Swaging as alternative to casting?

[noumenon]

I shoot IPSC and would like to make my own 9mm boolits. I'm currently using coated lead bullets, which work very well and are pretty economical. I like the idea of swaging more than casting (as no liquid lead / fumes). I'd quite like to stick to coated bullets to reduce lead exposure when fired. For speed of production, a coating seems like a better option than jacketing.

In order to make IPSC power factor, a 125 gr projectile needs to be doing a bit over 1000 fps. While obturation is great, I suspect the pure lead will be too soft.

As coating requires a heat cycle, I've been looking at quench hardening to take the hardness up a bit. However, pure lead doesn't quench harden, so you need to alloy it. Antimony seems to have the best increase, but will also take an air cooled 98:2 alloy to around BHN 8, which is I understand, much harder to swage.

So I'm curious if it's difficult to swage a standard 3/4-E from BNH 8-10 lead alloy? Can it be done in one operation (without a shoulder), including bleed holes to get the weight/dimensions perfect?

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Another, distinct part of the reloading hobby. Be prepared to make a significant investment in swaging dies, etc.

DG

[BadgerShooter]

i don't have any experience with powder coating bullets. (used to powder coat 2000 washing machines a day) but using a semi wadcutter style Corbin die with bleed holes can swage excellent bullets pretty fast. Lead wire is cut into pieces that weigh 3-5 grains more than your finished weight and are swaged to size and weight in one pass. I don't believe hardness will be a concern if they are powder coated - someone may know more than me about that part of it. Smith & Wesson used to make a pure lead hollowpoint covered with a polymer coating. They shot decent with no leading in 9mm. Nyclad was the product name.

As people have alluded to, swaging dies and equipment can be spendy and currently lead wire is not cheap either. I bought all my stuff 30 years ago when prices were a lot more reasonable.

Standard, small scale swaging equipment will have a hard time swaging lead much harder than pure. I swaged up to 2% Antimony wire with little or no problem. I broke dies going harder.

The H-Series dies from Corbin and similar can handle hard lead and other materials, but the price goes up dramatically.

Corbin also had a polymer dip lube, but the newer technologies might be better - I have no personal experience with that end of it. Corbin also had a copper washer that would swage and rivet to the back of the bullet to act as a kind of gas check. It was to be used in conjunction with the dip lube. I used it a bit and it seemed to work ok.

[Meatpuppet]

What caliber are you looking at? I much prefer swaging over casting. But first you have to have a "core" to swage up. I shoot a lot of 9mm for USPSA and find that the time investment is not worth it when you shoot several thousand rounds.

However, what I usually do is cast a smaller core, powder coat it and then "bump up" to the final size in a point form die (I use BT Sniper's dies with fantastic results). It does not take a "swage press" to simply point form a 9mm projectile.

Since you are loading for IPSC, I assume you are shooting 9mm. An Accurate Mold 33-120L, powder coated and then "bumped" in a point form die works great!

I generally use soft lead with a bit of tin. Hardness does not seem to matter in pistol velocities as long as you are powdercoating the projectile.

Swaging works!

[GhostHawk]

IMO the two go hand in hand.

IE using cast .357 bullets as cores for hand swagged .44mag bullets with .40sw jackets.

If you can find the right answer to all the variables, ie alloy, lube, load/speed casting can be faster and significantly cheaper than swagging.

But both sides have those who prefer one over the other.

[deltaenterprizes]

I have been casting for over 40 years and swaging for about 33 years.
I have shot many more cast boolits than swaged.
I started with a bullet mold modified to make cores and after going to machinist school I built an extruding die to make lead wire.
I can make many more boolits cheaper by casting than swaging.
A Master Caster from Magma Engineering will speed up your casting and is about the same cost as a swaging set up!
Get a Star lubrisizer also!

[Sasquatch-1]

I am not familiar with the heavier dies that Corbin sells, but I have split an "S" die when trying to reform a harder bullet. At $120.00 for the new replacement, it was a bitter lesson. (That was for just the single die body.)

That and the cost of equipment might make it unrealistic for you.

[414gates]

Lead fumes ? I get fumes from whatever else might melt down with the lead, not the lead itself. That's why I cast outdoors, when the wind is up.

Swaging tools are expensive. You could swage harder lead, you just need bigger swaging dies and a bigger press. Swaging lead pistol bullets is a one-pass operation, so it can be quick.

With Lee 6 cavity moulds, my output is higher than from a manual swaging press.

You could also set yourself up with an automated hydraulic swaging press and produce bullets as fast as you can cut cores.