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Thread: 450 577 Martini Henry

  1. #21
    Boolit Master
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    abunaitoo, thank you.

  2. #22
    Boolit Master Bad Ass Wallace's Avatar
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    I've made all my 577/450 cases from reformed 24ga Magtec brass. I also use them to reform 577 Snidewr. Shot this 10 shot group with the Magtec brass many years ago.

    Hold Still Varmint; while I plugs Yer!

  3. #23
    Boolit Master elmacgyver0's Avatar
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    I though my comment about making cases from scratch might get you to thinking I was just wise cracking.
    I don't recommend doing this as it is a real pain.Click image for larger version. 

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  4. #24
    Boolit Master
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    Ive also made cases out of brass tube...and turned them from solid......not since the first 24ga came on the market..........at first they were Berdan primed,which wasnt all bad as Magtech also sold the odd sized (6.45mm) Berdan primers..........Some of my CBC/Magtech brass has been fired 100 times .........this is not BS,I never size the cases ,just use a paper patched bullet which holds in the neck nicely........if you size cases every load with the Lee die ,they will split necks quickly..........the Lee die is purposely made too small...Lee say they made the die small ,so that every possible rifle will chamber sized reloads.

  5. #25
    Boolit Bub
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    I have used Mag Tec 24 gauge to good effect. Also old Kynock's converted to 209 primers and an assortment of others. The most accurate were fire formed and the bullet either PP'd or sized to a firm slip fit in the case and they never get sized after the forming shot. It is a great old cartridge. Squid Boy

  6. #26
    Boolit Master 15meter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squid Boy View Post
    I have used Mag Tec 24 gauge to good effect. Also old Kynock's converted to 209 primers and an assortment of others. The most accurate were fire formed and the bullet either PP'd or sized to a firm slip fit in the case and they never get sized after the forming shot. It is a great old cartridge. Squid Boy
    Care sharing how you converted to 209?

    I've fooled with it a little bit and I'm curious how you did it. Did you have any pitfalls to be avoided?

  7. #27
    Boolit Master
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    Bad Ass Wallace, now that target has bragging rights!!!! it should be framed.

  8. #28
    Boolit Master Bad Ass Wallace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by toot View Post
    Bad Ass Wallace, now that target has bragging rights!!!! it should be framed.
    of course, the pith helmet and red shirt also help you shoot better!

    Hold Still Varmint; while I plugs Yer!

  9. #29
    Boolit Master elmacgyver0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Ass Wallace View Post
    of course, the pith helmet and red shirt also help you shoot better!

    Now you need some bagpipes playing in the background!

  10. #30
    Boolit Master Bad Ass Wallace's Avatar
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    (LOL) or some Zulu's chanting.
    Have a full 24th Regiment of Foot Uniform but it is so hot and heavy, cannot imaging wearing it in the heat of Africa!

    Hold Still Varmint; while I plugs Yer!

  11. #31
    Boolit Master
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    roger that! pith helmet & red shirt, is just the cat's meow! if that is all that it takes to shoot a group like you posted sign me up!!!

  12. #32
    Boolit Master
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    at a reenacting event that I went to in the August heat, a women went up to a crusty old BRIT, OFFICIER, garbed out in his finest wool uniform, and asked him aren't you very hot in all of that wool that you are wearing, to whit he replied to her- no man I am not hot in my uniform because the QUEEN says that I am not hot- there fore I am not hot!!! thought you might like that, and it is true. his name was IAN McKAY. this happened 46 yrs ago. he is gone now, and he had no patiance for women & children asking questions. GOD BLESS HIM.

  13. #33
    Boolit Master
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    wearing all of that wool in AFRICA, they didn't have a choice! I believe?

  14. #34
    Boolit Master
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    looking at the picture and the way you are holding and loading the MH. are you left handed?

  15. #35
    Boolit Master Bad Ass Wallace's Avatar
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    You are correct sir. That's why I have 30+ Martini's and also favour Winchester lever guns.

    I even have a LH Alex Henry dated 1878 in 577/450.

    Hold Still Varmint; while I plugs Yer!

  16. #36
    Boolit Master
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    WOW! 30+ MH'S. now I know where that they have all gone! LOL. they definitely will work for lefthanded people. the ALEX HENERY, I have never even heard of? guess I have got to get out more often. was it MFG. as a military weapon, or for sporting / civilian hunting? if military did it have a bayonet? any way it is a real beauty. thanks for the pictures of it.

  17. #37
    Boolit Bub
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    Howdy Pards

    Enjoyed reading the posts. Picked up some good info. In my Snider I have used 24 gauge brass and actual factory 577 brass (Jamison and other makes). An issue with 24 gauge brass, at least with my rifle, is the small rim not always making good purchase with the extractor. I make sure to have a cleaning rod handy to poke out those cases that choose to be recalcitrant. Not an issue with genuine 577 brass.

    Those old smoke poles are fun to shoot. Touching off one of those rounds at the range immediately draws a crowd. I bring extra ammo for those that want to pop a cap.

    Side note. A trivia question that can be directed to the “know it all” shooting guys: why was the 24 gauge shotgun popular from the end of the Civil War and loaded by ammo companies into the 1930’s?

    Answer: there were hundreds of thousands of 58 caliber muskets at Civil War’s end … both in the US as well as internationally … that had been rendered obsolete by the introduction of cartridge rifles. Early on many of these were converted to 58 caliber cartridges, both center fire and, if memory serves, to 58 caliber rimfire cartridges. Multitudinous numbers of those had the rifling smoothed out and were converted to 24 gauge shotgun. Believe most were relined or rebarreled to 50-70 caliber and, possibly, to 45-70.

    The 24 gauge is still encountered in Europe (and perhaps elsewhere?) with factory ammo still loaded. A French outfit, Cheddite, made 24 gauge plastic shotgun hulls. I bot some … either Graf & Sons or Track of the Wolf, I forget which … trimmed them to proper length, and made some black powder, round ball ammo.

    It keeps those ancient smoke poles in the game instead of sitting on the sidelines.

    Keep on the sunny side

    Adios

    Fort Reno Kid
    Last edited by fortrenokid; 12-17-2022 at 06:05 PM.

  18. #38
    Boolit Bub
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    Unhappy

    Howdy again Pards

    In response to the question about a bayonet on a Martini-Henry … Yes.

    Find the great movie “Zulu” on a streaming channel or excerpts in YouTube. Indeed those Martini-Henry’s with their 30” long barrels topped with a 22” bayonet were as formidable as a spear.

    Toward the end of the movie there’s a climactic scene where the Sargeant-Major, with a bayoneted Martini-Henry, takes on a spear-wielding warrior in a fight to the death.

    The end of the movie has a narration by Richard Burton summarizing the results of the battle and the large numbers of Victoria Crosses that were awarded.

    I have Martini-Henry in 577-450 and load black-powder ammo for it. Touch one of those off at the range and you’ll draw a crowd in no time. Take extra ammo. Everyone will want to to pop a cap.

    Keep on the sunny side

    Adios

    Fort Reno Kid

    PS. Side note: this was one of Michael Caine’s early roles. A breakout role IMHO. To those used to seeing him playing elderly men in movies of recent years, in “Zulu” he barely looks old enough to shave.

  19. #39
    Boolit Master
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    Richard Burton was Welsh, as were most of the soldiers at Rork’s Drift. I believe he did the narration for the price of a bar tab.

  20. #40
    Boolit Master Bad Ass Wallace's Avatar
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    The purists should note in many scenes, the actors were using "tricked up" SMLE Mk1 bolt actions and not Martini's!
    Hold Still Varmint; while I plugs Yer!

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check