RCBS .44-250-K vs .44-250-KT

[txbirdman]

[QUOTE=Shuz;5386752]

Shuz:



Interesting that you, alamogunr, and I all joined this site back in March of 2005.

Jerry,
I and perhaps you and alamogunr were also members on the old "Shooters" website?

As was I. My join dat shows as March 2005 also.

[alamogunr]

[QUOTE=txbirdman;5386764]

As was I. My join dat shows as March 2005 also.

As I recall, I jumped over here because the old site was shutting down. I was really happy to see a site dedicated to cast bullets. Up to that time I got most of my information from the old CB_L(I think that is correct) email group. Unlike a lot of members here I've only been casting for a little over 20 years.

[376Steyr]

I’d like to have one of the original moulds for that 429421, like every Keith fan I guess. My question is, who makes a copy of that bullet? I mean, an exact copy.

You might like this one: https://noebulletmolds.com/site/prod...2-255-swc-ay3/

[DBN]

The accurate 43-250j is advertised as an exact clone.

[Bazoo]

You might like this one: https://noebulletmolds.com/site/prod...2-255-swc-ay3/

Thanks for the suggestion but,
No thanks. It doesn’t have three equal length driving bands. The bottom is .120 and the top and middle are .080.

I meant to say, I like the look of GLLs vintage 429421 and I’d like one of those.

[44MAG#1]

This. https://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet...bullet=43-253K

[alamogunr]

Since a lot of this thread centers around what defines a "Keith" bullet and, aside from the equal drive bands, the square lube groove catches most of the attention. I recently read an article or comment, not sure where, that put forward the argument that the rounded lube groove is not as bad in actual practice as those who have set the square groove up as equal to absolute gospel would have us believe. In searching for that holy grail mold that is the one and only Keith mold, I understand the need to find an old Lyman 429421 with the square lube groove.

I don't remember the details but it centered around the behavior of the bullet when it obturates and compresses the lube groove. The explanation sounded plausible enough that, for my use, I wouldn't care either way. Also, for many who powder coat, it is completely unimportant.

[Alstep]

I would think that boolits from a rounded or tapered lube groove mold would release and drop easier than from a squared groove mold.

[Bazoo]

Round lube grooves are not a detriment that I can tell. Square grooves hold lube better through handling, just between the sizer and the case. But I also store my bullets lubed. Maybe not huge amounts, just several hundreds.

[danmat]

NOEs Keith mold is the 432-277 I believe, These were the signature Keith molds from the group buy here mines great equal drive bands.

[44MAG#1]

https://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet...bullet=43-253K

[44MAG#1]

Keith's 250 Keith never weighed 277 grains.

[danmat]

I don’t know what weight his mold dropped at, never got to borrow it!!!! ��

[44MAG#1]

I don’t know what weight his mold dropped at, never got to borrow it!!!! ��

Him saying 250 sure isn't 277. Unless he was using new math at the time

[danmat]

Maybe originally lineotype, much speculation on a “real” Keith mold.
The one thing most agree on is square lube groove, plain base, with equal driving bands.
My Noe is a fine mold I don’t mind the little extra weight though

[44MAG#1]

Maybe originally lineotype, much speculation on a “real” Keith mold.
The one thing most agree on is square lube groove, plain base, with equal driving bands.
My Noe is a fine mold I don’t mind the little extra weight though

I would say, at the time the chances of Keith using Linotype is very, very, very,very, very, very slim. Since he mentions 1-16 tin and lead as much as he does.

[Bazoo]

I’m sure Elmer used whatever he could get just like we all do. It’s just for his pet loads he wanted 16:1. But I magine he would use softer for the gallery or target loads and for other calibers as he had need and reserve the 16:1 for his pet loads whenever he was running a bit low.

He said in sixguns that during the depression things was tight and he couldn’t afford pistol powder and was using shotgun powder out of necessity for some light loads. I believe that’s what he shot the mountain lion with. I’m sure he did the same with lead though I’ve not seen that in his writings yet.

[Bazoo]

My 44-250-K weighs 265 with 50:50 ww: pb+Sn and lubed. I’d like a 250ish so I’m on the hunt. It that the heavy is bad, but, I don’t know I just want 250ish.

[44MAG#1]

I’m sure Elmer used whatever he could get just like we all do. It’s just for his pet loads he wanted 16:1. But I magine he would use softer for the gallery or target loads and for other calibers as he had need and reserve the 16:1 for his pet loads whenever he was running a bit low.

He said in sixguns that during the depression things was tight and he couldn’t afford pistol powder and was using shotgun powder out of necessity for some light loads. I believe that’s what he shot the mountain lion with. I’m sure he didn’t the same with lead though I’ve not seen that in his writings yet.

So with that being said, we can assume as humans do, he used 1-16.
Never in his writings about alloys he used in his earliest days can you find he said he used Linotype or Printers Metal as he called it.

[Larry Gibson]

I’m sure Elmer used whatever he could get just like we all do. It’s just for his pet loads he wanted 16:1. But I magine he would use softer for the gallery or target loads and for other calibers as he had need and reserve the 16:1 for his pet loads whenever he was running a bit low.

He said in sixguns that during the depression things was tight and he couldn’t afford pistol powder and was using shotgun powder out of necessity for some light loads. I believe that’s what he shot the mountain lion with. I’m sure he didn’t the same with lead though I’ve not seen that in his writings yet.

Pure lead and tin were a lot more prevalent back in Elmer's time, especially where he lived. He advocated the binary alloy in most all his cast bullets. Both my Lyman 429421 mould and my RCBS 44-250-KT moulds drop bullets of 16-1 alloy at 250 gr +/-. Keith's "classic" 44 Magnum load of 22 gr 2400 was with 250 gr bullet. Some, when they load that under 270 +/- gr "Keith" bullets complain Alliant 2400 is "hotter'. Ya think? I wonder why........