Contender barrel problem....

[racepres]

Yes taller as in top to bottom, the trigger guard release hits the lug and doesn’t release the locking bolts. I ground clearance on the trigger guard, no more than it took it probably could be taken off the lug.
If this is your trouble you should be able to see it with your barrels side by side. Sorry my photo isn’t that great.

How very interesting...Just How New is "new" meaning Not original TC made??
I will investigate this on Mine (also Old Style) later today.. tho all of My Barrels are TC made.. Don't know when the "new kids" took over.

[jules]

I am trying to get everything to work without a forend and no grip installed. It's definitely not an easy open frame, the pivot point is in front of the trigger guard.

Screwcutter- wider from left to right? Of top of the barrel to bottom of lug? Were you able to get it working or just using a different framework for that barrel?

Also struck out with Bellm TC- he said he doesn't advise spending money or time on it and to try and track down a g2 frame.

SSK said "there's not much to be done with the originals".

When they were still in operation I thought TC use to convert the older frames to easy open?

[racepres]

When they were still in operation I thought TC use to convert the older frames to easy open?

Yes Indeed they did...I never felt the need personally. Kinda like the Ruger retrofit of the hammer block, or whatever they called it... Again Not something I need, nor require.. But... Rather than Update Computer operating systems all the Darn time...I went Linux and continue Marching in Place!!! Call Me Odd...My Newest Harley is a 1994, Favorite ... a toss up '74 or '84!!!!!

[Bored1]

[Bored1]

So the lug is larger on the 357 herrett barrel compared to the 44 hotshot barrel from top to bottom, and the super 14" 7tcu is taller than the 357 herrett.

So I don't think the bolts are my only issue here. Not sure how to go about getting them all to play well together.

I did contact S&W/TC, SSK, and Bellm TC all again, and no joy with any of them. No gunsmithing or fitting services available to address this. Hoping to find a knowledgeable gunsmith who is willing to take a look a d see if they can make it work.

[Bored1]

So it's not the locking bolts at all. The actually barrel lugs are different sizes. I don't have a working battery for my caliper currently so can't really get an exact measurement. But with the bolts removed and the barrel butted up to each other you can see the hotshot barrel lug is definitely shorter than the other 2 barrels. The 357 herret barrel with the scope mount is in between the heights of the hotshot barrel and the 7mm tcu super 14.

So it appears either remove material from the bottom of the barrel lugs or the top of the flat piece that makes the top part of the trigger guard, if that makes sense. I'm not mechanically inclined enough really to do either with any confidence.

On a side note, I tried the bolts from the super 14 7tcu install on the hotshot barrel and of course they work fine even with my "polishing".

Is there additional clearance on easy open frames for the taller barrel lugs or would I need a G2 frame?

[racepres]

????? I just don't "get it" the "lug" at that point (of the locking Lugs) is No Where near anything in the Frame, that could obstruct it.
May be some rub marks on the inside front of the trigger guard...maybe..
Back to basics... Is there a rub spot on the barrel lug at the most forward bottom?? may correspond to the Spot at forward most top side of Triggerguard?? Talking rubbing at the very front at the root of the 45 degree cut at front of barrel lug?? Only place I see that can touch frame to Lug..
Try this... maybe... Remove trigger guard ..try lock up...even look from bottom.. Simple matter to reinstall trigger guard to Unlock.. BTDT to "check" lug engagement!!!

I sure hope your barrels have a Star or a "cross" that TC put on them...other, less meticulous Mfg????

[No_1]

I have run into this a few times. A gentleman who has been shooting contenders since the late 60’s gave me the following advice which I have used multiple times with success.

1) Remove the locking lugs and coil spring from the barrel lug.
2) Using a fine stone polish any part of the locking lug(s) that rub against each other as well as the areas of the locking lug(s) that ride inside of the barrel lug.
3) Clip one coil from the coil spring.
4) Lightly Lube the area of the locking lugs which rides inside the barrel lug as well as the coil spring.
5) Reassemble and test.

He indicated it was ok to lightly polish the area of the lug(s) that interact with the frame as long as no material is removed from that area.

[racepres]

Now... I got wayyy off on this... but Unlocking!!! No.1 gots it...
I have developed such bad Arthritis that I can No Longer always squeeze the Guard.. I grip it like I used to back when new.. then rap my Knuckles on my Knee...opens every rap after a whole bunch of repititions... all mine open much easier.. Kinda like Dry Firing!!!

I have run into this a few times. A gentleman who has been shooting contenders since the late 60’s gave me the following advice which I have used multiple times with success.

1) Remove the locking lugs and coil spring from the barrel lug.
2) Using a fine stone polish any part of the locking lug(s) that rub against each other as well as the areas of the locking lug(s) that ride inside of the barrel lug.
3) Clip one coil from the coil spring.
4) Lightly Lube the area of the locking lugs which rides inside the barrel lug as well as the coil spring.
5) Reassemble and test.

He indicated it was ok to lightly polish the area of the lug(s) that interact with the frame as long as no material is removed from that area.

Good advice, certainly. But..If the barrel won't lock, Not gonna Help probably!
Not that difficult to remove trigger guard an Look!!!!

Edit; Just went and Did my early sn76xxx, unmodified Frame and a Random barrel.. Happened to be 7-TCU, so Newer than that Frame Certainly!!!
Remove Trigger guard.. pin barrel and Close... will it Latch?? Look from underneath, can it be discerned what is holding up the Show???
Certainly look at the firing pin bushing...If it is loose and moved out Proud... she Won't lock!!!
Ensure that the Rotating interlock is pushed to 90 degrees by the Locking Lug(s)..assuming it Latched...
I simply dropped the Trigger guard back in and Pinned it, to Open!!
Let us Know... Oh...and this exercise will show that the depth you are concerned with...is Probably Not a Factor...

[Bored1]

Racepress- the barrel latches to the frame well. Too well I guess is the problem. Once the super 14 7tcu barrel is closed, it won't open for love or money. I have to remove the hinge pin and jiggle everything until it comes loose. I will try to remove the trigger guard and look and see what's happening, I guess I didn't realize you could remove it and close everything.

No 1- I will also try everything you suggested. I didn't think of polishing the other parts of the locking bolts. I've tried the internal parts from the hotshot barrel installed in the 7tcu and it didn't make a difference so I figured it wasn't the bolt but won't hurt anything to try! I'm open to pretty much anything that I can actually try within my limited mechanical knowledge/ability.

[racepres]

Racepress- the barrel latches to the frame well. Too well I guess is the problem. Once the super 14 7tcu barrel is closed, it won't open for love or money. I have to remove the hinge pin and jiggle everything until it comes loose. I will try to remove the trigger guard and look and see what's happening, I guess I didn't realize you could remove it and close everything.

No 1- I will also try everything you suggested. I didn't think of polishing the other parts of the locking bolts. I've tried the internal parts from the hotshot barrel installed in the 7tcu and it didn't make a difference so I figured it wasn't the bolt but won't hurt anything to try! I'm open to pretty much anything that I can actually try within my limited mechanical knowledge/ability.

So, Maybe the Latch slot in the Barrel is "sticky"... Not smooth...
By All Means...if squeezing trigger guard ain't working...Rap them knuckles on yer Knee...Or maybe more delicate to slap the Knuckles with yer Off-Hand!!!! Probably the Number One reason folks went to "easy open"., All it did was move the pivot pin for More Leverage.. don't really change the force applied to the Parts!!!

[Bored1]

The hitting my fingers on the trigger guard was working about half the time with the 357 herret barrel, however would never work with the 7tcu barrel. With the 7tcu super 14 barrel I slapped my hand with the other hand and my knee until my hand hurt and needed to stop for awhile. Tried that method repeatedly over and over and still it won't work.

Removed the trigger guard and closed the barrel and can't see what the problem is. However, now with the triggerguard replaced, the 357 herret barrel wont shut easily like it would before and the 7tcu barrel will still not come off without removing the hinge pin.

I did try cutting off one coil of the spring and polishing the parts of the locking bolts that touch inside the barrel lug, doesn't seem to have changed anything.

[Kylongrifle32]

Try removing the extractor. Then mount the barrel and try with an empty chamber. I had a small piece of lead get in between the barrel notch and extractor on a 22 LR barrel one day and gave me all kinds of fits.
Have you checked the barrel to frame clearance. Not sure of the exact spec but a . 001 feeler gage should slide in between them.

[screwcutter]

The top forks (red) unlock when the trigger guard is squeezed to open. If the top of the trigger guard hits the bottom of the barrel lug, it can’t travel far enough to unlock. This was the case with mine.

[racepres]

Try removing the extractor. Then mount the barrel and try with an empty chamber. I had a small piece of lead get in between the barrel notch and extractor on a 22 LR barrel one day and gave me all kinds of fits.
Have you checked the barrel to frame clearance. Not sure of the exact spec but a . 001 feeler gage should slide in between them.

More good stuff... lucky I never had that!!
I took a minute to check the locking bolts on a couple... The Part that slides under the "shelf" to lock..seem to be engineered at ~ .125
(tough to get a Micrometer just so on that locking portion..) most one piece measure at least .001 less than that..while most two piece are right at .125...yet...one Brannny spinnin (unused) two piece is Thicker... like .127.. Prolly Why it is Not on one of my Barrels!!
This is probably a Very critical place... but...if too thick, or too rough...gonna be very difficult to unlock.
When looking from the bottom, on different Barrels, look closely at the Interlock (rotating "winged" lookin piece), which Must be 90 degrees, as rotated by locking lugs being "locked".. if the Locking lug is Not going completely extended to lock up... Im thinking the Locking lug is Simply too thick!!
I have to go right back to...Do these barrels act the same on a Different Frame??
Sure wish you were close to me...this is Challenging...and may require more than a couple Frames, and Barrel locking lugs!!

[racepres]

The top forks (red) unlock when the trigger guard is squeezed to open. If the top of the trigger guard hits the bottom of the barrel lug, it can’t travel far enough to unlock. This was the case with mine.

Don't look at all like mine... old style hard open type...Where is the pivot hole on that example??
Yes those Ramps push the Barbell part of the Lug to unlatch.. I cannot envision any other part of the Barrel contacting those...On Mine anyway..
Of course...I will take apart again to Look!!!!

Edit; OK I see what you are saying... but... I do Not see that possibility on an Old style..
I placed the Triggerguard (removed) against the bottom extension at the Barbell, on three different era barrels (stepped extension, split lock, stepped extension one piece lock, straight extension solid lock) all barbells hit the Unlocking cam of the triggerguard exactly in the same place...at the root of the "triangle"..
since i do Not know what triggerguard the one shown is... i am having a hard time figgering out just How it caused a Problem... I need to get a newer one I guess!!! I will inform the Bitter Half!!! Stay tuned!!!

[racepres]

Bored 1
I am about to the point of having you "sacrifice" a locking bolt!!
Trying to keep the locking surface as Flat as humanly possible (no back-cut) I would grab a Whetstone and Have at it... measure as close as ya can with a Mic (maybe a really good Caliper) take like .0005, at a time... Gonna Take awhile me bets!!
Stone, measure,test, repeat, ... gonna need a Zipper on that "pin", and yer thumb gonna get calloused... But!!!
Once it gets to Working... precise measurements together with some Dykem blue (nah...I use a Sharpie) maybe worthwhile to sacrifice a Locking bolt!!!

[Bored1]

Racepres- I've tried that, I ground that thing until I was scared it was ruined. That lockingbolt set still works with the 44 mag hotshot barrel so didn't actually sacrifice it as I thought I was going to. It looks like I may have access to a easy open frame this weekend to try these two barrels on and see what the deal is possibly if I can figure it out. This has been the most frustrating thing I've done in awhile.

Consolation prize was taking the 44 hot shot barrel to the indoor range and making sure it still worked. My wife really liked it, so there's that!

[screwcutter]

These are of my 5 digit set unmodified trigger guard. In the close up you can see where a taller barrel lug is hitting the trigger guard. This is where I ground the clearance.

[racepres]

These are of my 5 digit set unmodified trigger guard. In the close up you can see where a taller barrel lug is hitting the trigger guard. This is where I ground the clearance.

Checked mine...Never had nothin like it... Are these all Old TC original Barrels??? or newer "stuff"??? Just curious..
BTW what is the Guard in the first Pic??? (post#34)

Racepres- I've tried that, I ground that thing until I was scared it was ruined. That lockingbolt set still works with the 44 mag hotshot barrel so didn't actually sacrifice it as I thought I was going to. It looks like I may have access to a easy open frame this weekend to try these two barrels on and see what the deal is possibly if I can figure it out. This has been the most frustrating thing I've done in awhile.

Consolation prize was taking the 44 hot shot barrel to the indoor range and making sure it still worked. My wife really liked it, so there's that!

If it still locks properly on your old Barrel... it ain't sacrificed.. If it don't work on an Easy open frame??? Sacrifice it some more...After you make sure your HotShot has a workable Locking lug!!!
BTW if you can try an easy open type frame ...check "effort" to unlock various Barrels.. certainly see if your HotShot locks properly...and compare unlocking effort of the two frames.
I have a Locking lug set here that Looks worn down badly... but when measured...it is Still taller than an old single piece I use.. Also... it locks just the very slightest bit "taller" when viewed from bottom (trigger Guard removed)