosshatch style venting. Wrinkles and not complete fill outs tend to be an issue unless I use a hotplate or I really increase my casting cadence to keep the mold blocks hot. Casting they fast sprue smearing becomes an issue but the hotplate solves that.

    My real issue with Lee is the lack of consistency between cavities. I started casting with some 4 cavity Lyman molds that were very consistent. Next came some H&G that even in the 10 cavity molds had incredible consistency. The only reason I have or use Lee molds is because they offer designs not offered by others.
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  5. #5
    Boolit Master
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    I just looked at it under a glass and it is rough! The design has the bottom edge of each bullet rolled in a hair and on 4 of the cavities this is nice and smooth but the other two it is chattered bad. The mold is a 358-158 and is a wadcutter with many fine grooves. Those grooves look like crap also due to tool chatter. I am sure I can polish them out with a Dremel and a small buff but why should I have to? And that will take the sharp edges off the grooves, not like they are sharp now. It is only a wadcutter so I am sure doing that would not affect the accuracy at all. I am also sure I am not going to get anything better even if they do agree to replace it.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
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    If you want to polish the surface without smoothing over rough edges, you might consider leaving the dremel out of it. Diemakers use fine hard stones to burnish the surfaces of a die for the final finishing, by hand. But you have to grind them into the appropriate size/shape to fit what you're doing.

    Stone like translucent arkansas stone works well, because it is pretty easy to shape with diamond tools and grinders. It'll remove tiny tiny amount of metal, but mostly it will move metal. Pushing down the high spots to fill in the low spots.

    The stone doesn't have to perfectly fit the mold. It just has to be small enough to reach, and rounded without sharp edges. Just a rounded off point of a small bit of stone, expoxied to a handle. Sounds complicated, but if you have the right tools, it's pretty simple. I have near a dozen such implements, only requiring slight shaping to do this sort of job. I made/use them for deburring and burnishing of metal parts in hard to reach spots. Whether for reloading or otherwise.
    Last edited by gloob; 01-03-2023 at 07:49 PM.

  7. #7
    Boolit Master Castaway's Avatar
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    Just got a double cavity 500 gr RNFP and cast today and yesterday with it. It’s the easiest mould I’ve ever used for dropping bullets. All I have to do is open it and both bullets fall out. No tapping needed

  8. #8
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    Seasoning helps immensely.

    Going over /thru mold by looking washing and file/stoning the mold, before ever casting also catches the lions share of problems.

    LEE is plagued with problems. Nearly all are associated with sub standard materials.

    Lee molds require a lil extra work to run properly. Only one I have had that was a *** was the Key Drive slug mold. Not commenting ta speak of my issues. Lets fix yours.

    First off; Mold temp of 190° just isnt hot enough. Especially to start. Seasoning a mold is done @ 400° for 30 min a few times! Ya heat it hold that heat and allow to cool to ambient temp. What this does is help to cook off and draw out oils used in manufacturer and storage.
    A hot plate is world superior to the age old practice of warming molds atop the pot. A hot plate can be had for under 20$.

    Some times a mold simply requires being heated to and past dropping "frosty" bullets. This cooks off and pulls out those oils that cause the problems you are finding. IT WILL CLEAR UP!

    I have molds from nearly all common makers I recently had a MP mold give me fits as your experiencing. My resenent was quelled when TWO friends who bought SAME MOLD also had SAME PROBLEMS. This tells me that these molds probably saw something different. Weather it was diff oil or storage or old stock it was something that was not cured with out cleaning and cycling that all of us did! So even when doing everything "rite" you simply sometimes just need MORE HEAT!! Now step away from the torch. Just use that Hot Plate your gonna go buy and cast bullets! IT WILL CLEAR UP I PROMISE!

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  9. #9
    Boolit Master
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    CW, With all due respect, did you read my little article? I described in full detail the cleaning, the hot plate up to 450, the lead temps in stages up to 850. I fully appreciate what you are saying but this is far from my first rodeo with these things. I also cleaned that mold many times throughout this casting session. After seeing the defects in the mold the release was never going to happen but the wrinkles, certainly not heat or oil related. I suspect it has to do with the extremely rough condition of the interior of the mold not allowing free flow of the lead. I will see if my fancy overpriced Apple phone will get some closeups of it tomorrow.

  10. #10
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    I'll confess that I have less than stellar casting practices. I have a 40-175 TC Lee mold I bought used and it's a PITA. Bullets never drop out. At best I get two bullet groups. The first weighs 182-183gr. The second weighs 185-186gr. I think the previous owner worked on the mold because the bolt on top is different and always comes lose.

    As I said, bullets never drop out. I take the corner of a screwdriver, stick its corner into the base of the bullet and flick it out of the mold.

    To heat my mold, I place it on my hotplate until the lead in my pot is melted. I'll use a propane torch to melt the ingots and speed things up. Then I stick the corner of the mold into the molten lead and heat the mold with a propane torch. I'm just too impatient. I'll take the propane flame and work around the mold. My focus is where the mold touches the lead in the pot. When lead stops sticking to the mold, it's hot enough to cast. I'll drop my bullets as soon as I see the lead solidify. Then I'll use a wood mallet to tap the die so the parts line up.

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
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    Heating a mold with a torch is just going to ruin it. It will warp and never seal right nor drop round boolits.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master
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    I got some good pics of my mold, quite surprised at what that phone camera will do. But I need to clean out the rest of the graphite I put in there to be able to get a clear view of what is going on. I just sprayed it with brake cleaner while it was hot and it left a lot behind. I will scrub it out tomorrow with brake cleaner and a nylon brush and get better pics and post them. Some really bad machine work is my issue apparently.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master
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    Leement it using a fine rock polish. That should clean up the imperfections so the boolits will drop out easily. I also smoke most of the Lee molds and after you smoke them a few times it lasts a lot longer. Also I set the pot temp high and cast fast until the boolits start to frost and run it there or just below frost.

    The way I look at Lee molds is they are a cheap unfinished diy mold that will need finished. Sometimes you get one that works well right out of the box and sometimes you don't. The only Lee molds I have that I haven't been able to fix are the bore riders that are 2 to 5 thou under bore size on the nose.

  14. #14
    Boolit Master
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    Two questions. Are you sure your hotplate temp setting is correct? How long do you pre-heat the mold? My hotplate doesn't have temp readings, just low, med and high and found it needs to be just shy of medium to heat the mold to temp. Also takes at least 20 minutes on the hotplate. To keep it heating evenly made a cover from a butter cookie tin with a slot for the handle to stick out and a wire bail type handle to make it easy to put on and tale off. Using this system it seldom takes more than one pour to get good bullets. This is with the 6 cavity and may require some tweaking with a double cavity.

  15. #15
    Boolit Grand Master

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    what rbuck351 said.. Leement your mould. As has been mentioned, Lee moulds often have small burrs at the edge of the cavities and those burrs will hold boolits in place. I have had iron moulds with burrs as well but it is more common on Lee moulds.

    Leementing

    https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...ing-of-boolits
    http://www.castpics.net/subsite2/Cla...20a%20Mold.pdf
    https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sho...s-to-me-please

    Leementing is fine lapping to just remove burrs. Yes, you shouldn't have to do this but Lee moulds are inexpensive and not as well finished in general as higher end (and cost) moulds. A little TLC will fix them and they work just fine.

    Do not use a Dremel on your mould!

    Leementing is easy and effective and will not harm your mould. I only have a few Lee moulds these days. I bought both the 1 oz. and 7/8 oz. slug moulds and one dropped slugs as well as a Mihec mould, the other did not and it had some small burrs around the cavity and on the core pin at the drive key split. A little Leementing and some careful work with 600 grit silicon carbide paper removed the burrs and slugs drop out easily now.

    As for the wrinkles, it is possible that the venting is not clear so check that. Also, if the sprue plate is too tight to the face of the mould blocks air cannot bleed out the top and that can lead to poor fillout specially at the base. I can't say I have had that issue with a Lee mould but have with Mihec moulds which are finely machined and fitted. I loosen off the sprue plate so that it will almost swing free and that usually fixes the issue. I have also used a jeweller's file to remove just a hair off the top edges where the mould cavities meet under the sprue plate to allow air to bleed out there. The vee left after filing should be no larger than vent grooves in the mould face so very small!

    If you can't solve wrinkles any other way try this.

    Longbow

  16. #16
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    I have about 40 lee molds. All cast well. Some have one of the cavities hang up. A light tap with my 1 1/2 inch stick takes care of it. I have never cleaned a mold. I will heat cycle them three times before use on a hotplate. I heat them on the hotplate before casting and get good boolits within the first 5 casts. I use 2 molds when casting to speed things up. ( I only use one on 22 cal to keep the heat up.) I do find that the newer Lee 2 cavity do not hold heat as well as the older ones.
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  17. #17
    Boolit Master schutzen-jager's Avatar
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    after my last problem with a defective LEE die set, after many decades i will NEVER buy another LEE product again ! - they used to be a great company to deal with, but now they are totally uncaring about product quality + it is futile to deal with their customer service - i am sure many posters here will disagree with me but more will -
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  18. #18
    Boolit Master 243winxb's Avatar
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    Lee Mold Problems



    Lyman- While antimony is used to harden the bullet, the mixture of tin is critical, for while antimony mixes with lead in its molten state, it will not remain mixed when it solidifies. If tin were not added, we would have pure antimony crystals surrounded by pure lead. A bullet of this type , while it feels hard , would certainly lead the bore and eliminate all potential for accuracy.. In a lead-tin-antimony mixture, the antimony crystals will be present just the same, but they will be imbedded in a lead-tin mixutre. As the bullet cools the tin will form around the antimony-lead keeping your bullets from leading the bore.
    Add some linotype. Lee mold will never cast as good as an iron mold. Lyman, RCBS & Saeco. Imo.
    Last edited by 243winxb; 01-04-2023 at 05:27 PM. Reason: Add stuff.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master
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    Ok, I cleaned the mold up very well and I polished up a couple of burrs. Washed it again in hot soapy water and then again in acetone and tried casting. Forget it. Getting it super clean did nothing more than make the cavities that were releasing now become balky. So I smoked the mold with matches. Got the original cavities back but not the two bad ones. Still had major wrinkles. Lead at 800 degrees. This is way hotter that I have ever cast wheel weights in the past. So I smoked the mold with straight acetylene. At this point I really do not care. I am having to take full hammer swings at it to get those cavities to release. It is just a matter of time before the handles break. They are not going to replace the mold anyway so I don't care at this point. Came in and saw the thread about Leementing so cleaned everything up again and went about that. Only abrasive I have beside valve grinding compound is fast orange hand cleaner with pumice. Well, it cuts. Cleaned it all up again and tried it. Got one working a tiny bit but not number one. Broke it all down, cooled off and did those two again. No change. It will release but I have to beat on the mold arm opposite the bad cavity, and I mean I have to BEAT on it! Oh, still wrinkled and now at 900 degrees. I know this pot will hit 1,000 because I have seen it happen but I am done. Before anyone comments again about the hot plate, it is a piece of 3/16 steel plate on an old circular electric burner. I am checking the temp with the contact probe on my Fluke meter and also the laser temp gauge. They are within 50 degrees of each other. I even put a piece of lead on the plate next to the mold and it melted! Hot enough? Plate is reading 610 degrees. Mold is reading 530. Vent lines in mold are perfectly clear and I have not lubed the pins after all that washing so no oil contamination. That same alloy is working just fine in other molds at the very same time I am having trouble with this one. As far as a cold mold, the sprue is taking 10 plus seconds to cool.
    I was going to call Lee but I don't think it is worth wasting any more time on this mold, they are not going to cover it anyway and telling them is is a *** is not going to bother them in the slightest bit. I don't even think the Lee family even has that business anymore, Like Midway I think it has probably been sold to a conglomerate. I may be wrong but the way they talk to customers leads me to believe that compared to how it was a few years ago.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master
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    For one, l would talk to them; l have have good experiences there.

    For stubborn moulds I have run a propane torch flame into the cavities and the block face as the mould is held slightly open. If that doesn't burn it off, nothing will. Good luck

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check