Lee APP and X shell holder for 9mm

[dverna]

Saw something on the other APP thread and did not want to hijack it.

People have reported issues with processing 9mm on the APP.

What has been your experience. Is it a setup issue? Is it only occurring with certain brands of brass? Is there a workaround?

[ChuckO]

I have had three or four 9mm cases that slipped out of the shell holder in my APP by distorting the case rim during the sizing operation. I suspect that the real problem was due to a case bulge from an unsupported chamber. All of these happened in range pickup cases which I missed during my inspection before starting to size them. They had all been deprimed and then wet cleaned. Either running the cases through a bulge buster or discarding the bulged cases (preferable) would have probably avoided the issue.

I have improved my inspection of the cleaned cases and have not had any problems since. I haven't had any problems with other calibers, 32ACP through 45ACP nor any rimmed calibers. I only run straight wall cases through the APP.

[poppy42]

Using the X shell holders I’ve had issues with 223 brass

[megasupermagnum]

The problem is the X shell holders only grab a small portion of the rim. They have to be relatively generous in size to allow cases to flow through them easily too. I've never tried 9mm in them, but I would suspect that caliber would be prone to issues due to the huge variances you find in brass, and being thrown from semi-auto pistols never help. I suspect that if you only loaded a certain brand of brass, you would never have an issue, but if you run a mix of everything, from every country and military in the world, then you will probably find a case eventually that doesn't quite fit right. There's nothing you can do for the setup on the APP to fix it.

As for my experiences I've had zero issues sizing handgun cases. 327 federal, 357 magnum (and 38 special), 41 magnum, 44 magnum, 10mm auto, and 45 acp. For bottleneck rifles, I think there is just too much resistance in a normal expander ball sizing die, you are probably going to rip a rim off eventually. An alternative would be to use two different sizers. A body sizer, then a neck sizer. Or even a neck sizer alone if that is your thing.

[poppy42]

The problem is the X shell holders only grab a small portion of the rim. They have to be relatively generous in size to allow cases to flow through them easily too. I've never tried 9mm in them, but I would suspect that caliber would be prone to issues due to the huge variances you find in brass, and being thrown from semi-auto pistols never help. I suspect that if you only loaded a certain brand of brass, you would never have an issue, but if you run a mix of everything, from every country and military in the world, then you will probably find a case eventually that doesn't quite fit right. There's nothing you can do for the setup on the APP to fix it.

As for my experiences I've had zero issues sizing handgun cases. 327 federal, 357 magnum (and 38 special), 41 magnum, 44 magnum, 10mm auto, and 45 acp. For bottleneck rifles, I think there is just too much resistance in a normal expander ball sizing die, you are probably going to rip a rim off eventually. An alternative would be to use two different sizers. A body sizer, then a neck sizer. Or even a neck sizer alone if that is your thing.

Or use a regular shell holder. Every thing else works except the automated ejecting!

[wv109323]

I use the APP for decapping 9mm before I wet tumble. I use a universal decapper so there is no resizing during decapping. I also have the 4 feed tubes with funnel.
There are several malfunctions but the press works about 90% of the time. The shell holder is some of the problem. The incoming case does not push the decapped case out of shell holder, rather the case is tilted and does not slide the case out of the shell holder.
There is also a tendency for cases to get into the tubes upside down.
Remind you I am processing range pickup brass. There are issues of keeping the shell holder and feeding mechanism clean. The tolerances of the shell holder are loose.
Previously ,I resized and decapped on the APP but it was tough on the muscles, so I got the universal decapping die. You can rip the rim off the case if you resize, but not that often.
I started decapping before cleaning for three reasons.
1. The wet tumbling gets the primer pocket clean.
2. Water does not stay in the primer pocket, which caused me to load some rounds where the primer pocket did not completely dry out. The water/moisture killed the new primer.
3. Primers that have been exposed to wet tumbling have a tendency to decap the end of the primer and the sides stays in the primer pocket.
All in all I would buy the press again for what I use it for.

[Valley-Shooter]

I have 2 x shellholders for 9mm. One is loose with the shell. It has caused some distortion of the rim when sizing. The second one fits perfect and has caused no problems.

[deces]

The 9mm & 10mm rounds share the same shell holder on Lee products, you can imagine where the problem is. Lee should probably make a dedicated 9mm xpress shell holder since it's such a popular round.

[megasupermagnum]

I'm not sure what "auto ejecting" problems you could have on an APP. The next case pushes out the one in front of it. They then fall right down the chute. It's a beautifully simple concept that seems to work flawlessly. While the APP would work with a regular shell holder, you would be wasting your time. A regular single stage with a shell kicker would be faster.

One issue the early X shell holders had was they did not have a big enough relief for imperfections such as backed out or cratered primers. That might be part of the problem people have. The new versions are way better.

[deces]

I'm not sure what "auto ejecting" problems you could have on an APP. The next case pushes out the one in front of it. They then fall right down the chute. It's a beautifully simple concept that seems to work flawlessly. While the APP would work with a regular shell holder, you would be wasting your time. A regular single stage with a shell kicker would be faster.

One issue the early X shell holders had was they did not have a big enough relief for imperfections such as backed out or cratered primers. That might be part of the problem people have. The new versions are way better.

His feed spring might be upside down or he is short stroking it. I've seen where people an aerosol spray tube inside of the coiled spring, but I doubt that is the remedy needed here.

[poppy42]

I'm not sure what "auto ejecting" problems you could have on an APP. The next case pushes out the one in front of it. They then fall right down the chute. It's a beautifully simple concept that seems to work flawlessly. While the APP would work with a regular shell holder, you would be wasting your time. A regular single stage with a shell kicker would be faster.

One issue the early X shell holders had was they did not have a big enough relief for imperfections such as backed out or cratered primers. That might be part of the problem people have. The new versions are way better.

Don’t know if you’re referring to my post or not. If you are, My issue is not that I’ve had a problem with auto ejecting cases. It’s that if you use the x shell holders while sizing brass, you can wind up with stuck cases because they don’t grab enough of the rim. I’ve had this issue with 5.56 in particular. If you read the fine print Lee warns of this issue and recommends that you not use the x shell holders for this process. If you use a standard shell holder there is no issue, other than you have to manually remove the case from the show holder. It still feeds the cases, you just have to Manually remove the one initial holder before you feed the next one! Just thought I would clarify. If you weren’t referring to my post no big deal I still clarified what I meant. Hope this helps.
As I’ve posted many many many times I love the app press and all its features. And personally I have not found any issues other than those caused by the operator. In other words me! Lol

[deces]

Don’t know if you’re referring to my post or not. If you are, My issue is not that I’ve had a problem with auto ejecting cases. It’s that if you use the x shell holders while sizing brass, you can wind up with stuck cases because they don’t grab enough of the rim. I’ve had this issue with 5.56 in particular. If you read the fine print Lee warns of this issue and recommends that you not use the x shell holders for this process. If you use a standard shell holder there is no issue, other than you have to manually remove the case from the show holder. It still feeds the cases, you just have to Manually remove the one initial holder before you feed the next one! Just thought I would clarify. If you weren’t referring to my post no big deal I still clarified what I meant. Hope this helps.
As I’ve posted many many many times I love the app press and all its features. And personally I have not found any issues other than those caused by the operator. In other words me! Lol

Lee shellholders are pretty soft, you could probably pinch the gap of the shellholder to fit tighter on a .556, in a decent vise and it would work perfectly. Might want to get a second one before trying this.

[joebaja]

I've run many thousands of range pickup 9mm cases through the APP for both decapping prior to wet clean, and sizing. Decapping with the universal decapper die is low drag - as mentioned previously, so they tend to flow through well. Provided you have the height of the feeder dialed in exactly right where the cases don't get hung up and tilt coming in to the shell holder. I have had a handful get stuck in the sizing die. After punching them out, inspection always shows a pretty banged up rim. Those go in the recycle box. I figure if the shell holder won't grab it, there is a chance the extractor in my pistol won't either, and 9mm range brass is abundant.

Also, not to wander off from the original ask, but poppy42's idea of feeding into a standard shell holder for sizing rifle brass is outstanding. I'm more than a little embarrassed that never occurred to me.

[poppy42]

Also, not to wander off from the original ask, but poppy42's idea of feeding into a standard shell holder for sizing rifle brass is outstanding. I'm more than a little embarrassed that never occurred to me.[/QUOTE]

I can’t take the credit. I missed it myself. I went back and re-read the instructions ( several times I may add )and Low and behold Lee specifically says to not use the X shell holders. Lol

[poppy42]

Lee shellholders are pretty soft, you could probably pinch the gap of the shellholder to fit tighter on a .556, in a decent vise and it would work perfectly. Might want to get a second one before trying this.

I could be wrong but I seriously doubt that would work. Squeezing together and advice and you’re probably not gonna feed the cases properly. I’ve opted for following the instructions and using a regular shell holder.

[Kenstone]

Since the Lee #19 shell holders are machined big enough to use for 40S&W, the rims of 9mm pull thru the X shell holder when attempting to resize.
The #19 shell plates on the Pro 1000 cause other problems in that the 9mm loose fit can flip primers and does not center the case under the dies and they bump into the sizing die and expander plug.

Others have discovered using a #6 shell plate in the Pro 1000 centers the case better because it fits the 9mm case rim better, although it does require some modification.
I believe using a #6 x-press shell holder for sizing 9mm in an APP will work and the cases will not be pull-out of it.

This will only cost you $5 to try, so why not try it?
https://www.titanreloading.com/produ...hell-holder-6/
jmo,
.
Edit: I believe the #4 shell holder has potential for working for 9mm sizing on the APP too but I don't have an APP to prove this out.
https://www.titanreloading.com/produ...hell-holder-4/
.

[poppy42]

Just in case Anyone has any doubts about what I’ve been posting here it is copied right Out of the Lee app press instructions

X-PRESS shell holders make
The X-PRESS shell holder allows
easy automation on the APP press,
however, the pass through design
reduces the amount of “pull” that
can be applied to the cartridge. That
said, we do not recommend full
length resizing rimless bottle neck
cases. If you insist, we suggest using only Lee dies and Lee case resizing lubricant # 90006. Only Lee dies include a built-in stuck case remover in the event you damage a rim and stick a case.

I can’t speak about any other calibers. The problems I’ve had have been specifically with 556. And only when full length sizing. Can’t neck size for a semi automatic. My 556 dies were Hornaday ( I recently found a great deal on new RCBS dies for less than Lee and replaced my old Hornaday) and not Lee. After a half a dozen stuck cases I figured I better reread and figure out what I was doing wrong. Switch out the X shell holder with the regular one it’s a little slower but it doesn’t bother me.
Like I’ve posted many many many many many times! I’ve de-capped well over 10,000 cases on my app press! Probably closer to 20,000 considering last month when I just did 9 mm it was 4000 cases. As far as calipers, everything from 380 up to 30-06 with no problems! Size bullets for basically the same calibers. Bulge busted. Remove military crimps. And the list goes on. I’ve really never bothered to size my pistol brass on the app press it doesn’t really make it any faster to me as I use a lee turret press. I really don’t think it saves me any time to size with the app press. As a matter of fact for most of my straight walled pistol brassI don’t even have the de-capping pin in the sizing die anymore. Most of, if not all, of my pistol brass is range pick up. And zero dirty brass goes through any of my sizing dies. So all my brass rifle or pistol gets Decapped with universal D capping die. Even my bottle neck rifle brass gets de-capped and cleaned before it touches a sizing die.
I really love my app press!!!!!!!

[deces]

Since the Lee #19 shell holders are machined big enough to use for 40S&W, the rims of 9mm pull thru the X shell holder when attempting to resize.
The #19 shell plates on the Pro 1000 cause other problems in that the 9mm loose fit can flip primers and does not center the case under the dies and they bump into the sizing die and expander plug.

Others have discovered using a #6 shell plate in the Pro 1000 centers the case better because it fits the 9mm case rim better, although it does require some modification.
I believe using a #6 x-press shell holder for sizing 9mm in an APP will work and the cases will not be pull-out of it.

This will only cost you $5 to try, so why not try it?
https://www.titanreloading.com/produ...hell-holder-6/
jmo,
.
Edit: I believe the #4 shell holder has potential for working for 9mm sizing on the APP too but I don't have an APP to prove this out.
https://www.titanreloading.com/produ...hell-holder-4/
.

Thanks for posting this, I watched a video a couple months ago of some guy tweaking his load master and he did this, I just couldn't remember the details.

[dverna]

Great feedback guys!!!

I do not need to resize on the APP as the cases will be reloaded on a progressive. I will resize on the first station of the progressive as "normal".

If the Six Pack runs without issue, I will not need the APP anyway. Great idea Kenstone wrt using the #6 shell holder!

BTW, I am getting a bit pumped up about trying out the new Lee press.

[JeffinTD]

Running 9mm to deprime in mine, I will sometimes have a case not get pushed out of the shell holder. This is only with brass I purchased that had been cleaned but not deprimed.

It appears to me what is happening is cleaning media in the flash hole gets smashed between the decap pin and anvil, and causes primer suck (primer gets stuck on the decap pin and pulled partly back into the primer pocket).

Since I’ve automated my Lee, the result is usually the jaws drop the next case along side the case stuck on the shell plate, which then gets crunched if I don’t hit the stop switch in time…

If it isn’t running well with uncleaned cases, generally the screw on the bottom of the slider is working loose, allowing the top part to tip as the spring pulls, instead of being fully pulled over the shell holder.

Hope this makes sense…