1894 Reference

[William Yanda]

I was surprised to find that an air rifle, capable of firing an expanding lead bullet was the murder weapon in A Conan Doyle's "The Adventure of the Empty House". It was set in 1894 London, the gun allegedly invented by a German.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Historically, there have been some powerful air rifles. The Austrians invented and fielded one used against the Germans which was reported to be lethal from 125 to 150 yards, called the Girardoni rifle. It was in use as early as 1780 and remained in their inventory until 1815. One of these rifles was used by the Lewis & Clark expedition and was often used to kill deer. It was a repeater, and the air reservoir was in the butt.

DG

[georgerkahn]

Historically, there have been some powerful air rifles. The Austrians invented and fielded one used against the Germans which was reported to be lethal from 125 to 150 yards, called the Girardoni rifle. It was in use as early as 1780 and remained in their inventory until 1815. One of these rifles was used by the Lewis & Clark expedition and was often used to kill deer. It was a repeater, and the air reservoir was in the butt.

DG

DG -- I am always more than impressed with the wealth of knowledge you obviously have, and most grateful you elect to share! In the, "more you know, the more questions come up: e.g., the less you know" -- waaaay back in 1780 HOW did they get the air pressure high enough to propel the projectile? (I gave up efforts with a Hill IV pump, using since an electric air compressor ).
What spins through my mind is the requisite smooth machining necessary to enable the "washer" -- probably an animal skin part which, upon spring release pressurizes the air sufficiently to then, upon sear release, send the projectile down the barrel... With any roughness, said sealer would not be sustainable for even a few "shots"...
And, also spinning in my dysfunctional mind: The tempering of the spring within, and super-muscles necessary and sufficient to cock it...
Again -- thanks VERY much for your comment -- and I'd really appreciate learning a tad or two more.
geo

[jreidthompson1]

https://youtu.be/2dZLeEUE940

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[georgerkahn]

Thank you jreidthompson1 for this post, answering many of my questions! The YouTube presenter many times used the word, "ingenious" describing the arm, and he was not being conservative! "Wowsers!" Using the accompanying pump he indicated it would take 1,500 pumps to get air cylinder up to 800-850 psi, which would take about twenty minutes.
A memory from my sicko past I recall a cartoon of one GI with his trousers down in a pooping-position while his buddy -- firing his M1 -- is shouting, "come on, soldier -- I can't fend them off by myself" (or similar -- sooo many years back I do not recall exact wording )
Thank you again for these enlightening bits of info!
geo

[Bent Ramrod]

Dr. Watson’s description implies an underlever spring-cocker that definitely wouldn’t pass the 12.5 foot-pound (whatever it is) limit for air rifles in England now. Col. Moran would have to get a Firearms Certificate for that thing nowadays.

“An admirable and unique weapon, noiseless and of tremendous power; I knew Von Herder, the blind German mechanic, who constructed it to the order of the late Professor Moriarty.”

—Sherlock Holmes

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Ahhh....Moriarty again...evil incarnate! George, I'm glad jreidthompson1 provided the link, as my post contained just about everything I know about the Girardoni rifle. I did recall that it took over 1,000 pumps to charge the rifle, but how the craftsmen of that early day were able to achieve such a precision seal is beyond me. In reading about the Lewis & Clark expedition I recall that the extended pumping was a complaint of some of the members. The current resurgence of interest in high powered air rifles is worthy of note.

DG

[georgerkahn]

Ahhh....Moriarty again...evil incarnate! George, I'm glad jreidthompson1 provided the link, as my post contained just about everything I know about the Girardoni rifle. I did recall that it took over 1,000 pumps to charge the rifle, but how the craftsmen of that early day were able to achieve such a precision seal is beyond me. In reading about the Lewis & Clark expedition I recall that the extended pumping was a complaint of some of the members. The current resurgence of interest in high powered air rifles is worthy of note.

DG

...and God bless the inventor and manufacturers of electric hi-pressure air compressors!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I generally fill my PCP's at/to 2,300 pounds. Assuming it took 1,500 pumps and twenty minutes to attain the 850psi (antique) marvel -- *IF* the steel could withstand higher pressures, how many pumps would be required to get to even two thousand? Before I "went electric", by my third fill (for an Air Arms T200 10 meter Target rifle) I'd literally have my belly on the handle using my 215 pounds to lower the Hill pump handle for the last hundred or so psi pressure!
geo

[Camba]

I am not understanding how can you shoot 22 lead balls with one tank (or two for that matter) with an 850 PSI charge in the tank. Unless they were shot at slingshot velocities and even then.
Modern pcp rifles in that caliber shoots about 4 shot with steady velocities and a few more at lower psi values.
I want one like that!
Excellent discussion!
Camba


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[boog]

It looks like to me, that the tank is much larger than our pcp tanks. I would assume/guess that would give more shots.

Some of the smaller pcp rifles will give multi shots. Like the Seneca Ealgle Claw.

I agree that this is an awesome discussion!

[Bent Ramrod]

Any one interested in the mechanics of the old time airguns should get a copy of Air Guns and Air Pistols by L. Wesley. He was able to scrounge guns, accessories and parts from the 18th century onward, and fix them up and study them.

Some of these things were “of tremendous power,” all right; I recall that he blew up his fireplace with one, test-firing it in his living room, early in his collecting career. It was only air, right?

The valves were made of horn, carefully lapped together for an airtight fit, and the gunsmiths lined the air tanks with a film of grease, which served to trap the dust that came in with the air to preserve the valves for as long as possible.

It did take a lot to pump up those tanks. There were bicycle pedal arrangements that allowed one to sit while pumping, sort of like people now with stationary bicycles. Time was a more elastic concept back then; no rush to drop the kids off for their Participation Trophy ceremony and still get back in time for your Spin Class. If they had the job, they had the time.

Also, truth be told, people were much more cognizant of what human beings were capable of, in the absence of machinery to foist the work off on, and if they had to pump away with their hands and arms, they just got onto it. Sort of like the model engineer in one of my books, looking at a forged lump of metal in the vise and saying to himself, “It’s going to take 1697 file strokes on this to get where I want, and they ain’t gonna happen by themselves.”