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Thread: What I did to my Shotguns

  1. #21
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    How to Port Load your Shotgun

    OK,,, This comes under the heading of "What I do with my shotguns." as opposed to "What I did to them." The whole idea after you get the gun set up is to use it for something. In my case, that is going to classes, Participating in Local 3 Gun Matches, and God forbid, Home Defense or an Active Shooter Response.

    It has come to my attention that most people don't understand the importance of Port Loading a Shotgun, or how to do it properly.

    Tactical Shotguns are Ammo Hungry Beasts. Port Loading is the way you keep the Hungry Beast fed when in a dynamic situation. All should agree that it is counterproductive, if not downright stupid, to stand in the open while reloading your magazine and being shot at? It simply takes too long to accomplish and you are super exposed and probably won't make it home.

    However it is possible to keep rounds going down range in a relatively quick manner by Single Loading or Ejection Port Loading the gun. After Learning the steps and practicing to eliminate as much wasted motion as possible it is possible to get a shot off every 1-2 seconds for as long as you have ammo readily available. Usually off a Side Saddle or Shell Holder on your belt or vest.

    So in order to do this you first must learn how to grasp the individual Shells.
    You do it like this,,, clasping the shell on its ends with your Index and Pinky Fingers with your other two fingers behind the shell. This hold on the rounds facilitates either loading into the magazine or into the Ejection Port. Just get in the habit of doing it this way.

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    I prefer the Velcro Side Saddle for holding my Extra Rounds on the gun, as they are the quickest way to access rounds and when they get empty you simply rip them off the gun and slap another one on. To pull rounds out of the side saddle you grasp the front shell with your Thumb and Ring finger and pull down and then transition to the hold described above.

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    Next you will tip the gun slightly to the right to better access the Ejection Port. Note: you are feeding the gun from the underside not over the top.

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    Then push the round into the port,,, the reason why you load from underneath is because it stages your hand in position for running the slide.

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    Then push forward on the Slide or hit the Bolt Release on a SA gun. and you are ready to fire. Note: All of this was done with the gun on your shoulder held up by your strong side hand/arm. This will take a little practice and development of some muscle memory. By keeping the gun at eye level you eliminate precious seconds from your follow up presentation.

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    The last thing in the process is ejecting the spent round as quickly as possible. This is done by what is known as "Riding the Recoil."

    On a Slide Action Shotgun the only thing keeping the gun "in battery" is the Bolt Release. When the gun is in battery the bolt is locked to the barrel shroud and when the gun is fired this prevents the bolt from flying open. However this all happens in Milliseconds. As soon as the hammer drops the bolt release is disengaged and the slide is free to open the bolt. That split second after the gun fires is where you "should have" been running the slide and ejecting the spent round!

    With a loaded magazine you would rack the slide to eject the spent round and then immediately close it to be ready to fire. With an Empty Magazine you only Rack the slide back and leave the bolt open and then go thru your Port Loading Sequence. As you are closing the bolt you are also coming on target and pulling the Trigger as soon as the Front Sight comes to bare on your next target. This all happens in less than a second or so. It does take some practice, actually lots of practice,,, but it is doable and if I can do it at 72 you can too!

    With a Semi Auto Gun all the round handling is the same and the only difference is hitting the bolt release after you stuff the round in the Ejection Port. Obviously the gun takes care of ejecting the spent rounds. The one exception to Ejection Port loading is the Browning Auto 5 with the "Speed Feed" feature. On that gun you push the round into the empty magazine and it automatically puts it into the chamber,,, Right NOW!,,, and the gun is ready to fire. This is faster than Port Loading the gun, and it is by far the fastest gun to Single Load !

    So I hope this little tutorial will help some of you learn something new that is useful.

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  2. #22
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    Taking a Hostage Shot?

    OK moving right along. Part of using a Shotgun for Home Defense might involve taking a Hostage Shot. Your loved one might be the Hostage?

    Probably shouldn't screw this up?

    I have been taught that the way to do this is to Aim at the Bad Guy's visible ear. This is where Rifle Sights are a distinct advantage, and if you have taken the time to sight your gun in properly, you should have a good idea of where it will shoot. If you only have a bead then you should have figured out if you need to compensate for POA versus POI.

    Distance to the target makes a big difference here because the buckshot pattern is opening up pretty fast on a cylinder bore barrel. At 15 yards you are looking at a 15" pattern, and at 5 yards that pattern will be about 5". If the guy only has half his face visible then you would probably need to hold off about an inch or so so the pattern doesn't catch your wife. Obviously a tighter pattern would be beneficial.

    Here's a target shot with a Vang Comped Barrel at 5 yards with some Federal 000 Buckshot I had. That stray shot lower left was marked from another shot. All 8 pellets went thru the same big hole. Also if the Bad guy had presented more of his face I would have been holding farther to the right just to make sure he didn't twitch as he was falling away.

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    You can see this shot would have been a fight ender. The wad did hit the hostage in the shoulder area which would hurt but not too bad. Now think about what would have happened with a 5" pattern? That may have been a problem for you, and especially if the Hostage was not related to you and they caught a pellet or two. Why do you think Cops hesitate when presented with a Hostage Situation? Maybe Liability? Most don't have a Vang Comped Barrel on their shotgun most don't even have Rifle Sights. (though most departments have gotten the word on both Vang Comp and Rifle Sights.)

    At more than 5 yards, like 7-10 yards your pattern is opening up rapidly, and you probably shouldn't take the shot. Both My Vang Comped Barrels pattern that same 000 Buckshot into 7" at 25 yards. At 15 yards that is a 3 1/2- 4" pattern. I can hold off a little to the left and take the shot with confidence that I won't shoot her especially if the range is shorter which I am going to be trying to reduce by slowly walking towards them. Once I get within 6-8 yards I am going to shoot as soon as I see an opening. I have already made the decision to shoot, and as soon as I see the sight picture I want, I will break the shot. There is no time for thinking or talking here. There is only time for decisive action.

    I remember the scene in the Good, Bad and Ugly, where Eli Wallach was in the bath tub, and a guy comes in waving a pistol and jabbering about how he is going to kill him. Wallach calmly lifts his gun out of the water and shoots the guy and says "If you are going to shoot,,, shoot, don't talk! Nothing could be more to the point in this case.

    Decisive Action is required, and lots of practice is the only way to get to the point where you have enough confidence to pull it off. Knowing what you are doing, and having a gun that you understand perfectly are two of the key points here. Having the balls to pull the trigger under the pressure that is present here, is the third, but only if you can back it up with the first two key points solidly in place, cuz lives are on the line and screwing it up is NOT an option !!!

    I only hope that the only place this ever happens to any of us is on the range. But it is good to have a plan in place Long Before you need it.

    Randy
    Last edited by W.R.Buchanan; 03-28-2022 at 02:58 PM.
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
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  3. #23
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    What I do with my Shotguns

    One of the things I do with my Shotguns is go to Training Classes at Front Sight. This is where I learn the vast majority of my Gun Handling, and Shooting Skills

    So I went to Front Sight for some training last week. On Thursday we did a "Tactical Awareness Class." It is a new classroom type class and it is still getting tweaked a bit as to content. It concentrated mostly on Avoidance of a Fight and Defensive things to harden your home and lots of Mindset tips. All in all, a good class and I learned lots of new things I had never thought of.

    Friday and Saturday were on the Shotgun Range in a Skill Builder Class designed to prep you for a test. My whole purpose for this trip was to DG with a pump gun. ( DG=Distinguished Graduate or 90% shooter) I had already DG'd with a Semi Auto and the Pump Gun is a little more challenging. I shot well at first and both my short M500's ran perfectly, I didn't acclimate well this time over, and the Desert had me for lunch. And so I sucked and didn't achieve my goal.

    This class only had 9 people in it and my Bro in Law didn't make the second day as his hands were cramping badly by Lunch on the first day. There was only 2 pump guns in the class, Me and Bro. The rest were Berretta's, Benelli's, and two M930's.

    This training emphasizes gun handling and with a Shotgun there is more "manipulation" than with either Rifles or Pistols. Ammo is often loaded one at a time as in the Port Loading Exercise Description above. There are Iterations where you are required to Shoot Multiple Targets under time pressure, do multiple Port Loads under time pressure, do Ammo Changes (Select Slug) and take longer slug shots, and then Clearing Malfunctions at the end of the test. Realistically the entire class could revolve around Port Loading and Shooting Multiples, and Select Slug Shots at 50 and 35 yards as these are the places where there is the most pressure to perform. Anyone can hit one target from 15 or 20 yards in 1.5 seconds.

    The test goes like this. First you shoot 3 Select Slug shots from 50 yards. For this you have the gun loaded with buckshot and at the beep you load one slug into the magazine, rack the action, and then take the shot at the target with a Slug. The targets are painted black so you can see if you hit it or not. You do this 3 times at 50 and then 35 yards. This is done as a group with everyone shooting at once. I missed one of the 50 yard Shots, so I'm down -5 already. I can only go down 8 more points and I lost the DG!

    Then you move forward to the 20 yard line and take one shot each from the Low Ready, High Ready and Field Ready, then move forward to the 15 yard line. Now this is done individually, with the instructor standing right behind you on both the 20 and 15 yard lines. Got all these shots..

    Next you shoot the Multiples. This consists of Shooting two targets from the ready in 1.6 seconds, then 3 target in 2.1 seconds, and then 4 in a Row in 2.6 seconds. This is where the Semi Autos have a serious advantage over the Pump Guns. I can get all 4 in around 2.0 seconds with my A5, I can get 3 in a row just about every time with the Pump Gun, but 4 in a row with the pump gun is really pushing it. I was close but missed out by about .2 on the time, and they said I had two partial hits which only count as misses. IE: I lost a bunch of points on that one shot iteration. I was late and missed 2 targets.

    Next was the Port Loading Drill. On this one you start with a loaded gun, and at the beep you fire, and then port load one round, and then fire again, and then port load again, and finish with a loaded gun. You get 4.2 seconds to do all this, and you do it twice. I bobbled one run thru and was late and another 5 points went down the drain.

    Last is the Clearing of Malfunctions. You do each one twice.

    You get 1.2 seconds to do a Type 1 Clearance which is firing on and empty chamber or dead round. You just rack and roll the gun and that's it. No Problem . Next is the Type 2 or Stove Pipe, where you have one hanging out of the Ejection Port. This one is done the same way as the Type 1 except you move out of the line of fire while clearing it in 1.4 seconds.
    Type 3 is the Failure to Extract or Double Feed. On this one you have a spent round in the chamber that didn't get pulled out and then the gun stuffs another round in behind it. No time limit on this one, you just have to do it right. With the Pump Gun you just rack the slide to lose the double fed round then close hard to grab the spent case, and eject it, and then close to feed in the next good round. NO problem I got all these.

    Then you do a Tactical Reload which is nothing more that feeding a round into the magazine in 3.5 seconds. No Problem with this one.

    Then Last is an Emergency Reload. On this one you pull the trigger get a click, then rack and get another click, and then port load a round in 3.7 seconds. I bobbled the shell on one and lost some more points.

    In the end I finished with a -37 which is just barely in the Graduate 70% zone -38 or less.. Last time did it with a Pump Gun I shot -14 which was one over DG which is -13 or less (Class #3). I shot -11 with my A5 and got DG on Class #4. That was also a few years ago and time is beginning to be a factor.

    So all in all I sucked! I should have Dry Practiced all of this many times before I went. If I had I probably would have DG'd this time as the things I need to Dry Practice most are the Port Loads and Multiple Targets. I never seem to Dry Practice Malfunctions either and maybe I should?.

    Oh well now I have an excuse to go back for another class. It's all good! And no matter how bad I feel or how good or bad I shoot I always have a real good time!

    So that's what I did with my Shotguns last week.

    Randy
    Last edited by W.R.Buchanan; 04-23-2022 at 06:58 PM.
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  4. #24
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    OK: My most recent attempt at achieving Nirvana has come back from Vang Comp and I am very happy with the workmanship. I sent them my 24" rifled barrel and had them cut it to 18.5" Lengthen the Forcing Cone, reattach the Front Sight, and Cera-Kote it black. When I picked it up in Las Vegas the day before my recent class I was super impressed. It will fit either one of my short M500's.

    Will be shooting it soon so I'll keep you posted.

    Randy
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    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
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  5. #25
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    Following with interest. Not much of a shotgunner, but may post pics of my 'personalized' Winchester 1300. 20" cylinder bore, synthetic stock and forend (both pistol grip style) and fiber optic turkey style sights. Lots of fun!
    Lead Forever!


    The 2nd amendment was never intended to allow private citizens to 'keep and bear arms.' If it had, there would have been wording such as 'the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. -Ken Konecki, July 27, 1992

    John Galt was here.

    "Politics is the art of postponing an answer until it is no longer relevant". (From the movie 'Red Tails')

  6. #26
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    Tactical Shotguns are no Joke! They essentially become .73 caliber Rifles, and if you look at them with that in mind, you can see how the mods shown above work very well. They are essentially the same types of things you'd do to an AR.

    My whole Quest was to eliminate any rough edges that would wear holes in me during a 2 or 4 Day Shotgun class. What this does for you is get rid of anything that diverts your attention from your shooting techniques. If you are getting the snot beat out of you every time you pull the trigger, the only thing you will be learning is how much you don't want to shoot that gun.

    I was talking to a guy the other day who was a trainer for the Coast Guard near me. He was telling me that they trained strictly with 3" Magnum 00 Buckshot. I asked him why, And he said because that is what we'd use when boarding a ship. I said so you are teaching basic gun handling and form with Magnum Loads? He said yes that's what they want!!! I said how stupid are they? NO ans.

    Then a week later I was at our Range and the Coasty's were there qualifying with their Mossberg 590 A1's. There were women shooting who couldn't break 95 lbs. but even the "he men" couldn't even shoot 40-50% on the Front Sight Shotgun test. Simple reason is that they had never developed any Technique because every time they pulled the trigger they got the snot knocked out of them.
    Point being, nobody wanted to be there!

    I sacrificed a box of bird shot to them and all I heard was OOH's and Aah's. There is no need for any 12 ga load in the real world above "LOW RECOIL" Buckshot or Slugs and for training, the same with the addition of #8 birdshot which is used to develop the skills of running the gun and ammo manipulation. That's why every one of those shells has "Tactical Slug" or "Tactical Buckshot" printed on the outside!. They are for use in "Tactical Situations" where hitting the target is more important than how much power you can deliver to that target.

    Save the Butt Kicker Slugs for Polar Bears and the like, or if you need to shoot a Pick Up Truck!

    For some unknown reason there is a segment of the population that thinks absorbing Recoil is cool or makes you a Bigger Man. I completely disagree with this concept as I consider being able to put a Low Recoil Slug on a Man Sized Target at 50 yards more relevant, than missing that same target with 3" Magnum Slugs. The dirt behind the target doesn't care what it got hit with.!

    I have arrived at this reasoning by getting the snot knocked out of me several times and seeing what the after effects were. Now I shoot nothing that is above 1300 fps velocity and can shoot my guns all day long with only a Tee Shirt and Shorts and have no marks on me at the end of the day,,, or week for that matter.

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  7. #27
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Good post Randy.
    Don Verna


  8. #28
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    I agree with Randy. I wonder what rank in the Coast Guard made this dumb decision? I've fired 100's of other people's buckshot shells. Unless it's low recoil versions, it makes no sense in a light weight security shotgun. I tried some regular buckshot recently out of curiosity in my Stoeger Model 3000 inertia 12 gauge. Every round pushed me backwards.

  9. #29
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    Yes, my limit is @1300fps and I really don't like going over 1200 fps as nothing I shoot with these rounds will ever know the difference. The problem here is trying to teach people who have never shot a Combat Shotgun how to run it efficiently, when every time they pull the trigger they get the snot knocked out of them. Nobody can learn anything useful by doing that, other than wiping their noses! All they were doing is insuring that no one could use a shotgun effectively. This is not how I want our Military to function.

    The reason why I feel so strongly about this is because about 10 years Ago I was shooting a 3 gun event in Santa Barbara and we had to get down behind a hay bale to shoot two steel targets at the end of the stage. I fired a Slug at the first target and it knocked the Target end over end. It also made Tears Squirt out of my eyes!!. I missed the second target and it really hurt me. When I got back to my car I looked at the box and they were Federal Maximum 1 oz. Slugs at 1610 fps! I had bought 2, 15 round boxes from Walmart several years before for $5 each ( great deal). I still have 28 rounds left! Then I went to my Chiropractor 3 times to have a rib put back in place which cost me $150!

    I started casting and loading .662 Round Balls and Lee Slugs in my Normal Trap Loads which were 1 oz at about 1150 fps and used them until finally Federal came out with the Tactical Low Recoil Buckshot and Slugs they now sell .. Now I load many different Slugs and some Buckshot and stay away from heavy recoiling rounds simply because I have no need for them.

    Now if I was going to go hunting for Polar Bears or some other big game I could easily survive 1 or 2 heavy slugs, since I now have a solid technique in place for running my shotguns which was developed by shooting hundreds of rounds of #8 Birdshot and Low Recoil Slugs. My Shotguns are also set up so they don't beat me during the course of several days in a class. This is pretty well covered earlier in this thread.!

    My whole point here is that you need to learn how to operate a Tactical Shotgun because there is more to it than just shucking the slide or popping off a few rounds here and there. They are more like Rifles than conventional Shotguns used for wing shooting. This is a skill just like Shooting Trap Skeet or Sporting Clays that needs to be practiced. But before you can practice it, you first need to learn how to do it !.

    I recommend a Shooting School for this as you are not going to Self Teach this subject. There is just too much to learn. www.frontsight.com

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  10. #30
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    So Today I finally got to shoot "The Monkeyberg" with the rifled barrel. I was only shooting at 25 yards with it due to wind but it shoots pretty much where it was pointed with one caveat. It started out shooting a foot high! and there isn't enough vertical adjustment on the rear sight to make POA=POI. With the rear sight all the way down it still shoots 6" high at 25 yds. Windage is perfect. These were some of my older Lee Slugs loaded into Federal Blue Hulls with 18 gr of GD. first two shots that were a foot high were both thru the same hole.

    I figured this might be the case as the front sight blade I ordered from Brownell's was the .375 version, which I found out too late, is measured from the bottom of the Dovetail to top of the Sight ,,, instead of from the bottom of the blade to the top of the blade. I need the next taller Blade.

    So it's off to the catalog to get the right one.

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

  11. #31
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    This thread is amazing!!!!

    WR, Thank you for taking the time to do it!!

  12. #32
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    That's some good stuff you've done to your shotgun Randy. There is something that I have done to mine that I'd like to share. With a tube fulla Lyman 525's or 1-1/8 shot loads forward of the receiver, I didn't like how front heavy unbalanced my 870 felt so I put some weight in the hollow synthetic stock to counter that but also cut the recoil to practically nothing. I only use my reloads in the tac shotgun matches at my local club. I also see no need for T-Rex loads. I have been using 25gr of herco with either 1-1/8 of #5 or the Lyman 525 slug for years. I sold the mould so when I run out of slugs it'll be 18-19gr of red dot with Lee 7/8. Might experiment with extra lite for the slugs. That shot load ain't broke so I won't try to fix it!

    About the training: I only learned from the other guys at the range and they are giving free advice but it is very similar to what you are talking about. I have had my ears open and have learned a ton.

    If you are someone reading this thread and are thinking of trying this style of shooting, don't hesitate. Get out there and learn that 12ga. Iny opinion there is almost no better weapon for under 50yds in the hands of a skilled user.

    PS, I have also enjoyed your write up more than any fluff in the American rifleman.

  13. #33
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    That's some good stuff you've done to your shotgun Randy. There is something that I have done to mine that I'd like to share. With a tube fulla Lyman 525's or 1-1/8 shot loads forward of the receiver, I didn't like how front heavy unbalanced my 870 felt so I put some weight in the hollow synthetic stock to counter that but also cut the recoil to practically nothing. I only use my reloads in the tac shotgun matches at my local club. I also see no need for T-Rex loads. I have been using 25gr of herco with either 1-1/8 of #5 or the Lyman 525 slug for years. I sold the mould so when I run out of slugs it'll be 18-19gr of red dot with Lee 7/8. Might experiment with extra lite for the slugs. That shot load ain't broke so I won't try to fix it!

    About the training: I only learned from the other guys at the range and they are giving free advice but it is very similar to what you are talking about. I have had my ears open and have learned a ton.

    If you are someone reading this thread and are thinking of trying this style of shooting, don't hesitate. Get out there and learn that 12ga. Iny opinion there is almost no better weapon for under 50yds in the hands of a skilled user.

    PS, I have also enjoyed your write up more than any fluff in the American rifleman.

  14. #34
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    Outstanding write-up. Good information.

  15. #35
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    oh boy...you want recoil in a shotgun??? try using the remington hypersonic steel loads in a pump action...... I was short shucking rounds after only a few shots..that stuff is terrible.... and no Im not talking a lightweight tacticle either,a steel framed H&R with 28" barrel and 11oz of lead shot up the buttstock,so not a lightweight by anymeans.... that stuff in a break open gun would be nothing shy of flinch making. agree 100 % on comment about effectiveness of hunble shotgun under 50 yards...one load that doesnt often get a mention is #BBs the same as your old red rider air gun used when you were a wee tacker...90 of them going out end of barrel between 11-1600fps really make a mess of whatever they hit....Ive killed enough wallabies (between 20-70lb similar size to a labrador) to know how effective different shotgun loads are on thin skinned game at close range...we found normal 00 buck had far too many gaps in pattern past 15 yards,the #7 buck (around 30x a 22cal pellet) were much better but the #BB or #2 were better still. watching video clips of fellas shooting hogs for helicopters the #BB load would make a lot more sense especially with the under 50lb pigs,trying to hit them with 9mm or .223 makes a hard job harder than needed.

  16. #36
    Boolit Master Wag's Avatar
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    Amazing thread.

    Posting to subscribe.....

    --Wag--
    "Great genius will always encounter fierce opposition from mediocre minds." --Albert Einstein.

  17. #37
    Boolit Master
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    This thread will make me spend some money and definitely spend time modifying my shotguns. Thanks guys……..

  18. #38
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    Hey Randy, could you write about cheek weld and what is happening when I'm getting slapped by the comb? I have a pump that is probably a matter of poor fit. When shouldered the butt has to ride high on my shoulder and it seems there's no good spot for my cheek. I catch myself turning the shotgun CCW but either way it smacks me.
    Oh great, another thread that makes me spend money.

  19. #39
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ID:	302699This is what I’ve done to two Model 12 field guns. For the purists out there, one had a broken stock and a polychoke and the other a cut stock and a reblue.

  20. #40
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    pmer: First what kind of gun is it? Most Stock Field Grade Pump Guns have stocks that are dimensioned for "Mr. Average Guy." IE: 13.5" to 14.5" LOP. In any event you need to mount the gun so the toe of the stock is in the pocket of your shoulder. There is sometimes some speculation of where that "pocket" is?
    I had to learn it a few years ago even though I have been shooting for 60+ years.

    Reach under your armpit, put your fingers directly into the pit and close your thumb around your Pectoral Muscle just below your shoulder bone. That's where your pocket is.

    When you mount the gun properly with the Toe in the Pocket you then mash your cheek bone down on the comb of the stock. As the gun recoils your head should travel with it, and "smacking in the chops" doesn't happen.

    This will take practice to master!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!..

    It took me a while to get this down and I still get smacked sometimes on the first shot after laying off for a while. However I am quickly reminded of what I forget and correct for the next shot.

    I am currently learning how to shoot Skeet. One of the key factors in clay bird shooting is keeping your head on the gun. That means keeping your cheek bone directly on the comb of the stock. IF you don't, you will shoot high every time and 1/4" of the comb equals 3 feet at the target!

    I find myself raising my head up a lot even though I am concentrating on it, but my .410 O/U doesn't have any significant recoil so there is no pain associated with it. Plus that 1/4" off the comb doesn't give the gun much distance to build momentum and hurt you. The penalty is just another miss. Even with my 12 ga. it isn't that bad. The gun weighs almost 9 lbs. But that one small factor is haunting me, and lately I find myself relaxing as the shot breaks, and raising my cheek bone just ever so slightly maybe 1/4". I have caught myself doing it even though before I called for the bird I was concentrating on having my Cheek Weld hard in place! This will take practice to get past just like it did with my combat guns. It took me 3 classes to get past this or about 1200 rounds! YMMV?

    Typically for a Combat Shotgun you want the stock a little shorter than for a field gun. 12.5-13" LOP seems to work for most people unless you are really tall. The whole idea of doing this is so that your stance is squared up to the target a little more which helps absorb the Recoil better so you can make follow up shots faster. This comes into play when doing multiple shot drills where you have to hit 2,3,4 targets in a row. you get 1.7, 2.1 and 2.7 seconds to complete these shots. Not too hard with a SA, but a Pump gun is definitely more challenging.

    But my main point here is that you've got to keep your head on the gun! Only practice will make that happen.

    Hope this helps.

    Randy
    Last edited by W.R.Buchanan; 07-31-2022 at 01:58 PM.
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
    www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check