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Thread: New reloader have a few ??

  1. #1
    Boolit Man
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    New reloader have a few ??

    I have finally got around to reloading its been a long time coming but finally loaded up some rounds and shot them. I'm loading for a Marlin Model 1893 built in 1903. I used 27, 28, and 29grs of 3031 and 165 gr Ranch Dog gas check bullet. As far as I can tell no leading and the gun cleaned up nice.All loads seemed to shoot about the same group size at 25yds.
    Have a few questions.
    1. I noticed on a few pieces of brass from all 3 loads that the primers had backed out just a tiny, tiny bit. I have noticed this on factory Hornady Leverevolutions to the primers back out some. Is this OK in my reloads?
    2. Do y'all feel that these loads are ok as far as how much powder I'm using ( 27,28, 29grs 3031) for the age of my rifle?
    3. A few of the reloads were harder than some others to chamber. Had to work harder to chamber them. They shot fine just harder to chamber than some of the others. Ok, not ok?
    4. What do I do now with the brass? I know I need to clean it and reprime. Can I just clean it with some soap and water and let it dry well? Not worried about it being shiny and gleaming.Do I need to check the length? Resize it? Little bit foggy on what to do now.
    Thank you for any help you can give!

  2. #2
    Boolit Grand Master

    Winger Ed.'s Avatar
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    They may not easily chamber due to an incorrect crimp.
    As you're getting a batch going- make sure the case isn't bulged at the mouth from too much crimp.
    Also make sure a sized case fits the chamber like normal

    The primer backing out is usually from a worn out primer pocket, and/or too light of a charge.
    On firing, it will back out if headspace allows it, and it usually does.

    Then as the powder fully burns, the case will be pushed back onto it.
    That's how you can see a high pressure sign too.
    With high pressure, and the primer is pushed back into the pocket, then it sort of 'splats' before it fully goes back in.

    To test this low pressure idea-- fire a empty but primed case.
    Unless its a fire formed bottle neck case, it usually does push out of the pocket to one degree or another.
    Last edited by Winger Ed.; 01-23-2022 at 08:13 PM.
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  3. #3
    Boolit Master Thumbcocker's Avatar
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    Assuming your rifle is in good condition and was made for smokeless loads you shouldn't have any problems with book loads.

    Kudos for working up slowly. Boolits should be kinder to an elderly barrel than j words.

    Would love to see pics of a cool old rifle.

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  4. #4
    Boolit Grand Master

    Wayne Smith's Avatar
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    Every primer backs out - in fact John Garand's first rifle design worked on that principle, and then the Govt. started crimping primers. Every primer backs out and the recoil pushes the case against the bolt re-seating the primer - so that if you have a light load with light recoil you may get cases with primers that were not completely re-seated. This does not mean you have loose primer pockets - in fact it may be caused by an overly tight primer pocket that resists the re-seating.

    Best way to tell a lose primer pocket is the force needed to seat a new primer - if it is too easy you have loose primer pockets.
    Wayne the Shrink

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  5. #5
    Boolit Man
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    Thanks for the info. I'm shooting once fired Winchester SuperX brass. As long as the brass is clean I'm good doesn't need to be shiny correct? I will try to get some pics? Not much of a computer wiz.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master
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    You're data is fine, where di you get it? Do you have and have you read a loading manual? Some of your questions would suggest you haven't.
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  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    4. What do I do now with the brass? I know I need to clean it and reprime. Can I just clean it with some soap and water and let it dry well? Not worried about it being shiny and gleaming.Do I need to check the length? Resize it? Little bit foggy on what to do now.
    Thank you for any help you can give!

    you will want to check brass length and trim if necessary, can be as simple as getting the inexpensive lee tools or go all out and buy a electric powered micro adjustable trimmer or even the old style case gauge that you use with a file to trim case. whichever way you will want a inside/outside chamfer tool and chamfer case mouth after trimming if it needs to be trimmed or before reloading if trimming is not necessary.
    and yes you will next run it through the resizing die.

    now my thoughts on cleaning brass

    years ago the only thing we ever did before reloading brass was to wipe it clean, punch the primer out, use a primer pocket cleaner like with the cheap little tool lee sells. you sure dont want any sand on your ammo.. but if you police your brass and keep it out of the mud and sand just wiping it off is all that's really needed.
    put a new primer back in and reload.
    these days there is a huge market for brass cleaning devices and products. hornady, Lyman and the rest are making lots of money selling all types of products to clean brass. when I started collecting unwanted brass wholesale at the public range I built a tumbler out of a paint shaker machine and bottom 1/3 of a barrel, bought corn cob and walnut by the 50 lb sack--still do- and flitz tumbler additive by the gallon.
    but these days cheap Chinese ultrasound machines and any number of things to pour into it are common, and rotary tumbles with stainless pins and liquid cleaner seem too be all the rage today. its not really necessary especially for indoor range brass., but then again who doesn't like brass that shines like new.
    Last edited by farmbif; 01-27-2022 at 11:54 AM.

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    All good advice. I didn’t see in your post that you said you sized the brass? If not, that has to happen. Every other point was spot on and you need to do what has been pointed out. If you don’t have a loading manual, get one….the Lyman is probably the best. Get on-line and watch a few good videos on reloading. You MUST not deviate from published load data at this point….you’re simply too new at this. Be safe and good luck with your reloading.

  9. #9
    Boolit Grand Master popper's Avatar
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    Washing brass is fine, use some dawn, lemishine & hot water. The Lee PP tool is ***. Make sure to rinse and dry the cases. Your load is good, 30 gr is close to max. You should full length size the cases, washing keeps crud out of the die. So far you seem to be doing OK. Seating depth may cause the hard to chamber but crimp bulge or improper sizing could be the problem. Make sure your sizing die is locked down so case is sized properly. Check a sized case in the gun to verify or get a case gauge. Keep a dummy rnd with correct seating depth to set/check seating depth.
    Whatever!

  10. #10
    Boolit Bub
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    Thought I would provide a bit of insight on the OP's concern over primers backing out. This is something that is not uncommon with rear locking lever guns firing relatively low pressure rounds. What occurs is the firing pin pushes the round forward to the limits of the rim recess, primer fires and ignites the powder. The pressure builds with the cartridge case grabbing the chamber walls, however the pressure is not high enough to stretch the brass back to the bolt face but will push the primer back. I read sometime ago where someone had removed the locking bolt from a 94 Winchester, fired the rifle and the breech bolt did not come flying out the back of the receiver. I would not recommend this and I sure wouldn't want to be holding the rifle at the time.

  11. #11
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Put the cases in a mesh bag , don't crowd , tie bag top closed very securely , when doing the laundry toss the bag in with cloths ... wash and dry on normal cycle . If wife asks what you are doing ...say I'm doing the Laundry just to help you out .

    I've also used a Quart jar with tight fitting lid ... water and a shot of Dawn dish washing soap ... agitate every now and again ...when the water is good and dirty ...drain and rinse a few times in clean water ... let em dry .

    Be sure and size your cases in your resizing die ... they should chamber easily .
    Gary
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  12. #12
    Boolit Buddy
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    resize the cases

  13. #13
    Boolit Master Murphy's Avatar
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    DeepSouth,

    Welcome to the world of reloading your own, it's more than worth the effort. I've read all the above comments and may have missed a reply as to some of your loads being harder to chamber than others.

    "3. A few of the reloads were harder than some others to chamber. Had to work harder to chamber them. They shot fine just harder to chamber than some of the others. Ok, not ok?"

    The next time you chamber a loaded cartridge if it seems harder to load than the others, eject it. Look the bullet over and see if it is engaging the rifling. If you already have a 6" dial caliper, measure the over all length of your loaded cartridges. I have a feeling you may want to check the consistency of your loaded cartridges. Just my 2¢ worth.

    Murphy
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  14. #14
    Boolit Master Shawlerbrook's Avatar
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    I generally only shoot Castboolits in old rifles like your 1893. I have one made in 1900 as well as a few pre-WWI Winchesters and just like to be gentle with these old treasures. That said, a few jacketed bullets loaded to reasonable levels should be fine for an old girl in good shape.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
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    Congratulations on getting that rifle back into service!

    I second the issue with overall length and hard to chamber. Might just need to seat the bullets a tad deeper. But, might also be that your bullet crimp is not set right.

    When setting up my dies for a rifle I have the rifle in the room. Make some dummy rounds (no primers or powder). Run them through the rifle and make sure they cycle easily. If there is an issue I will use a black Sharpie to color the bullet and place it back in the chamber. Close the bolt and carefully eject it. If it is hitting the rifling you will see the marks on the bullet.

    Cleaning. For many decades I just used soap and water. They dry faster if decapped first. If you need to speed the drying put in an oven at 250deg for 20 min. If you want shinier then a bit of vinegar will work (don't leave in there too long).

    Later I found that Citric Acid (Leminshine, in the canning section at Walmart) will brighten up the brass the best (without a tumbler).

    I would use a container with a tight lid, fill it up with solution and brass, and shake it around a minute or two. Rinse and dry.

    But....you don't have to clean them at all if you don't want to. It does get your fingers a bit dirty during reloading

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    For a case measerer I would recommend a digital caliper from Harbor Tool and Freight. They are cheap and they work. When you get it also get a spare battery. Sooner or later you are going to do something where you really need to measure something and you battery will be dead. Spares are handy and prevent needless trip to the battery store/drug store. Reloading is fun. Make sure you have several manuals. If data disagrees significantly question data in all manuals.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master
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    Make sure to lube those cases before resizing...then wipe them off. Like Murphy and charlie say, make sure the boolits aren't engaging the rifling, use the sharpie trick.
    Take a kid to the range, you'll both be glad you did.

  18. #18
    Boolit Buddy Sam Sackett's Avatar
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    One comment on lubing the cases. I had an issue a while back with some cartridges being hard to chamber after reloading. I beat myself up pretty good before I finally figured it out. During full length sizing, the expander button was dragging on the inside of the neck during withdrawal. I did notice the handle moving a little harder, but not enough to stand out. Come to find out, the expander button was dragging just enough to stretch the neck enough to be noticeable during chambering. I started lubing the inside of the neck before sizing and the issue went away.

    Maybe it’s as simple as that.
    Sam Sackett

  19. #19
    Boolit Man
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    Folks thank you for all the info. I apologize for not getting back quicker I'm studying for my CDL. I had it once let it lapse 20yrs ago mow have to have it again. Studying stuff for a test in your 50s sucks. At least for me it does. I do have several manuals I got my loads out of them. I dont have them near by at the minute. On the rounds hard to chamber I did eject them and check that the bullet wasn't rammed into the rifling. I will try lubing inside the neck. After the recommendation of Lemishine I remembered that being mentioned. I have been reading about reloading and boolit casting for literally years just have never had the space or time to actually do it. So I may not have everything in order in my mind. Thanks for all the advice I will be getting back to yall with more questions.
    Thanks Michael

  20. #20
    Boolit Master
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    +10 on always lubing your cases prior to sizing!

    Stuck cases are a PITA!

    Three44s
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    “There is more to this than dumping lead in a hole.”

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check