Quality of equipment

[ILostMyGoat]

Hey guys I just got into casting, my first mold is a Lee 309-200. I’m casting for my 30-30. My question is do Lyman or ideal or any other “hi end” mold really perform that much better? What is it that makes them so much better? Thanks for the input!


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[Winger Ed.]

The biggest difference I've found is that Iron molds live longer and can take more abuse.
Nothing wrong with Lee molds, but you do need to be more careful with them as far as getting them too hot,
or banging them around.

[wilecoyote]

I have only been using Lee molds for about twenty years. quite user friendly, and I've never ruined one. they still work today better than I can shoot their bullets and do not rust. I'm probably not very picky, but no complains about these molds, while I would be more inclined to spend more in quality dies.

[ILostMyGoat]

I have only been using Lee molds for about twenty years. quite user friendly, and I've never ruined one. they still work today better than I can shoot their bullets and do not rust. I'm probably not very picky, but no complains about these molds, while I would be more inclined to spend more in quality dies.

What dies do you prefer?


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[wilecoyote]

it ever happened that I buy the Lee, easily available here, then inevitably I upgrade to Forster or Redding, and the Lee remain bolted on the Lee Turret or Pro1000 plates as a back-up.
Redding my 1st commercial choice, even more in a single stage press, if I can.

[Land Owner]

Remember, our reloading ancestors sat around a campfire, melted and poured lead (not alloy) into round ball-, then later WC-, SWC-, and Spitzer-molds, killed buffalo, bear, moose, caribou, elk, deer, hogs, and one-another with these "antiquated" by modern standard boolits, and today we "judge" ourselves by the touching of holes at 100 yards down range from equipment and materials that exceed BY FAR anything and everything our ancestors had available to them.

Your modern 30-30 is very forgiving in what it digests, and the killing power of that cartridge is not often argued, though trajectory, et al, is routinely compared to other calibers. Your "attention to detail" making boolits from the cheapest of molds, in reloading cartridges, in shooting, in forming personal confidence in yourself, your equipment, and your methods can be compared to making boolits from the most expensive molds, with very little noticeable difference.

Casting, reloading and shooting for accuracy is "an equation in many variables". Mastering these variables is the path we are all on Grasshopper...

[country gent]

The three basic materials for moulds are aluminum brass and steel.
aluminum: lighter in weight. Is the softest of the materials. Heats up fast and looses heat fast. Usually breaks in fast and casts well.
Brass: Heaviest of the materials. medium hardness, Takes longer to heat up but holds heat well and longer. May take a couple sessions to break in and cast the best. But they are normally very consistent when up and running.
Steel: hardest of the materials, heats and holds heat well, most durable, corrosion is an issue more so in some climates, Casts well and trouble free.

Like most things it is not the equipment as much as learning to use it and How.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Hey guys I just got into casting, my first mold is a Lee 309-200. I’m casting for my 30-30. My question is do Lyman or ideal or any other “hi end” mold really perform that much better? What is it that makes them so much better? Thanks for the input!

As to shooting performance:
A Rifle boolit needs to match the needs of your Rifle. Lee molds seem to have more variance/wider tolerance than other brands...If you get one that works in your Rifle, cherish it. Most other brands, you pay for machining preciseness, but you need to know what your rifle wants, to order the correct mold.

[Bazoo]

Lee moulds don’t have the finished details of other moulds. Often the sprue cutter will gouge the top of the mould and needs to be dressed for sharp edges and a bulge at the cutter hole. Lee moulds don’t have a set screw to lock the sprue pivot screw in place. Those are things that take a bit of time and raise cost. The lee handles on their two cavity moulds use cheap stamped metal and generic bolt. Nothing wrong with that, but that saves cost. Lyman uses its own thread pattern best I recall. Or maybe it’s an archaic thread no longer in common use. Lyman and lee will both need a b it if tuning right out of the box, lee will need more, sometimes a lot more.

My experience with RCBS is they will work right out of the box. Accurate moulds I’ve had the same experience, more so.

Lee moulds I consider 95%. They will have burrs most of the time, and need sprue plate tuning, and generally just need going over. I remove the burrs in the cavities with a bronze toothbrush. Once tuned up, which takes 20 minutes, you generally have a decent casting but inexpensive mould. I’ve been hit and miss with the diameters being what they should.

[1hole]

There is neither cause nor justification for damaging bullet molds so the material - iron, brass or aluminum - shouldn't matter.

Learning to make quality cast boolits and developing good loads with them takes time, experience and brains so holding start-up costs down until we get our feet on the ground is a good thing to do. "Experience", as such, can be deceptive. It doesn't much matter how many times we've done something, what matters very much is how much we've learned!

Lee's 6 six cavity molds produce a heap of very good bullets at a rapid rate and volume has a quality of its own. Obtaining a variety of Lee molds will be much more reasonable than buying a collection of "quality" molds and the bullets will be no more likely to shoot well than any others.

Boolit casting has a learning curve, no one does very well at first so spending a lot for molds you haven't yet learned to use seems foolish.

Cast boolits are delicate. The very best cast boolits won't help until you learn how to reload and shoot them for best results. Spending a few years casting and learning how to best reload your cast boolits is much more effective in the long run than buying costly molds up front.

Learning to shoot well matters too.

[Harter66]

I started with Lee moulds and I don't regret it in the least . My first not Lee mould was a half price used 45-200 RCBS 2 c it was followed by a couple of more bargains made by Lyman . I found the 7mm RCBS mould I needed and got as far as shipping and decided to go look at an NOE which was available and a comparable bullet . It was an aluminum 5 cav and shipped was only $10 more than the RCBS 2 cav .

There is a point of diminishing returns on tool cost vs what you get for the money . Having or had moulds from Cramer , H&G , Ideal , Lyman , Lachmiller , RCBS , Rapine , LBT , Lee , Ohaus , Mtn Molds , NOE , M-P , and Herters ........ I think I'm missing one or more ...... I can say absolutely there is a difference in what you get for the money . Is it worth it ? As others have pointed out yes absolutely , when it is .
I've shot probably a dozen different bullets in 38/357 and none of them shot any better than the Lee 358-158 RF . The LBT and RCBS 40-175/403-175 showed me nothing over over the 401-175 TC Lee .
I do have a 452-255 RF that I've side lined for the NOE version of the 454424 SWC , but that would be a push if I were stuck with a single vs the 6c . I'm not , the NOE is a 5c . So far every 45 rifle bullet I've tried has been poor for me , others are happy with Lee .

In the end of you're willing to trade the time that the Leementing takes AND the bullet works well for you there's no reason not to use them . At this point after nearly 20 yr of mucking about with all of this if I wanted a generic volume bullet for 25 foot paper a Lee would do if I were going to hunt it I'd spend the money on an NOE if the Lee didn't fill my expectations .
For rifles I've had some some hits with Lee and some train wrecks . There only seems to be in those that I load hunting accuracy or disaster . Where it worked I shot a bunch 300+ yd on targets of opportunity , that's not all on the mould though . I've had better easier success with NOE in rifles and equal success with others also .

The difference is Lee is a $25 single or double and a $50 6c in limited designs . The others start at $60-80 and go up . If you call NOE or M-P (I don't want that bill please) you're talking to the guy running the machines .
No slight intended but inspector #12 isn't going to come to the phone at RCBS Lyman or Lee to get your problem addressed .

Inspite of all of the above yes the "better" moulds are worth it , but sometimes it doesn't matter .

[Harter66]

I started with Lee moulds and I don't regret it in the least . My first not Lee mould was a half price used 45-200 RCBS 2 c it was followed by a couple of more bargains made by Lyman . I found the 7mm RCBS mould I needed and got as far as shipping and decided to go look at an NOE which was available and a comparable bullet . It was an aluminum 5 cav and shipped was only $10 more than the RCBS 2 cav .

There is a point of diminishing returns on tool cost vs what you get for the money . Having or had moulds from Cramer , H&G , Ideal , Lyman , Lachmiller , RCBS , Rapine , LBT , Lee , Ohaus , Mtn Molds , NOE , M-P , and Herters ........ I think I'm missing one or more ...... I can say absolutely there is a difference in what you get for the money . Is it worth it ? As others have pointed out yes absolutely , when it is .
I've shot probably a dozen different bullets in 38/357 and none of them shot any better than the Lee 358-158 RF . The LBT and RCBS 40-175/403-175 showed me nothing over over the 401-175 TC Lee .
I do have a 452-255 RF that I've side lined for the NOE version of the 454424 SWC , but that would be a push if I were stuck with a single vs the 6c . I'm not , the NOE is a 5c . So far every 45 rifle bullet I've tried has been poor for me , others are happy with Lee .

In the end of you're willing to trade the time that the Leementing takes AND the bullet works well for you there's no reason not to use them . At this point after nearly 20 yr of mucking about with all of this if I wanted a generic volume bullet for 25 foot paper a Lee would do if I were going to hunt it I'd spend the money on an NOE if the Lee didn't fill my expectations .
For rifles I've had some some hits with Lee and some train wrecks . There only seems to be in those that I load hunting accuracy or disaster . Where it worked I shot a bunch 300+ yd on targets of opportunity , that's not all on the mould though . I've had better easier success with NOE in rifles and equal success with others also .

The difference is Lee is a $25 single or double and a $50 6c in limited designs . The others start at $60-80 and go up . If you call NOE or M-P (I don't want that bill please) you're talking to the guy running the machines .
No slight intended but inspector #12 isn't going to come to the phone at RCBS Lyman or Lee to get your problem addressed .

Inspite of all of the above yes the "better" moulds are worth it , but sometimes it doesn't matter .

[Soundguy]

I prefer lee for the price. And for paper punching..hard to beat lee micro groove bullets.. Way too easy to shake some alox on cure and go many times.

[elmacgyver0]

I love my Lee molds. They do what I want.

[1hole]

When I get good accuracy from one bullet design but not with a different design I attribute the differences to my load and/or my gun's preference, certainly not the brand of the molds.

[bimus]

In 40 years there has been a lot of 45 ACP pistols owned by sons and daughters grand kids nieces and nephews and friends and only one Lee 228 grain 452 mold .

[El Bibliotecario]

I have only been using Lee molds for about twenty years. quite user friendly, and I've never ruined one. they still work today better than I can shoot their bullets and do not rust. I'm probably not very picky, but no complains about these molds, while I would be more inclined to spend more in quality dies.

That expresses my opinion and experience as well.

The idea of better performance from high end equipment is only valid up to a point. With bullet casting I believe the critical factor is skill and experience.

[Rich/WIS]

Have had molds from all the common makers, Lee, Lyman, RCBS, and NOE. Right now have Lee 6C for handguns and NOE for rifles. Same with pots, have had Lee 10#, Lyman and SAECO 10#, Lyman and Lee 20#. Still have the Lee 20#, and BTW all dripped to some extent. For dies prefer Hornady and RCBS but also have Lyman dies in some calibers. All work well and produce good ammo. Can't comment on Lee dies as I've never used them. Knowing how to use your equipment and attention to detail are far more important than the maker of your equipment, there is an old saying "its not the arrow, its the Indian".

[gwpercle]

I learned on Lyman , bought many Lee's because they are / were affordable and I'm a Tightwad who loves cheap . Lyman are steel tough and Lee are cheap ... made cheap to sell cheap but they can cast boolits . All my moulds were 1 and 2 cavity ... I cast with a dipper .
Joined this site and heard about "Custom" moulds like NOE ... cost more than Lee but people kept talking about them . Wanted a 124 gr. 9mm TC mould with a gas check and Lee or Lyman didn't make one ...So I decided to spend some bucks and see what all the hoopla was about ...
NOE 358-124-TC - GC - 4 cavity aluminum $92.00 was ordered ...
The hoopla was real ... I have bought only NOE moulds since that day ... it's like cars ...
the Lee is a 67 Ford Pinto ... the NOE is a any year Corvette .
The driving / casting experience is just so much nicer.
NOE makes moulds that have been long discontinued ... so I end up buying moulds I can't find but have always wanted to own . NOE prices aren't any higher than Lyman 2 cavity $92.99 at Midway USA . I can vouch for NOE aluminum moulds ... SWEET ! I don't own any brass moulds because of the weight ...to heavy for my old arms .
Gary

[Cosmic_Charlie]

Look on the swapping and selling forum and you can find good deals on top quality molds. I really like my cast iron RCBS molds, so easy to make nice boolits with. I have mostly aluminium molds and they work fine too. I have half a dozen Lee molds and get good boolits from them as well.