Time spent melting and then casting?

[lightman]

First of all, Welcome to our site and to the hobby of casting!

The answers to all of your questions are, it depends!
Smelting ;
What kind of pot and burner do you have or plan to get? If you are doing 10-15 pounds at a time with an iron skillet on a camp stove it will take you several hours. If you have a Turkey frier burner and a cutoff propane tank for a pot you will probably be 4 hours on 2 5 gallon buckets of weights. It depends on whether you have to store your smelting gear away or leave it set up.
Casting;
What type of casting pot and molds are you thinking about. With a 20# bottom pour pot and a 4 or 6 cavity mold you could get several hundred bullets in 2 hours. Once again, set up time will cost you. Can you leave your casting pot set up or will you have to store it away?

Sorting weights;
There are a few stickies about sorting weights. Some casters don't sort and try to keep the heat under the melting temp of Zinc. Thinking the Zinc will float to the top to be skimmed off. Others sort and only have lead weights in the pot. Once again, the question comes up can you sort for an hour or so and leave everything out or do you have to put it away?

My methods;
My smelting pot will hold 400 pounds of molten lead and my burner will melt it in 20 minutes or so. I use 8 of the Lyman style ingot molds so I don't have to wait on them to cool off between pours. I use a nice Rowell Ladle and a heavy duty skimmer. I have maybe $100 invested in the two of them. The time they save was worth it to me. I save wax products and sawdust for flux. I usually save my scrap all year and a buddy and I will spend a day melting his and mine. It helps to have some help. To do your 2 buckets of weights would probably take me 3-4 hours to melt, counting time for set up and putting things away. Once set up I can have 400 pounds of ingots about every 2 hours. I have to put my smelting stuff away, but its in the corner of the shop near where I use it.

I cast with an RCBS ProMelt pot that holds 20 pounds of lead and I cast with 4 cavity molds. It probably takes me 45 minutes to get my first bullet. Loading the pot, cleaning the mold, pre heating the mold, lubing the mold, staring and fluxing the pot --- yeah, probably 45 minutes to an hour to get started. I figure 300-400 bullets an hour after getting started. I can leave my pot and everything on my workbench if I want to avoid the set up time.

Sorting weights. I hand sort, picking up each weight and looking at it. I use a pair of electricians dykes to make a test cut on any suspicious weights. I sort until I get tired and quit. I try to sort as I acquire weights so as to not be hopelessly behind. I've never checked the time when I'm sorting. I can leave the buckets where I sort, not having to put them away or get them out.

You are right to expect some wasted time and lost production the first few times you do each of these processes. But you will develop a technique and a comfortable way to work.

I hope you can find something useful out of all of that!

[oley55]

I'm new to the forum and did not see this addressed in a FAQ - if the answer is there and I missed it, please send me a PM with a link and remove this post.

I've been loading powder coated lead for pistol for almost 2 years now from various online vendors. Local indoor range has offered to sell range scrap at a very discounted price and about the same time, YouTube decided that I really want to watch casting videos. I'm about ready to jump in BUT how much time should I have in mind for melting/making ingots and then for casting the actual bullets (newbie - should I be using the alternate spelling here?). 2 hours chunks of time are very do-able, 3 hours not so much, and 4 hours + would be a rare luxury that I am not sure I would devote to casting.

The first few times for each process with the associated learning curves don't count, what I am curious about is a year after I jump into the hobby, how much time will I be spending to melt (clean, flux, ingot-ize)... call it two 5 gallon buckets of range scrap and then later, how much time to cast hmm... call it 100 bullets (is that a reasonable production goal for a casting session?)

Thanks!

first of all welcome, second good on you for seriously inquiring about the time drain. Obviously you have plenty on your plate and are being realistic about your time resources.

As has already been mentioned, smelting will take more than two hours. But honestly how often you expect to find yourself smelting. For me that's a two or three times a year activity and you will likely need at least four hours.

As for casting, powder coating and sizing these can easily be broken down into two hour blocks. To some degree the same for smelting. Sort as you have time and smelting once you are all ready to go.

Again good on you for digging deeper before taking the plunge.

[gwpercle]

#1 - I consider casting as one of my Hobbies , (the others being reloading and shooting) so I don't view it as work where a time clock has to be punched and I enjoy casting .

Making a batch clean ingots you should allow at least 3-4 hours , it all depends on how hot your burner runs and how much metal you are trying to render . You have the burner and pot to set up , load with lead and fire up ... melt and a couple three fluxes to clean the metal of trash then ladle out into ingot moulds ... when your done ... you have to pick everything up and put away . So 3 - 4 hours is about what you want . But ... you only need to do this once or twice a year ...

Casting boolits ... I leave my pot in my casting building , all set up on the bench with moulds , ladle , fluxes , mould lube all ready to go . allow 1/2 hour for a full pot to melt ( I use a Lee Magnum Melterthat holds 20 lbs.) Now you want a good hour to cast with ...less than an hour and you can't run enough boolits ... the mould has to get hot and once pot metal and mould are hot you don't want to stop till the pot is depleted ... So allow for minimum 1 1/2 hours .... 2 hours is better .

I save my ingot making for the times I can steal 3-4 hours and do it only once maybe twice a year , do it when the wife and kids are gone somewhere !

Casting boolits is whenever I can get a couple hours ... If interrupted I simply un plug the pot , set the mould down and come back another day ... I leave everything set up and in place on the bench waiting for the next time I can get away .

Hope this gives you an idea of times ... it isn't all that time consuming .
If you use 4 and 6 cavity moulds you will probably make more boolits / hour .
Gary
Pouring Lead since 1967

[WRideout]

Welcome to the forum, Dahak. I have lately campaigned about two full buckets of range bullets, which were full of sand from the bottom of the bullet trap. It took me a while, because I smelt them over a wood fire, about thirty pounds at a time. After getting them smelted and cleaned up, I guess I have a couple hundred pounds of casting lead. It makes sense to do this as a multi-step process (smelt, then cast) since putting the bullets in your casting pot will take a lot of time just to clean up the dirt and etc. For smelting, I have in the past used a rocket stove fueled with wood (see Youtube videos) and also a hot plate. With a small amount of lead, perhaps ten pounds, it does not take long to make clean ingots. As far as muffin pan molds, I had several stick in the pan until I left them outdoors for a while to get rusty. Alternatively, I have smoked the pans with wood fire which also makes them non-stick. My casting sessions last about an hour to make 100-150 boolits, depending on the mold.

I didn't see what your projected boolit use is over time. If you only use a small number infrequently, it's almost better to buy clean lead. Many members here have lead ingots they will sell or trade; look in the swapping and selling section. Good luck on your endeavors.

Wayne

[bangerjim]

It's called A HOBBY! I sure do not calculate and classify the hours I spend at my several hobbies. Things that go bang are just one of my several past times. Nor do I worry about the money they save or cost me.

If you enjoy doing it, DO IT! And enjoy life while you have it.

[oley55]

Banger, I'm pretty sure you didn't really mean to say the only reason for casting our own bullets is as a hobby? Is that how you started casting, just sitting around one day you decided you needed a new hobby and decided it would be casting boolits. It turned into a hobby, but I doubt that was your initial reason.


I read the OP's post and imagined a guy (probably much younger than myself) who's hauling his kids to this and that activity and a hundred other things and is trying to decide if he can fit boolit casting into his busy life. Casting becoming a hobby is a hoped for fringe benefit IMO.

[dverna]

It's called A HOBBY! I sure do not calculate and classify the hours I spend at my several hobbies. Things that go bang are just one of my several past times. Nor do I worry about the money they save or cost me.

If you enjoy doing it, DO IT! And enjoy life while you have it.

Not for me. It is more like cutting grass or gardening....oh heck...some people enjoy doing that too...lol

The only gun stuff I enjoy doing is shooting. If I could buy 9mm and .357 bullets for $50/k I would never cast another bullet.

[Dahak]

Starting to wrap my head around the scale of production. Sacrifice most of a Saturday to make a lot of ingots, then have lead to use for casting for a long time. Bullet making can be done in smaller chunks of time; while ingot making can but probably should not be compressed into smaller time blocks. At least that's what I've picked up.

I'm sure many of you reload, so you recognize the research, check another source and then research some more mentality before pulling the lever. I just wanted a reality check to make sure that I would be able to actually use the casting equipment that I'm already shopping for.

Thanks again for all the input!

[GregLaROCHE]

Don’t forget the first time will take the most time. After you will become more organized and faster. You can certainly get something accomplished in two hours.

[Rcmaveric]

For making ingots and reclaiming lead, you should make a day out of it. I will spend months collecting lead. When i have enough tonwarrant processing i spend all day doing it. I can process about 300 lbs in a day with my process. You should only have to do that a few times a year. So spare 2 to 3 days a year to make stock.

As for casting. A couple or few ours a day. I have kids and a full time profession and school. I find time to sit and cast for a bit. You will get a feel of how much you need to keep on hand. Or a high and low stock. I know how much i jeed and when to make more. I keep a bunch sized and ready to load. Stock pile old containers. Those square pickle jars and coffee cans are my go to for bullets and cigar boxes for storeing greased bullets.


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[unclemikeinct]

If you have two five gallon pails of range/lead scrap. You need to get busy making ingots. Plan an afternoon into the early evening to process that load. It is smelly hot dirty work. No Kids or pets on the "Patio" during that job. I use an old gas grill [really old] with the lava rocks in it. A Tag Sale 8 Qt. cast iron dutch oven. It holds between 40 to 50 lbs of lead & alloys I blend into my mix. A few muffin tins. Sturdy ladle n stirring spoon. Candle bits & saw dust to flux the mix clean. Lots of old pewter. weighted out by the pound. one pound for pistol per pot full. two pounds for my rifle mixture. Then you can get busy. More if you ask. unclemikeinct.. ps. I stamp my ingots "SN1" "SN2" & when I have clean pure lead stamp in Just "PB"

[Rcmaveric]

I second marking the ingots.... my wife organized my lead for me once. It would have been bad had i not stamped them. I have an ingot molds the have the lead rype embossed. I judt nick next to what it is like a check mark.

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[mjwcaster]

Just like racing- how fast do you wish to spend?
I started with a $10 Coleman stove, fine for casting, slow for smelting. Add enough wind on a cool day and smelting just couldn’t happen.
Bought a good Turkey fryer and ingot production went way up. Now I just need a bigger pot, the cast iron Dutch oven isn’t that big any more.

If time is short just buy your ingots. Unless your lead supply is extremely cheap and your smelting setup efficient you won’t save as much money per hour smelting.

Start simply and see if you like it.

As far as casting output I figure an easy 1k per 2 hour session with a 6 cavity mold, startup to cleanup. 3 hours can yield closer to 2k bullets and a sore back.
I maximize my time by doing something else while the pot/molds are heating up. Lately it’s just been cleaning the garage, but used to be sizing or coating bullets.


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[Springfield]

With a good high pressure turkey fryer and enough ingot moulds to do 50 lbs at a time, doing 150 lbs an hour is very doable. Wheel weights take longer as you have to scoop off the clips, same for range scrap that includes lots of copper jackets. If it is just odd shaped pieces of lead, or lead sheets, it goes a bit faster.
As for casting speed, I use mostly 5-6 cavity moulds and can do 600 an hour easily, but you will need at least a 20 lbs pot to keep up that pace.
I don't ever smelt and cast the same lead the same day, but then I usually save up and do 3-400 lbs in a long morning and don't feel like casting after that.

[openbook]

but for me the real work is sorting out the lead wheelwights form Zink and steel ,It takes alot of time. I still have several 5 gallon buckets to make into Ingots.

^^ This. Going through 130 lbs of tiny wheel weights is not a fast process.

One other note: you can smelt as much or as little as you want, it doesn't have to be all day. I don't have the huge process that many here do. I'm getting about 30 lbs of lead out of a 5gal bucket of wheel weights. I sort the weights little by little, and when it comes time to melt them into ingots, I do it all at once. Figure 15 minutes to melt and then 20-25 minutes to pour. I'm using two 4-pound ingot molds and a muffin tin.

I'm sure doing a whole smelting day is much more efficient and overall, better. But at this point in my hobby I don't have the time (or the lead!! ) to smelt all day. My point is that this is a hobby that can easily fit in your life, even if you've only got couple hours here and there.

[LenH]

One thing about melting range scrap, don't put too much in the pot especially if the majority is jacketed. The top 3rd acted like a layer of insulation. After having the fire going for an hour plus
I got to digging into the pot and there was a large layer of lead below. I had to dig the top layer out and back in the bucket. I fished out the empty jackets and poured the ingots. I put the top layer back in the pot and and had the rest of the lead melt in short order. Even an old fart messes up from time to time. I still have about 300 pounds of the stuff to melt but am in no hurry.

[fredj338]

A lot of the time issue is gear & alloy oriented. The lead wheel weight is becoming extinct so for me its range scrap. I pickup range scrap while out shooting. So I am getting mostly lead splatters or whole lead bullets. Turning those to ingots is pretty quick & easy with a good propane burner. Fill a cast iron pot, turn the burner on & do something else, like reload or sort brass or whatever, while it comes to temp. Flux & pour into ingots is just minutes. Buying ingots from a vendor here would cost more but you eliminate the time issue. Its a hobby, all hobbies are a time suck, but this one actually gives you a cost benefit in cheaper shooting.
Casting, again gear determines time. A good 4-6cav mold produces a lot of bullets in just an hour, like 800-1200 using a Lee 20# bottom pour pot. Then powder coating is again, gear dependent on time & technique. I use a 2 rack pizza oven that allows me to do 600 at a time. The greatest time there is coating & setting them in the trays but there are diff techniques. I usually setup 450, then into the oven while I setup the next 300 & just keep at that pace. So I can do 1000 in a bit over an hour.
As to marking ingots, I dont. I have 3 alloys; clip ww, range scrap & pure lead. They all go into diff shaped ingot molds for easy ID. I have lino but keep it in type form & just add it by weight. I still have a few 10# pigs of lino, I just melt off what I need in my casting pot.

[bangerjim]

Banger, I'm pretty sure you didn't really mean to say the only reason for casting our own bullets is as a hobby? Is that how you started casting, just sitting around one day you decided you needed a new hobby and decided it would be casting boolits. It turned into a hobby, but I doubt that was your initial reason.

Actually......YES! I got hooked on the idea of casting Pb alloy boolits years ago after going to some gun shows and seeing all the casting stuff. Being an engineer by occupation, and I love to mess with chemistry and metallurgy and electronics, it was a perfect fit to my knowledge/skill set. I did not start out cheap using an old pan on a Coleman stove. I bought all the commercial molds I wanted/needed at the time (18), ingot molds, tools, melting/casting pots.......brand new. Later my Dad gave me a plumber's furnace from the 1930's and it melts 60# of Pb faster than you can pour it!

To my wife's surprise, I came home one day with a boatload of new casting equipment, and later built a 10x12 "casting cabin" in the back yard, and have been slinging molten metals ever since.

Since then, I have been a casting fool.....not to save money (we all know that joke!), but just to have fun. I actually enjoy making/loading the boolits far more than shooting them. And I do not shoot & kill living things. Only lots of paper and water bottles. I get all my meat supplied by the local butcher in the big food stores.


To each his own.


banger

[farmbif]

lots of good advice and answers to ops original question. but when it comes down to it everyone is different. I used to try and melt down buckets full into ingots .
not any more gave up on that years ago after having sorting problems. now I like to leave all my raw materials in original form and melt down a little less than a gallon at a time when ingot making. and always do it way before my last batch of ingots is used up. once equipment is set up and raw materials are in order It usually takes less than an hour.
then I use clean ingots in the little lee bottom pour when I get a desire to cast for 1 or 2 calibers. with a good mp 4 cavity brass mold once its up to temp it does not take long to cast 100 good bullets. primarily because of physical limitations I do what I can when I can and a casting session never goes on for me more than an hour to 90 minutes and that's plenty of time to cast a couple hundred good bullets. the key for me is having everything set up and ready to go. so I can cast any time I want and getting everything up to temp while changing Lube size die or filling lube tank, keeping things in order and such.

[45DUDE]

I must be running on 33 & 1/3/. I takes me about 3 hours to cast 9 pounds target quality boolits.