Is .44 mag "difficult" to load down for?

[Milky Duck]

if you look at reloading charts from powder manufacturers it is very interesting indeed...
when I built a .45/70 the logical thing to do was start with lower pressure loads and creep up slowly...easy thinks I....trailboss is in cabinet,we shall use this...ERRRR WRONG!!!!!!! to achieve same velocity the TB loads were higher pressure than using AR2208 ..... so it didnt get used... I went with black powder for slower loads and keep the small amount of 2208 for hot loads.
TB is dead simple to use and is a lot of fun...in fact if you can get it,something around 5-6-7grns in the 30/30 behind a 150ish weight projectile will have your plinking sorted and fun had by all....I say 5-6-7 because the 5 was used in 7.62x39mm case and 8 is pretty normal in .308 case to achieve a load close to just barely subsonic....eg very quiet but not mouse fart silly quiet.use std primers not the magnum ones or the amount of power used to keep load quiet goes down to stupidly light amounts..the difference is 1-2grns!!!!!!!

[Mint]

Not possible.. Pressure equals FPS.. Period.. "peak" and pressure along with Time... have an Effect..
Think "slap" and "push".. For any Given Projectile...
Cast go faster with a given pressure applied...due to less Friction..
Use your Chronograph!!! Compare.. take Notes.. Remember, No Free lunch!!!

I should have phrased my question differently. What I meant to say is:

if something can attain higher velocity at less MAX/PEAK pressure, this means it is a slower burning powder correct?

[racepres]

I should have phrased my question differently. What I meant to say is:

Maybe..
Since I do Not have the equipment to Measure such goings on... I will Not claim to Know..
I use what Works..and a little bit (all I gots) of common sense..
If My Chrono shows more FPS for a given projectile/cartridge, than others report...I assume.. even without measuring equipment,.. that my Pressure is excessive..

[Mint]

Maybe..
Since I do Not have the equipment to Measure such goings on... I will Not claim to Know..
I use what Works..and a little bit (all I gots) of common sense..
If My Chrono shows more FPS for a given projectile/cartridge, than others report...I assume.. even without measuring equipment,.. that my Pressure is excessive..

That's good

In the case of what the person I was replying to said:

It gets H110 velocities with less than H110 pressures

One thing that I do know is higher velocities can be attained by lower peak pressure, simply because the pressure builds up inside quicker than the pressure decreases from the chamber volume increasing due to the bullet leaving the barrel. A fast burning powder can generate very large pressures before the bullet hardly travels. In a slower powder, the pressure builds more slowly, and the bullet has more time to move to decrease pressure, so the peak pressure can be less but the average pressure (as far as I know) will always be more.

I was mostly wondering if this were the ONLY situation where the statement I quoted is true (all other things being equal, like barrel length, etc)

[JoeJames]

Do you have to trim them after awhile or they just dont need to be trimmed forever?

Been reloading pistol rounds for @40 years, and never have seen a reason to trim them unlike say 556/223 or 308. Straight wall pistol cases are wonderful compared to bottle neck rifle cases.

[Mint]

Been reloading pistol rounds for @40 years, and never have seen a reason to trim them unlike say 556/223 or 308. Straight wall pistol cases are wonderful compared to bottle neck rifle cases.

Ok, that's what this reloading manual said but still.......... 40 years of reloading LMAO, just had to be sure. That just blows my mind. You been reloading a single piece of brass longer than I have been alive.

[JoeJames]

Ok, that's what this reloading manual said but still.......... 40 years of reloading LMAO, just had to be sure. That just blows my mind. You been reloading a single piece of brass longer than I have been alive.

Well it's not like I have solely been reloading the same 50 rounds. But they have cycled back and forth over the years. 25 or 30 years ago I used to shoot with the East Arkansas Peace Officers Assn. at their regular pistol shoots (wheelguns). They used to have bunches of donated prizes - I always went for factory reloaded 38 Special ammo wadcutters and semi-wadcutters. That was probably the last factory loaded pistol ammo I got.

[DougGuy]

Just to make sure my simple beginner reloading brain has this correct... if something can attain higher velocity at less pressure, this means it is a slower burning powder correct? Can anything else effect that?

I'm sure it can, as any variable seems to leave a mark somewhere in the scheme of things. I don't have pressure testing equipment, but reading up on LilGun you may find some explanations that may address your question.

[Moleman-]

Rarely over the years have I had to trim 44mag, but not never. I think the last time I set up the case trimmer and went through all of my fired brass was before I was a father and my youngest is in highschool. I have spot trimmed a batch here and there if they were longer than I like to use. The 400 cases on my desk each had about 10-15 per 100rnd box that were over the max case length. Luckily I've got enough cases to just swap them with the same headstamp from another box and worry about trimming them another day.

Another thing to be mindful of is the hornady cases that come loaded with their 225FTX are 1.255" and not the standard 1.275" trim to-1.285" max case length.

[Mint]

Rarely over the years have I had to trim 44mag, but not never. I think the last time I set up the case trimmer and went through all of my fired brass was before I was a father and my youngest is in highschool. I have spot trimmed a batch here and there if they were longer than I like to use. The 400 cases on my desk each had about 10-15 per 100rnd box that were over the max case length. Luckily I've got enough cases to just swap them with the same headstamp from another box and worry about trimming them another day.

Another thing to be mindful of is the hornady cases that come loaded with their 225FTX are 1.255" and not the standard 1.275" trim to-1.285" max case length.

I bought 1000 starline .44 mag brass. Do you think I should check each one when I get them? I have read in this reloading book I should trim them when I first buy them

[Kosh75287]

Just to make sure my simple beginner reloading brain has this correct... if something can attain higher velocity at less pressure, this means it is a slower burning powder correct? Can anything else effect that?

I think that's GENERALLY correct for propellants, particularly when all other factors are as equal as possible. I'd ALSO not be surprised that some of them may be exceptions to that. No example comes to mind, but the moment that I tell you it's a hard & fast rule, I'll be blind-sided by the mention of one that does NOT act thus.

[Moleman-]

I bought 1000 starline .44 mag brass. Do you think I should check each one when I get them? I have read in this reloading book I should trim them when I first buy them

I'd run them through your sizer and check the lengths on them. Son bought 1000 starline 45 Colt for his Henry over the summer. They had very little bullet tension until sized, so we ran them through the progressive with a sizer in station #1 even though they were new. He checked the lengths, but they were all very uniform. I had some Remington 44mag I got from MidwayUSA from back in the early 90's that weren't very uniform for length though.

Another thing on case longevity. Was at the local gun store in the early 90's and they had a bunch of fired 44 mag brass in MTM 100rnd boxes. The boxes were labeled well showing many reloads going back at least to the mid 80's by it turns out a guy named Greg who was a coworker. He was very detail orentated and had even filled in the headstamps with different colors of paint to keep the boxes of brass separate. He was going through a divorce and his wife sold all of his gun stuff. I bought about 10 boxes of 44mag and 45acp boxes. The next time I saw Greg I mention this and tried to give him back his ammo boxes which he declined. I'm reminded of that every time I run across some of that brass that has red, green or blue paint in the headstamp.

[downzero]

Not only is the answer to your question no, you shouldn't be shooting crazy hot loads in your 1873 either. A Winchester 1873 was never made to be a 357 Magnum. With modern metal it might hold up okay, but it isn't a design I'd be hot rodding. I only shoot cowboy loads in mine.

[Mint]

Not only is the answer to your question no, you shouldn't be shooting crazy hot loads in your 1873 either. A Winchester 1873 was never made to be a 357 Magnum. With modern metal it might hold up okay, but it isn't a design I'd be hot rodding. I only shoot cowboy loads in mine.

Thanks for looking out. I only shoot low power loads in my .357 1873 (loaded by someone else, soon to be myself). The topic of this post is an 1892 though (I'll be shooting both low and high power loads in that)

[Mint]

Well it's not like I have solely been reloading the same 50 rounds. But they have cycled back and forth over the years. 25 or 30 years ago I used to shoot with the East Arkansas Peace Officers Assn. at their regular pistol shoots (wheelguns). They used to have bunches of donated prizes - I always went for factory reloaded 38 Special ammo wadcutters and semi-wadcutters. That was probably the last factory loaded pistol ammo I got.

Lol I'm retarded, I misread it. But I thought about it a moment and it seemed really crazy... but if you had something like 5000 rounds, and you could load brass 40+ times, I could see it as a possibility

[M-Tecs]

One of the more graphic examples peak pressure verse powders longer pressure curves are Trail Boss loads. In some loads like below Trail Boss tends to produce lower velocities for equal pressures or higher pressures than most other powders. This is straight from the Hodgdon reloading data center for 45 Colt.

https://www.hodgdonreloading.com/reloading-data-center

250 GR. CAST LRNFP
Hodgdon Trail Boss 0.452" 1.600" 5.8 727fps 12,700 PSI
IMR PB 0.452" 1.600" 6.8 875fps 12,700 PSI
IMR SR 4756 0.452" 1.600" 9.0 864fps 12,200 PSI

If pressure curves did not make a difference the velocity would be equal for the same pressures. They are not.

[Mint]

Hodgdon Trail Boss	0.452"	1.600"	5.8	727fps	12,700 PSI
IMR PB	0.452"	1.600"	6.8	875fps	12,700 PSI
IMR SR 4756	0.452"	1.600"	9.0	864fps	12,200 PSI

Fixed your formatting

[M-Tecs]

Hodgdon Trail Boss	0.452"	1.600"	5.8	727fps	12,700 PSI
IMR PB	0.452"	1.600"	6.8	875fps	12,700 PSI
IMR SR 4756	0.452"	1.600"	9.0	864fps	12,200 PSI

Fixed your formatting

Thanks. When I type it the format is correct however when I post it the format is compressed. Same for cut and paste using tabs. This is not the first time I have had that issue. What's your secret?

[Mint]

Thanks. When I type it the format is correct however when I post it the format is compressed. Same for cut and paste using tabs. This is not the first time I have had that issue. What's your secret?

It's rather painstaking but if you go to reply, and then "go to advanced", there is an icon at the top under where you bold something, that looks like a white box. It lets you insert a table.

[tr]...[/tr] means a row, and [td]...[/td] means text within a cell.

Its easier though if you just use this, which generates the code for you

https://www.teamopolis.com/tools/bbc...generator.aspx

[wilecoyote]

I bought 1000 starline .44 mag brass. Do you think I should check each one when I get them? I have read in this reloading book I should trim them when I first buy them

I would size them all, then verifying and, if necessary, trimming them with a Lee .44mag. case gauge & trimmer combo.
this will ensure the uniform height and, once loaded, the same crimp for all_