Redding's new policy - Make junk

[flutedchamber]

I got rid of my Pro-Jector about a month after I got it back from Hornady. I sold it to a friend (and he still is a friend!!) for parts. Yes, the priming system left a lot to be desired, but was workable for the short time that mine fed primers.

Hornady makes great projectiles but I don't care for their dies and presses. No experience with their powder measures or other goodies.

[monadnock#5]

IIRC, it was in the 80's that Richard Lee got into it with RCBS on the subject of press strength. RCBS advertised the strongest, toughest presses. Mr. Lee's response was "who cares?". It was Mr. Lee's assertion that Lee presses were every bit as capable of producing loaded rounds as RCBS, even if not as powerfully built. Now gentlemen, this was a brilliant marketing strategy beneficial to both parties. Brilliant because it deflected the consumer's attention from the real question. "Who makes the best press on the market in terms of bullet/ boolit to case concentricity and on target accuracy?"

Does anyone know? I don't. By the way, if you haven't actually measured the concentricity of your loaded ammo, you're not qualified to have an opinion. Sorry. Please don't be offended, but opinion doesn't count here, only the numbers.

One would naturally assume that since "you get what you pay for" as a general rule, that a top of the line press would produce top of the line cartridges. In this example however, all Rick got for the money was headaches and insults.

So, the real question, I guess would be, would you be willing to pay double the price for a press GAURANTEED to produce cartridges with concentricity in the +/- .002 (to a side, .004 top to bottom) range. A bigger question to be answered would be, could the press manufacturers produce a press to those tolerances even at that price?

[flutedchamber]

If I owned a press that was off by .002 I would trash it. My older Rockchucker is out by .00025 center of die hole to center of ram. The ram is dead nut as far as being parallel to the die. My other RCBS presses are similar, tho my A4 is almost perfect in all planes. The winning vote goes to my Forster Co-ax. Barely a movement on the .0001 indicator no matter how you measure it. Being out by .002 is far too much for any press.

[Meatco1]

Ok, enough! I'm done with Redding also.

When they start slandering customers instead of repairing the problem, I have no need to buy their products.

Richard

[Buckshot]

..............Yup the Green Machine was somewhat of a sensation when it came out. I do believe it was the first truly PROGRESSIVE reloading press available to hobby reloaders (us) vs manufacturers. Oh sure there were other multi station presses out there. The CH companies "H" types come to mind, but you needed like 4 shellholders and had to manually move the case from station to station.

I also recall the Green Machine as being somewhat extravagant pricewise. I don't recall if it was me simply seeing the price or having the magazine article's author saying so. Most likely both. The was a gunshop close to where I was working in the late 70's and they had a Green Machine setup behind the counter that the owner's son used for loading 45ACP. He thought it was a great machine, so apparently had no issues or possibly was embarassed to say so if he did.

I kind of think that RCBS had a good idea but went with the engineer's (if he was an engineer) concept, instead of maybe having some oversight or attempts at re-design simplification. I know that sometimes in a series of proceedures the person working them out figures he has it done. He's made every effort to remove every unecessary movement or toolchange and is happy with the result. Then along comes the guy sweeping the floor. He watches the operation for a moment then says, "How come ya didn't do so and so instead of that"? The engineer then does the age old forehead thump with the palm of his hand after hearing the suggestion.

It's happened to me several times in trying to figure out how to accomplish something. Someone pops up with such a simple and easy approch you don't know whether to profusely thank them or choke'em

..............Buckshot

[quasi]

I don't think trashing Redding over one customers complaint is fair or smart. I have a lot of Redding equipment, and it is all first class.

Trashing RCBS over making products outside of the US is unreasonable also. If you only bought products made in the US, YOU WOULD NOT BE READING THIS BECAUSE YOU COULD NOT AFFORD A COMPUTER!

Do you think all of Lee's machines and the parts they contain are made in the US? How about all of the aluminum and plastic they use in their products?

Where does the lead from your wheel weights come from, the powder you burn, the walnut in your stocks, the gasoline in your vehicle...... ???

Give your head a shake.

[wizzbang]

I just received their catalog because I wrote to ask about their Lubri-sizer. I have had for a couple of years reloading equipment including the big boss press. No problems, however today may be another story.

[flutedchamber]

I don't think trashing Redding over one customers complaint is fair or smart. I have a lot of Redding equipment, and it is all first class.

Trashing RCBS over making products outside of the US is unreasonable also. If you only bought products made in the US, YOU WOULD NOT BE READING THIS BECAUSE YOU COULD NOT AFFORD A COMPUTER!

Do you think all of Lee's machines and the parts they contain are made in the US? How about all of the aluminum and plastic they use in their products?

Where does the lead from your wheel weights come from, the powder you burn, the walnut in your stocks, the gasoline in your vehicle...... ???

Give your head a shake.

So are you saying that inferior crap, whether made in the USA or abroad should be accepted? I realize that Canada imports many things that are made in the USA, but I still think that anyone in any country expects a reasonable level of quality and customer service. The whole thing has nothing to do with where a product is made or sold, rather the quality of a product and if a mistake takes place how the manufacturer handles the problem. Look for the union label.

[Steve E]

A couple of years ago I had a problem with a 257 Robt AI dies from them (no problem with my 280 Rem AI or 250 Sav AI dies). The dies were scratching my brass, I could clean and lube some fired brass and run them into the sizing die and it would come out with scratches on them. I took some brass and polished it up and made sure no scratches were on it then lubed and ran into the sizing die and out it came with scratches. Even brass fired in another gun would produce the same result, scratch pattern was the same on all thebrass. Sent it back to Redding and they sent me a nice letter saying the die was in perfect shape and that any problem was with my gun. I called them and the gentleman I spoke to was rather short with me and said the same thing after looking up my info.
Oh well since I have perfect dies I guess I'll have to learn to live with a bad rifle.

Steve E...........

[ntodawind]

Hi,
I am new here,
I was looking for information on an A4 press and have been looking for a strong single stage press for magnum rifle calibers. I have looked at the lyman Crush, Hornady lock & load, Reddding Big Boss as these Have 4 - 4 1/2" of work area and Just happened onto Your site which (am glad I did ). From Looking at all of these problems with the companies that manufactures the presses I really do not know which one press would be the best. I am and have since used my dillon XL650 since the mid 80's I have nothing but good things to say for dillon products. But i am now in the market for a single stage press. Any help would be fasinating!
Thanks,
Tim

[flutedchamber]

What a shame...you just missed a deal on a RCBS A4 on Ebay last week or the week before. I bought one that was still in the original box (new old stock) for less than $200 delivered about four years ago. They are an excellent press with plenty of throw for magnum cases.

Don't let what you read here discourage you. If you buy new and are not satisfied with the performance of a press or whatever the dealer that you bought it from will usually stand behind the product. If not and you purchased it with your credit card you can always complain to them.

Anyway...have you looked at the Forster Co-ax press?? It should have plenty of throw for the long cartridges and I have never heard anyone say anything bad about a Co-ax.

[ntodawind]

Hi,
Thanks for your reply I have found one for sale and I dont know what the spects. are on this press, do you know what the work space measurement is on this press? I have been casting my own bullets for about 6 months and need some tips on leading of the barrel on my .45 acp

[flutedchamber]

The press opening on the Co-ax is 4 1/4, which should be large enough to handle all but the African calibers in nitro express. I would not be without my Co-ax.

Leading in your pistol can be from a lot of things. Start with a clean bore...a VERY clean bore. Then try your loads. If it still leads, reduce the powder charge if you are running max charges. Other causes can be a rough bore (does it foul fast with jacketed bullets??) soft bullets, undersize bullets and bad or no lube.

What mix are you using for your bullets??

[cbrick]

Leading in your pistol can be from a lot of things. Start with a clean bore...a VERY clean bore. Then try your loads. If it still leads, reduce the powder charge if you are running max charges. Other causes can be a rough bore (does it foul fast with jacketed bullets??) soft bullets, undersize bullets and bad or no lube.

A bit off topic but . . . Pouring your own for a 45 ACP isn't nearly enough info to do much but guess at a cause but . . .

It's much more likely the bullets are too HARD rather than too soft.

Size about .0015" tp .002" over a "measured" groove dia., not a guess at what the groove dia. might be.

Most any decent lube will prevent leading at normal 45 ACP pressures and velocities "IF" the bullet fits properly.

Rick

[ntodawind]

flutedchamber,
Yes on the clean barrel, I used cerrosafe to cast the chamber and about 1' of the barrel to get a mesurement on the barrel which was .452 and that is the size of the sizer for the luber/sizer and it is a magma star unit. The mix is 19lbs ww and 1 lb of 50/50 solder and they measure around 6.5 - 7 on the seaco scale. I have played with the powder charge which changed the amount of leading but did not eliminate it. I am useing some lube I bought off the ebay called ( Jake's Ceresin Purple Lube)This is flustrating!
Thank You for any help,
Tim

[cbrick]

I have about 35 Star sizer dies and except for the last three they all size WW .0002" to .0003" under marked die diameter. The last three I got from magma size .0012" under marked diameter "with the same alloy". If this is the case with yours and your using a .452" die your sizing your bullets over .001" under your stated .452" groove diameter.

Do you have a good micrometer? Not calipers, a micrmeter.

Rick

[ntodawind]

I do have a good micrometer, So your telling me that my bullets are too small?
Thanks,
Tim

[flutedchamber]

Sounds like they are a bit small and perhaps too hard as he stated earlier.

[cbrick]

Tim, it sounds like small bullets, in addition to a larger size die you can also measure your die sets expander button to see what it is. If it's a little undersize (they all vary some) your not expanding the brass enough and seating the bullet can actually size down your bullets a bit more. Undersize bullets are guaranteed leading, they need to be .0015" to .002" "over" groove diameter.

Clip-on WW+ tin shouldn't be too hard unless he's shooting wuss loads.

Rick

[flutedchamber]

Although you don't hear about it much, I like the Lee hardness tester. It reads what the bullet strength is rated in pounds per square inch. I have used it a lot and never had it fail me.