Two Novel Loadings for .45 ACP Revolver

[Oyeboten]

Had the inspiration the other day to load some .45 ACP with lighter than usual Bullets, for fun with my S & W and Colt M1917 Revolvers.

Left is a 141 Grain .454 Ball, ran through a Sizing Die to be .452 with a resulting nice little flat Belly-Band to crimp to ( with no convenient way to Lube, other than I will Lube the lower portion of the exposed part ).

Right is a 165 Grain DEWC -

Charge of Propellant is 7 Grains of 'Unique' for both.

In reviewing various Loading Tables, this seemed to me to be a sensible charge to deliver around or a little over 1000 FPS with these Lighter than usual Bullets, which I felt ought to be no more pressure than Standard Loading with usual 230 Grain Hardball.

Does my reasoning sound alright?

I'll put a new Battery in the long neglected Chronograph, and see what they do soon, and report back with their FPS.

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[ryanmattes]

Polycoat tat round ball, that's all the lube you need.

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[Mytmousemalibu]

I did something similar with. 380acp some time ago to make a fun little "mouse fart" load or gallery load if you will.i used some 00 buckshot I cast and a sprinkle of fast burning powder. I think it was some like 1.0gr of Titewad. It might have beed Vectan A0 or 800X too. It worked, made a fun little plinker load. I tried a bare ball with 45-45-10 lube and some PC'ed with HF red. I did try sizing them and as you discoverd makes a little ring to seat to but i had better accuracy without sizing the buckshot.

[35remington]

Generally speaking, the faster you shoot a roundball the more poorly they shoot. Given the possible uses of such loadings I’d use less of a different powder, such as Bullseye.

Point of impact will be annoyingly low in fixed sighted revolvers. Velocity will not make them hit to the sights whether the velocity be raised or lowered.

[Sasquatch-1]

One things for sure, with the first round there will be NO keyholing.

[Oyeboten]

I did something similar with. 380acp some time ago to make a fun little "mouse fart" load or gallery load if you will.i used some 00 buckshot I cast and a sprinkle of fast burning powder. I think it was some like 1.0gr of Titewad. It might have beed Vectan A0 or 800X too. It worked, made a fun little plinker load. I tried a bare ball with 45-45-10 lube and some PC'ed with HF red. I did try sizing them and as you discoverd makes a little ring to seat to but i had better accuracy without sizing the buckshot.

Did they feed okay?

I'll try my Round Ball ones in my Colt Government Model, see if they will feed!

I used to load .38 Special with two Balls, 360 ish ones, sized down a little and a good Crimp on the end one, but I worried about the inner one creeping down so I only did this with Black Powder and good compression.

They worked very well and were quite accurate, leaving one neat Hole in Paper Targets...the two Balls did not drift apart at any Range or distance I tried them at.

Did the same with .45 Colt also, same result, one Hole, no matter the distance...and, quite accurate! Black Powder...

Of course, two 141 Grain, .454 Lead Balls, is a little "heavy" for .45 Colt, but over Black Powder and a less than full charge for their taking up more room than a usual Bullet would, I did not think it would matter.

[Oyeboten]

Generally speaking, the faster you shoot a roundball the more poorly they shoot. Given the possible uses of such loadings I’d use less of a different powder, such as Bullseye.

Point of impact will be annoyingly low in fixed sighted revolvers. Velocity will not make them hit to the sights whether the velocity be raised or lowered.

I'll see!

I want about 1050 FPS for the Balls ( and about 1000 for the little DEWC ), so, I'll see how they do, and how they are for accuracy at 10 and 25 Yards.

Of course, 'Cap & Ball' Revolvers can be very accurate with Ball, but their Rifling is made for that, while the Rifling in my S & W and Colt M1917s, was made for "Full Metal Patch", and is a lot shallower.

[Oyeboten]

One things for sure, with the first round there will be NO keyholing.

I had not thought about that before!

You are quite right!!

[ShooterAZ]

Thinned LLA works really well with those round ball loads, just a light coat is all you need. You want to be sure to let it completely dry first. Bullseye powder "might" be better suited to these type of gallery loads, I have had great accuracy at short ranges with RB loads in 45AR cases. I'm not pushing them to 1000fps though. My loads are 700-750fps +/- and will give respectable groups even out to 25 yards. They are a lot of fun for sure.

[Texas by God]

I've killed squirrels with a 1917 S&W and round ball loads. I used LLA and Bulleye and they shot quite well at close range. They would not function my 1927 Argentine. 45 auto.

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[OBXPilgrim]

Definitely something else I need to try.

[rockrat]

I used to shoot RB's out of a Star "P" with good results and functioned well. I also used a lighter load in a 45acp Ruger Blackhawk using bullseye

[oldsalt444]

I've used that 165 gr. wadcutter. It's from Matt's Bullets. It is not a DEWC. Since it has a crimp groove, it should be loaded as you have it pictured. However, I absolutely love that bullet in my S&W 25. In fact I had a custom mold made to copy it. I use it for bullseye competition. Wonderfully accurate at 25 yards over 3.5 gr WST or 3.2 Red Dot. Have Matt's size them to .454 for better accuracy. Throats tend to run a bit larger than the bore, especially in earlier S&W revolvers.

[Oyeboten]

I used to shoot RB's out of a Star "P" with good results and functioned well. I also used a lighter load in a 45acp Ruger Blackhawk using bullseye

Oh my!


What vintage is or was your 'Star' Model P?

I have long wanted one, never have found one in good enough shape.

I have a 'Star' Model M which is a joy...and I load for it!

[Oyeboten]

I've used that 165 gr. wadcutter. It's from Matt's Bullets. It is not a DEWC. Since it has a crimp groove, it should be loaded as you have it pictured. However, I absolutely love that bullet in my S&W 25. In fact I had a custom mold made to copy it. I use it for bullseye competition. Wonderfully accurate at 25 yards over 3.5 gr WST or 3.2 Red Dot. Have Matt's size them to .454 for better accuracy. Throats tend to run a bit larger than the bore, especially in earlier S&W revolvers.

What fun!

I do not even remember getting the little Box of these 165 Grain Wadcutters, I've had them quite a few years...but, you are right, they are not 'DEWC' since they have the Crimp Groove.

Having Matt size them to .454 would be very nice, good idea!

I am intending to soon Load for my "converted" 2nd Model HE, S & W .455 Webley originally, then 'converted' to .45 ACP / .45 Auto-Rim, and it will want .454 or even .455 if possible, and I do have Molds for a few .455 "Heavies", but no Molds for any small light ones.

Matts Bullets is sure a nice place for getting Hand Gun Bullets one does not have a Mold for..!

[Nazgul]

I load 45 Colt for my single action with a small charge of AA #5, a cardboard wad, rice, another wad sealed with glue. Use them for wood bees in the spring. It is a hoot to nail them in flight. Works to about 4 feet.

Don

[cwlongshot]

What about the old (forgotten) Lyman mold numbers. 452389 and 454309???

CW

[Oyeboten]

What about the old (forgotten) Lyman mold numbers. 452389 and 454309???

CW

Yes! - 454 309 I do have! And I have a few Hundred of them Cast from early last Summer's Casting times.

I also have the 452 389 Mold! But I have not cast any from it yet.

I have a nice .456 Mold for the early 'Himmelwright' Spire Nose Wadcutter, which I assume was meant for the Webley Target Revolvers, or, for .45 Colt Target Revolvers in .455, or, for the S & W 'New Century' or 2nd Model Hand Ejector Target Models when in .455 Webley ( but sadly I do not have any .45 Target Revolvers of any kind - though I do hope to have one eventually! )

But, these are "Heavies" though, ( or relatively so ) and I will Load them also, sometime soon..!



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[Oyeboten]

This Week though, I am all about "What can I do with .45 ACP "Light Bullet" Loadings.

Next week, I'll be "What can I do with .45 ACP expanded to accept .455 anything, for 'converted' S & W 2nd Model HE which was originally in .455 Webley, but got 'converted' to .45 ACP / Auto-Rim", so as to at least have right fitting Bullets / Boolits.

[Walks]

Back in the early 1990's some Cowboy Shooters experimented with a very deep seated 185-200gr bullet in the .45Colt. They seated the bullet so that the nose was almost below the case mouth and used a very small powder charge. This was long before the .S&W Schofield and shorter cases were introduced. Thankfully back in those days the wild bunch still believed in "Spirit of the Game" and the practice was declared illegal.
The #452389 or #452488 cast of COWW & fully seated in the Schofield case makes a nice easy load over a light charge of Titegroup. In a ACP or AR case it can be made even lighter. And with an appropriate spring, in a 1911 will still function in the ACP case.