MidSouth Shooters SupplyTitan ReloadingLoad DataReloading Everything
WidenersLee PrecisionRepackboxInline Fabrication
RotoMetals2
Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 41 to 54 of 54

Thread: TUNING a .22lr BR at 100 yards...

  1. #41
    Boolit Grand Master
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Northern Michigan
    Posts
    8,899
    I wonder what happened at Eley? BTW thanks for posting that info Charlie. I was looking at getting a couple of cartons but will hold off for now.
    Don Verna


  2. #42
    Boolit Buddy
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Pa.
    Posts
    171
    Charlie and me have been talking about this non-fire issue for a while now. I have been having problems with Contact and Semi-Auto benchrest this year in the Savage MkII. With some batting around with Charlie I went with putting a new main spring in the bolt, even with that still having non-fire issues. Don’t know what’s up with Eley ammo these days, did get a chance to get to the bench last week with the new spring installed. I shot 2 boxes of Semi-Auto benchrest. From that session, 100 rounds and 9 failure to fire on 1st strike. Rotate and fired, 2 of them took a 3rd strike. One of them I just racked the bolt a hit the same spot and that didn’t work. I think this ignition problem is also affecting accuracy. From the same tuner setting I’m getting different results. On the bottom set of targets I had the chronograph going, had a good SD but still think inconsistent ignition has something to do with it. 9 rounds of non-fire out of 100 rounds is not acceptable, the Semi-Auto benchrest is from last year. Just got 4 bricks of that a few weeks ago and hope is good.


    Last edited by Harry Tobin; 05-02-2023 at 08:52 AM.
    Armed society is a polite society
    Live A Little Learn A Lot

  3. #43
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    As best as I can determine a 'BOTTOM LINE' regarding these FTF's...it is this...



    You strike the rim and crush it or you don't...that's our bottom line. We've done our part.

    The rest is on Eley & is there adequate priming compound in the rim?... "What is going on in that factory?"
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  4. #44
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    (It's been a busy spring around here, haven't posted anything in a while...haven't been on the range for a while either...)

    "I watched the first 15 rounds on my 'sighter spots' rise into my line of sight and then dive into sweet looking groups that were forming...I'm thinking, this is going to be a 'Smoking Hot Card' today!"



    All wind flag indicators were telling me that I have a 'dead flat wind condition' this morning. Those first 3 sighters confirmed that my 'no wind' scope '0' turret adjustment must be very close or just right...that's been a major concern this spring so...there's a check in that box.
    Reading the wind on this 100 yard range has been a difficult study of 5 flags...then trying to come up with a fast wind-dope solution and equally as fast, trying to get 5 rounds downrange before anything changes.
    This is the basic idea I have come up with at his point...



    On the first sighter spot there was not a breath of air moving...not even the hair on my forearm could feel the air...I got my CBS and watched the remaining 4 rounds gather together as the barrel freshens it's lube.
    On the second sighter spot I watched the first 2 rounds start the group and it was the third round that taught me a new lesson about the wind. The vane is pointing at 12:00, it hasn't changed directions or indicated any wind since I set it up earlier. The only thing it has shown me is a condition I call a 'nervous flag'. That is where the flag does not show an angle you can associate with wind speed...it just hangs straight down and has a 'nervous quiver'.
    Looking back now, I realize that I couldn't see a wind indication 'angle' because the flag was moving straight back towards me...I don't have a perspective and that nervous quiver was actually telling me I have a wind approaching 1 mph. So...end result, I drop the 3'rd round to 6:00 and the fourth and fifth rounds join the first two. (alarms should have been ringing in my head but they weren't...this is a lesson I have to learn the hard way...'again!')
    On the third sighter spot, the same thing happens as on the second...only this time it happens on the 5'th round.

    Now I think I'm ready to start the card and I am convinced that I'm going to have a smoking hot day...it was exactly at this point the dead air ceased and the vane started slowly tracking back and forth indicating unstable air direction and variable wind below 2 mph.
    As usual, I got my butt handed to me and I had an average practice session, nothing to get excited about other than having a better understanding of what a 'nervous flag' is trying to tell me.

    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  5. #45
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    Here is an exciting upgrade I have been waiting on to arrive...I believe it's capability to display very low wind values is going to make me a better observer & doper of the wind.



    As you can see, it will display the slightest movement of the air...in this photo it is showing 2/10's MPH. (0.2 MPH) You might think, "well...so what?" I might say that .2 MPH on a 100 yard target is a big deal. My last card proved that to me as the slightest of wind coming at the 0900 ~ 1100 just kicked my butt real good!
    A small detail I can't overlook with this new meter is that it must be pointing directly into the wind for the best accuracy.
    To make that automatic, I ordered a swivel mount with a wind vane that will handle that part, it can sit on the bench just like the old one where I can peek around the scope and see it's value. This vane is for a Kestrel but I can DIY it to work.

    ...

    The meter I have been using has been convenient since it does not require my pointing it directly into the wind. It has a weather station type wind-cup assembly, it can read wind from any angle. The drawback to that convenience is that it can't display wind values below 1.3 ~ 1.5 MPH. That is a significant POA/POI difference at 100 yards...



    So...here's hoping I can hold up my end, I should have a '0' wind morning this Friday.
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  6. #46
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    I ran that new meter side by side with my other one this morning. What a difference, the new one sits there spinning and showing wind as slow as .2mph while the other doesn't spin until somewhere around 1.5mph.
    Here's the new one recording 1.3mph while the other just sits there...



    That '0' wind morning did not materialize so I managed as best as I could in the low wind...I hope I can look back in August and see some improvement in my groups...



    I made an improvement in my DIY wind vane. When the wind is coming from 1200 or 0600 it is hard to tell which end of the vane is facing me. This vane is 30 yards in front of the bench and early in the morning it is in shade. I had hoped that the little orange ribbon would show me but I've called the wind wrong several times now as I just can't see it clearly...



    In searching other type vanes I saw one that used a black and white ball on the vane to show which way it is facing...this gave me an idea.



    I modified my vane with a plastic disc I cut from the bottom of a jar...until I can re-design mine I think this will do just fine. Eventually I want to run two of this type vane...

    ...

    This is much easier to see which way the vane is pointing.
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  7. #47
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    Now that I can read the wind with more resolution, I've decided to add POA(s) to each target on my notepad. I hope to eventually develop a scale of POA offsets for direction and velocity of the wind. I don't mean to make a cheat sheet of sorts like a calibrated wind rose. I don't want more clutter on the bench but I am committing it to memory, I think it will be relatively simple after I've studied enough of these cards.

    The problem I see at the moment is that this range is not exactly replicating the offsets I have in the roses I use for reference. I've been thinking a lot about that and it dawned on me this morning that I am working wind across an inclined hill, 9:00 wind is an uphill rising wind and 3:00 is a falling downhill wind...¿this may be the reason for the slight difference?





    When I come in the shop, the first thing I do is transcribe the bench notes to the target and get all that information out of the way before I start with the calipers...





    I do the measuring last...sometimes I am 20 or 25/1000's off, I try to be accurate but here I'll play the 73 year old eye card ...the most important number to me is that 15 spot Agg. ... I want to see that start dropping.


    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  8. #48
    Boolit Master

    sparky45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    SE, KS
    Posts
    2,405
    Wow!! Great shooting. I have a CZ 452 Trainer that I'd like to re-stock into something like your CZ's stock. Who's the maker of that stock?

  9. #49
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    Quote Originally Posted by sparky45 View Post
    Wow!! Great shooting. I have a CZ 452 Trainer that I'd like to re-stock into something like your CZ's stock. Who's the maker of that stock?
    I don't know...sorry! I bought it built already. The owner passed and the family sold it. I don't even know the barrel maker. I left a note for the family asking questions about the build but I don't think they knew...they never answered.
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  10. #50
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    I have that vane swivel for the Kestrel adapted for this larger anemometer and ready to go next time out...it will swivel 180º on the vane so I can see the numbers however the wind is blowing.


    ...


    Still whittling off a little of that Agg. score, hope to keep this trend going. I suppose that to officially say I have a .5 MOA tool, this will be an Agg. of all the Agg's... ...err, something like that?





    I can see 'some' improvement as I am getting more and more of the groups on the green spot, that's the other half of my self challenge.

    I have revised one of the wind roses found on the net...I've placed the red Capitol O's as a primary POA but it is still variable by how much wind there is. It seems like .5 ~ 1 mph will make the POI change by about 1/4" or a full diameter. I'm not sure of that yet, that's the confusing part as I sit there waiting on a wind condition to return and quickly make the shot.

    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  11. #51
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    A FRIEND OF MINE HARRY TOBIN shot a fly off his backstop target last week at 50 yards, first shot . . . he got pretty excited about that & told me about it, I thought that was pretty cool and I sent him an email with a joke picture about that...calling Harry 'Legend'...I like to screw around with my Good Friend.

    (I changed the wording so I could post this here)



    We talked it over and in another few days Harry shot another...made big fly guts splatter on the target...I tell Harry, "You oughta make a challenge game of this, this would be fun to try."

    So...Harry did...he makes us a card we can compete with and have a break from the usual drudgery of trying to shoot small agg. groups.

    Harry says..."Only body hits count, wings and legs don't count" ... then he mails me some cards and I gave them a try!

    This is a kick in the pants!

    first try...



    second try this morning...



    It is still good Kentucky windage practice and I use a few less rounds every day. I think I'll be posting these for some time to come now!
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  12. #52
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    My range is a complicated range to figure wind calls...so,

    I have been thinking a lot about a 'method' where I can combine the 'wind call' for the first 50 yards with the call from the last 50 yards and have a combined 'adjusted wind call' for the 100 yards.

    After much time staring at all the wind roses, I've decided to simplify this rose into 2 main parts, left & right. There is also the 6 & 12:00 wind call and they are handled on their own merit individually...they don't blend into the 'general call for left & right'...they do figure in the elevation call, either adding or subtracting a smidge but not much...they don't change the vector.



    *The 'blue star' is the 'POA Offset' Area. It's exact location is dependent upon wind speed...here min. is '0 wind' <(aim @ center of fly) & max is '2.5 mph wind'. <(aim @ area shown in this picture).

    The 'fly body' is aprox. .415" tall & .180" wide ... this size will allow aprox. 2+ diameters of the projectile 'inaccurate' elevation and still take a body hit...also, it will allow aprox. 2 diameters of windage inaccuracy. <(Me thinks?...this has my brain in 'overload mode' lately!)

    This is why I started trying to figure a way to 'consolidate & simplify'...if this is possible? I am open for suggestions to a faster & more accurate method. "I am treading water in the deep end today!"

    *The black squares represent the 'beaten area (zone)' of the '7~11' left & '1~5' right 'consolidated POI' areas.


    Next...I needed that second vane for the last 50 yard wind call, here she is in all her 'DIY Glory'...





    And now . . . here's the view from the bench where you can see all the streamers and vanes. You notice that the anemometer has had to have it's own tripod just off the front corner of the bench...it's vane is too large to sit on a mini tripod on the bench top.



    With all this 'Hi-Tec DIY Technology' I have going on over here...I just might set this 'Flyswatter Card' on fire! I might just turn into a 'Flyswatting Terrorists',
    but...as you can see below...I NEED A WHOLE BUN'CHA-LOT MORE EXPERIENCE AT THIS GIG! ��



    THIS IS A HECK'UVA CHALLENGE ... BUT IT'S A HECK'UVA LOTTA FUN TOO!
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

  13. #53
    Boolit Grand Master
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Northern Michigan
    Posts
    8,899
    I started thinking about a "safari on a shoestring" last year when I was being overrun by wasps. I discovered the buggers had made a nest in the column of my shooting bench after killing about a dozen one day. I was sitting almost on top of them! Luckily never got stung.

    Later I was group shooting my Daystate PCP at 50 yards. A wasp landed on the target and I hit it...boy that was fun!!

    I am too impatient to wait for a fly or wasp to land on a target, so I will try putting some jelly on the target as an attractant. I hate wasps and flies, so the pest control aspect is a bonus.

    But I am no Legend. I am thinking of starting at 25 yards and seeing how it goes. I will leave the 100 yards shots to you "Legends"...LOL.
    Don Verna


  14. #54
    Boolit Grand Master OS OK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    El Dorado County, N. Ca.
    Posts
    6,234
    Quote Originally Posted by dverna View Post
    I started thinking about a "safari on a shoestring" last year when I was being overrun by wasps. I discovered the buggers had made a nest in the column of my shooting bench after killing about a dozen one day. I was sitting almost on top of them! Luckily never got stung.

    Later I was group shooting my Daystate PCP at 50 yards. A wasp landed on the target and I hit it...boy that was fun!!

    I am too impatient to wait for a fly or wasp to land on a target, so I will try putting some jelly on the target as an attractant. I hate wasps and flies, so the pest control aspect is a bonus.

    But I am no Legend. I am thinking of starting at 25 yards and seeing how it goes. I will leave the 100 yards shots to you "Legends"...LOL.
    That is funny Don! Harry is the only legend in this game so far...just the other day he slew 21 of them buggers!
    and...to top that off with a cherry...he did it with an old Savage MKII sewer pipe that he has completely re-built in his shop...that's the kind of stuff that's legendary and I respect him for that...wish I had his talent but ... I'll stick with my own good looks!
    a m e r i c a n p r a v d a

    Be a Patriot . . . expose their lies!

    “In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.” G. Orwell

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check