What I did to my Shotguns

[Chena]

The info on modifications to prevent cuts interests me greatly. I have nicked myself several times working fast with generic agency shotguns. That and other poor ergonomics caused me to loathe the early generations of synthetic stocked factory tactical shotguns.

[W.R.Buchanan]

The info on modifications to prevent cuts interests me greatly. I have nicked myself several times working fast with generic agency shotguns. That and other poor ergonomics caused me to loathe the early generations of synthetic stocked factory tactical shotguns.

Yes, as as stated in the thread above I spend lots of time just handling my guns looking for sharp edges and hot spots. The Magpul Furniture is some of the cleanest plastic moldings I have seen, and usually need very little work to clean up. An Emery Board with a smooth and super smooth side is the weapon of choice, and it helps to have a Exacto Knife too... The M500 Safety will require a file or deburring wheel to dehorn.

Also Shotguns with Full House Buckshot are not going to be fun for more than 2 shots. One to wake you up and another so you remember not to shoot it again. No reason for High Base Buckshot or Slugs unless you are shooting at Polar Bears or Pickup Trucks. All training should be done with birdshot, and daily carry should be with Low Recoil Buck and Slugs. You can always carry a few Heavy Duty Rounds with you on the Side Saddle if you need something more potent. Very few people are going to know the difference between being hit by a load of Buck or a Slug Traveling at 1300 fps or 1600 fps, but you will on the back side of the gun, especially if you don't have the benefit of a big charge of adrenalin to mask the pain. Big Bears are a different story and they will take everything you can throw at them. A 1 1/4oz slug at 1600 fps will take down just about anything on this planet, but there is no person alive that is going to take a 1oz Slug at 1300 fps Center Mass and live to tell about it,,, Even with a BP Vest! The impact alone will end them.

Shotguns are pretty serious weapons !...

Randy

[FrankJD]

Great thread and timely for me as I'm just getting into shotguns for HD.

I might've missed seeing/reading it, but what's considered minimum for magazine/total shell capacity?

[W.R.Buchanan]

OK Slug results with the Rifled Choke Tube installed in the Monkeyberg. I was only able to shoot at 25 yards that day due to really heavy fog at the Range. We could just barely see the targets at 25 yards!

The results were not only encouraging, but pretty damn good.



The first 4 shots were in the group to the left. I made a windage correction and the last shot split the vertical line. These were 1 oz. Lee Drive Key Slugs loaded into my standard Trap Load of AA hull, 18 gr of Green Dot, Claybuster Waa12 wad, @1150 fps,,, in other words the absolute cheapest way to shoot Slugs.

Please note: that there is 3 shots essentially thru the same hole with one off to the left a small amount.

These slugs will be used for 3 gun shoots and Classes when I attend. Pretty happy with these results!



This second target was shot with Lyman 525 Slugs which look like big Airgun Pellets. Same load as above just a different slug I have been trying to get these to perform for the last 3 years from Rifled Barrels with poor results. Pretty Happy with the results on these as well. Once again multiple shots thru the same hole with a couple of flyers that weren't that far away from the rest.



Also note how the holes have a more circular cut. The Lyman Slugs are more like a Wadcutter Diabolo Pellet with a big flat front that is .575 across! Energy transfer to a soft target would be devastating !!!
This is definitely a Hunting Slug!.

Conclusion on this Range Trip is that this Smoothbore Barrel with the Rifled Choke Tube shoots birdshot and slugs well.

Randy

[FrankJD]

I have 3 shotguns - Beretta A300 Patrol LE version (full cylinder, no chokes) 19" semi-auto 7+1, Mossberg Maverick 88 (also full cylinder, no chokes) 20" pump 7+1, Stevens 301 "chinese special" break open 26" single shot - all are 12ga. I added a FalconStrike hydraulic butt pad to the M88 - not cheap but it does a fantastic job of mitigating recoil. I ran a gaggle of 1300fps bird and buck shot through all guns and the M88 yielded the least felt recoil; the A300 has an internal recoil system besides being a gas gun that softens the blow, the 301 was Harsh (I'm adding a FalconStrike to that as well). However, hard recoil shotshells are something I don't need for HD/SD.

In keeping with this thread, I see no need for running buckshot shells over 1200fps. I build #00 buckshot shells by pure lead casting .319" Lee pellets and then powder coating them to .334" diameter. Currently using 2-3/4" hulls (new or reloaded), digital scale weighed WST powder under Claybuster 12S3 wads that are loaded with 8 #00 pellets. Loading is done in an LL2 press, 6 star crimp, and a final pass through a Ukraine-bought shell crimper that insures the shell mouths are at least parallel and not flared out, for ease of pump and auto loading. I dunno what the speed is of these buckshot shells but the damage at 5-20 yards is self evident ... and super easy on the shoulder and cheek. I also have the Op-Sol foam plug for the M88 that allows running mini-shells - haven't tried it yet, but will eventually; nice to have a 14 round shotgun capacity and like Clint sez: shotgun capacity is paramount 'cause reloads aren't as fast as an AR mag change.

[W.R.Buchanan]

My Browning A5 gets a New Barrel.
I got a new barrel for my Combat A5. It started out as a 28" Solid Rib barrel I got off Ebay for @$125.

I had planned to drop it off at Vang Comp in January for them to Thread it for Rem Chokes. I had already cut it off to 20" and was going to put Open Sights on it. And being able to run a Rifled Choke Tube and shoot slugs accurately was what I was after.

Rude awakening when I got to VC and found out the Wall Thickness of the Barrel was to thin to thread! Damn!

Now I'm stuck with it and I already cut it to 20" I could have probably put it back up on Ebay and sold it for $250, (A5 barrels go for a lot these days) but I decided that I really wanted a shorter barrel for this gun as a 3 gun shooter and didn't want to cut my Buck Special Barrel or Hastings Rifled Barrel. They are both worth $400-$500 so best not to mess with them.

One redeeming thing about this barrel is that the Muzzle ID is .725 instead of the usual .729-.730 for a Cylinder Bore. this one is "Skeet." so My standard Slug load using Lee 1 oz. Slugs will fit tighter in the barrel thus improving accuracy. The bore is also Chrome Plated and shines like a Diamond in a Goat's ****.

So I ordered a Williams Front Sight Ramp and a Folding Open Rear Sight.

I just installed these sights onto the Solid Rib over the last few days and put a Green FO Front Sight Blade in the Front Ramp.

I had to cut the Rear Sight's Dovetail off so I had a strait section I could drill for 2 screws.

I had planned out in advance that I wanted the barrel to be longer than the Briley Mag tube extension (7+1) so the gun would look right. 20" was exactly right.

So here's pics of the new barrel installed on the gun. It came out good and was almost what I actually wanted. I bore sighted it with a Laser in the barrel so it should be close and I will refine the Zero when I get a chance to shoot it when our Range opens back up.

Here's some pics. The gun is 38.5" long and weighs 8 lbs. on the nose. It handles way faster than with the full length barrels, and since it is a 1963 model it has the "Speed Feed Feature" that that makes single loading much faster than Port Loading. What that means it that I can beat your Benelli's and Berettas every time.

Randy

[Texas by God]

I like that a lot, sir.
Those A5s are legends for working.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[W.R.Buchanan]

It runs great I just haven't gotten to shoot it with the new barrel yet.. I have taken it to 2 Front Sight Tactical Shotgun classes with the Buck Special Barrel and it ran perfectly the whole time, @350 rounds in two days.

Randy

[lightload]

Randy, can you explain how the Auto 5 shotguns can cycle so fast even though they have long recoil actions?

[W.R.Buchanan]

My fastest Split Time with mine was 4 shots in 2.0 seconds on 4 different targets. That's .5 seconds per shot which included picking up the next target before firing the next round. IE: Movement of the gun and getting hits too.

Without moving the gun,,, just firing 4 shots as fast as I can would surely be <1 second or 250 milliseconds per shot. A M60 SAW runs at 600 RPM. or 100 Milliseconds per shot.

The gun can easily outrun me, and I suspect most people.

Keep in mind that as soon as the primer is punched the cycle starts, and the barrel is moving rearward, When it hits the back of it's stroke the bolt is locked back and the spent shell is ejected as soon as it clears the chamber which is moving forward, the lifter is already moving a new shell into position and it is chambered as the bolt moves forward. The bolt is locked in battery as soon as it is all the way forward. This is all Strictly Mechanical not waiting for any gas pistons or anything else. Pretty sure the gun is way faster than I am.

Here's a video showing how it works. How a Browning Auto-5 works - YouTube https://www.google.com/search?q=vieo...id:5MfLYgTe6NI

Whereas with a Gas Gun the payload has to move halfway down the barrel before the gas port is uncovered and then pressurize the mechanism to get it started moving. It is way behind the A5 from the start.

Hope this helps understand how the gun works. You will quickly see what a "mechanical marvel" it is. How JMB figured this all out is beyond me.

Randy

[W.R.Buchanan]

Here's a couple more pics of the A5 ,,,
Randy

[pull the trigger]

This has been a fantastic thread, thank you very much!!!

[W.R.Buchanan]

Another Tac Gun comes to fruition. The Auto-Berg!

So I got a REALLY GOOD DEAL!!! on a 1960's made Mossberg 500 that was originally made for the Western Auto Chain of Stores. It had a Plain 30" Full Choke Barrel and nice Wood Furniture. It was such a good deal that I couldn't pass it up, not like I needed another one, but I will find a use for it. The gun was used, but it had not been used hard, and was not too dirty inside.

Western Auto was a competitor of Pep Boys back in the day, and had a bunch of cool stuff like Bicycles, and American Flyer Electric Trains which competed with Lionel and a bunch of WA Branded guns which are in high demand. I missed a nearly perfect WA Marlin 30-30 at a gun show a few years back that was ripe for just a wood refinish/action clean up. The WA Trains are serious Collector Items now as they were "S" Gauge with only two rails instead of the Lionel 3 rail system.

This gun had a few differences in the way it was put together than the others I have done. The Magazine Tube assembles into the Receiver differently and has a Flat Wound Spring around it that "cushions" the Slide Movement to the front. Also the entire Mag Tube/Slide Assembly has to be installed as a unit into the receiver. The others I have all can have the Mag Tube Screwed into the Receiver independently. There are also two 1/2" long Sleeves Silver Soldered to the tube to take up the slack between the Slide Tube and the Mag tube. Those aren't there on later guns.

Anyway I broke all the sharp edges on all the Internal Parts, did some touch up Re-bluing and smoothed out everything and gave everything a nice polished finish and put it back together. It also got a new Safety Button like the others I use.

Probably going to go with my Fully Rifled 18" bbl. on this gun to start. I might pick up another Vent Rib Barrel that I can Rem Choke and Port and Lengthen the Forcing Cone on, like was done to the Monkey Berg. Got the Magpul Furniture this morning (just love Sunday Deliveries during the Christmas Season!) I only could get a set of Gray ones, as all the others were out of stock, but I am looking at painting them some kind of Dark OD Green. Wanted to do Air Dry Cera-Kote but it is just too expensive for a job like this. Maybe I can go with a 2 part Polyurethane from one of the Auto Paint Stores. I need less than a 1/2 Pint to do the job. We'll see?

More to come. Here's some pics

Randy
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