Starting out at hopeless and moving toward better prepared

[MUSTANG]

Keep in mind that the "Use By Date" printed on many food products is a posting that was created by the US Government (and states such as California) for "Protection of the Population". A variety of organizational goals went into the "Eat By Dates".

I remember in the 1980's eating a bunch of "expired C-Rats" in the field because the Supply Pukes had been told to get rid of those Vietnam Era C-Rats. No one got sick and they remained tasty (C-rats are in Cans. MRE's are in plastic baggies with foiled packages for each product for those who never served in military. C-rats were the generation before MRE's.)

[dverna]

Just wanted to add a bit to my post about "tribes". Family members of the tribe leader will get a pass...most will have skills the tribe needs but some will not. Better not complain about the ones who do not have skills...you are an outsider.

If you are a "friend" of the tribe leader and his family, you better have something the tribe needs. If it is only "stuff" you are on shaky ground if the SHTF event lasts for long. For example, guns and ammunition are easily taken for the "greater good". Food, tools, fuel etc are the same. What skills so YOU bring to the party?

If you cast bullets and reload, you do not want others to learn from you, or you are expendable...keep that skill/knowledge in your family. Do your homework on what calibers the potential members of your tribe use and build a small stock of components. I have redundant weapons in calibers I shoot I can give people. If you do not reload for shotguns...learn and get the stuff to go it. Even a cheap MEC is enough, but you need two 12 and 20 ga. 5 bags of shot will yield 2000 1 oz loads or 1800 1 1/8 oz loads. Plenty to hunt with. A Lee buckshot mold will make a lot of defensive loads for a small investment. Use low recoil buckshot loads so women and children can effectively defend an attack. Forget about slugs...shotguns are point and shoot up close.

If you are able to dope the wind, adjust for range and kill at 800 yards, you have skills most people cannot match. The value of a good sniper increases the safety of your tribe in both defensive and offensive roles.

If you have medical training, you are going to be like gold. Stock up on the stuff you need to do your job.

Can you build and repair stuff?

Do you have a strong back?

A 70 year old man who had no skills has no value. A 35 year old man that weighs 350 lbs that has no skills may have value if he loses 150 lbs and is willing to work. Without value, you will not last if you are an "outsider". And if you do not last, your family is done unless your wife/daughters are attractive. Sure, they will miss you, but they will have children to take care of and protect....and will do what they need to do.

Just the way it will be. IMO.

[Wag]

If you're going to buy extra food on each shopping trip, be sure to store it correctly. Rotate the new food into the back of the pantries and make regular use of the food in front. If you're storing food in areas other than the pantry, make sure the climate is suitable. The garage may or may not be suitable for some things.

There are proper ways to store dry goods like beans and rice. If you buy powdered milk or other powdered drink mixes, there are proper ways to store that, too.

If you don't do it right, you could easily find yourself in a position of owning a whole mess of food that is worthless garbage.

--Wag--

[Cosmic_Charlie]

The Russian Lady is wrong. Most will start to expire on day 7 to 10. The stores will "Last" 3 days before they are all bought out/looted out/burned out. This will be followed by 2 to 4 days of Bing Eating/Drinking/and other debauchery acts. After that point; the low life types will start going door to door breaking in and stealing and committing debauchery acts to what will emerge as the Victimhood Masses. Those who will survive will be those who are capable of RUTHLESS ACTION against those who would prey on others.

Think of how bad it would smell if you had half a dozen goblins rotting on the boulevard. It would drive some people crazy, especially when the stray dogs started eating them ( bears and wolves too in these parts). That is the whole idea of bugging out. Getting far away from crowds. There are quite a few seasonal hunting shacks and cabins in these parts that will be empty i figure. Better to starve in solitude than while being harrased by criminals.

[dverna]

Think of how bad it would smell if you had half a dozen goblins rotting on the boulevard. It would drive some people crazy, especially when the stray dogs started eating them ( bears and wolves too in these parts). That is the whole idea of bugging out. Getting far away from crowds. There are quite a few seasonal hunting shacks and cabins in these parts that will be empty i figure. Better to starve in solitude than while being harrased by criminals.

Not a good plan. Someone owns those shacks and they are thinking the same way. They will murder you when they find you there. If the owners do not murder you, the locals will. You are not known, and you will be using "their" resources. The locals are many and you are few.

I doubt people bugging out to places they do not own and who are not known by the locals will last a week. They have no right to be there, and more importantly are not welcome. You will not survive on state/federal land either. The locals already think those areas are theirs. We call mushroomers and hunters violators and trespassers now...it will be worse when the SHTF.

There will be no law and order when the SHTF. God will not intervene to protect the weak...He will be there to welcome you to heaven as He always is. SHTF just makes the journey shorter for most of us.

[Cosmic_Charlie]

Not a good plan. Someone owns those shacks and they are thinking the same way. They will murder you when they find you there. If the owners do not murder you, the locals will. You are not known, and you will be using "their" resources. The locals are many and you are few.

I doubt people bugging out to places they do not own and who are not known by the locals will last a week. They have no right to be there, and more importantly are not welcome. You will not survive on state/federal land either. The locals already think those areas are theirs. We call mushroomers and hunters violators and trespassers now...it will be worse when the SHTF.

There will be no law and order when the SHTF. God will not intervene to protect the weak...He will be there to welcome you to heaven as He always is. SHTF just makes the journey shorter for most of us.

Figure quite a few will not make it out of the city. And we are local anyway. So much depends on the time of year it is. Winter would present a real challenge. And we know plenty of folks who live in the boonies who would most likely not mind having an RN and a well armed extra man on the premises .

[BrassMagnet]

There are so many ways to look at this. So many choices.

[Scrounge]

Figure quite a few will not make it out of the city. And we are local anyway. So much depends on the time of year it is. Winter would present a real challenge. And we know plenty of folks who live in the boonies who would most likely not mind having an RN and a well armed extra man on the premises .

Quite a few won't make it out of the city, but the few who do will probably be many compared to how many of you live out in the country. I grew up in SoCal, mostly Los Angeles County. At the time, there were about 6 million people there, including me and my brother and mother. If 90% die in that first week, that is still 600,000 hungry and angry survivors. And that is just one of the many metropolitan areas nearly 50 years ago. LA County is now over 12,000,000 people. Twice as many folks, and perhaps twice as many survivors. Multiply by every city in the entire country, and all the coastal areas.

I'm a fair mechanic and electronics tech, and I can fake being a plumber and electrician to some extent. Been learning to be a machinst, too. I spent five of the past 7 years as a maintenance tech in a big industrial laundry, and have learned some stuff about 3phase power 880VAC and below, rebuilt hydraulic cylinders and pumps and air compressors, and such. Useful but not necessarily necessary. And I'm getting old and creaky. Family MIGHT let me in. Not sure I could bet on it.

Bill

[Winger Ed.]

There are quite a few seasonal hunting shacks and cabins in these parts that will be empty i figure.

Oh noooo,,,,,
That's a concept with about a 99% chance of getting murdered.

[almar]

late 1990's Quebec. i was a kid in my 20's in the army corp of engineers. A big ice storm took out the electrical grid in January i think. The ice built up on the wires and pylons and collapsed them, hundreds of them. We were deployed to help people in Montreal. It was quite an experience to see how fragile society is. We had to set up shelters in school gymnasiums and people were literally helpless unable to fend for themselves, all stores were empty and boarded, no electricity, no food, no nothing. Many died because of CO2 poisoning trying to heat their house in different ways. My girlfriend at the time dumped me over the only phone call i got in weeks due to the fact that i was deployed to often, that left a nihilist scar on my soul then. Many houses were robbed by rats taking advantage of the situation, we had to patrol the neighborhoods, the police were not functional. We were tasked at handing out firewood to people, this old couple was almost robbed of their wood in front of us by young guys until we stepped in. My parents lived in the suburbs but were fine because they used a big wood stove to heat the house and they heated their food on the stove like the old days. They had plenty of stores. I wasn't worried about them because i knew my father and how he grew up, they came out of that unscathed and laughing how they had to read in candlelight. Fast forward to today, in this technological dependent era when people cant even read a simple road map...i cant even imagine the outcome. You need food, water fire and shelter as well as a good supply of ammo and firearms to fend off the rats. I have that covered...do you?

[Cosmic_Charlie]

Foraging on public lands makes you a "violator"? What a pathetic, provincial mindset....

[BrassMagnet]

Foraging on public lands makes you a "violator"? What a pathetic, provincial mindset....

It may be a pathetic, provincial mindset, but I do suspect he might be right. I strongly suspect it would be far better to own your own small cabin on your own land even if you are only a sometimes occupant and only know some locals. Now what are you going to do when someone claims your cabin is theirs and refuses to leave?

[MrWolf]

It may be a pathetic, provincial mindset, but I do suspect he might be right. I strongly suspect it would be far better to own your own small cabin on your own land even if you are only a sometimes occupant and only know some locals. Now what are you going to do when someone claims your cabin is theirs and refuses to leave?

Even that may not be enough to be considered belonging there. There is a hunting cabin on 30 acres just below my place. Current owner has pictures of guys hunting and on his property even though it is posted. I told him I wouldn't make an issue of it as he comes out maybe twice a year and they are local. Might just find a pile of ashes on his next visit. It took almost two years to "convince" the locals that just because a prior owner might have let them hunt on my property that they were entitled to. Almost had it out with one guy who I was being nice to whose cousin was a prior owner and let his daughters shoot on one section. Found him there by himself and basically went downhill fast from there. Seems he claimed he was entitled to be there and he had permission! Told him to get the hell off my property after some back and forth. He came to the house a few hours later and apologized saying he didn't realize where my property lines really were. We are cordial now but he can only be there with his daughters for them to shoot. Won't penalize kids because their Father was an ass.

[MrWolf]

Found a prepper video mentioning this place. You can get a supply of antibiotics (think 30 days) from online doctors in the USA now and Canada starting Feb 1st. Cost is around $250 from memory and use "canadianprepper" as a code for $20 off. I have fish and bird meds for some antibiotics (same stuff per my former doctor). I will ask my doctor on Monday if he would prescribe the same so it could go through insurance or even GoodRX for better pricing. No narcotics folks. Here is a copy from their website. Can just look up Jase Case.

The Jase Case

WHAT EVERY HOUSEHOLD NEEDS

Emergency Preparedness Antibiotics (and a guidebook for their safe use!)

[rancher1913]

we have the kit and its good to have but you need someone with extensive medial knowledge like an rn or higher that can you can consult with as to when to take what. antibiotics are not useful for everything and certain antibiotics do certain things that others dont, so you really dont want to just blindly use them

[Markopolo]

Sounds great BM.. but how did you possibly get ALL that stuff you been scalpin all these years of CB to your new digs… Musta been a convoy of trucks!!!!!

Very glad you got outta the city… should have just came up to “MY Island”.. here in SE Alaska.. Who needs civilization???? None of them city folks gunna make it here unless they swim… did I mention the water is kinda cold????

[dverna]

Foraging on public lands makes you a "violator"? What a pathetic, provincial mindset....

This is why you die in a SHTF event. Being right, is not going to keep you alive.

Most will die from lack of water, food and shelter. Other will die because someone wants their water, food, shelter, guns, ammunition, wife, daughters etc. And there are folks, like you, who will die because you do not understand people with a "pathetic, provincial mindset".

Look, I am not trying to insult you. I am laying out the way rural folks in my area think, and I surmise other areas will be the same. People are people. IMO, bugging out is the worst possible option for most people. Here is why.

You are leaving your shelter and preps. You cannot carry enough stuff to survive for long...so you will end up killing others who are bugging out, or locals to stay alive. You will need to kill them because no one is going to hand you stuff when you run out.

The locals will kill you. They have been attacked by others who are bugging out and you are a threat. If you make it to a "safe" place, you are still using "their" resources and recourses will be scant. You are stealing food from them. They will not let you live.

Unless you bug out with a reasonably large armed force you will be the target of others trying to escape.


As to your situation. Your wife being an RN is a huge asset if the group you want to partner with needs those skills. If they already have someone...find another group. Finding a group that will need you and accept you has to be done before the SHTF; and IMO years before the SHTF or you will always be viewed as an outsider.

A group of less than a dozen is unlikely to make it if/when things get really bad. Larger groups will form alliances, so they do not kill themselves off. Smaller groups are "supply depots".

[Cosmic_Charlie]

I am afraid i would just wind up bugging in, rotting corpses on the boulevard and all. But the boonie locations i was thinking of are not really like neighborhoods with locals at all. There is no power, no cell service etc and nobody living there year round.

[Wag]

All of what Don Verna just said. ^^^

In my mind, good people are going to be compelled to do some very nasty things if they want to survive. Those unwilling to do them are going to die, one way or the other. Thirst, starvation or murder. Morality cannot be a part of your decision-making process in a true SHTF situation.

What is FACT is going to matter a whole lot more than what you choose to believe. If you believe people will be good, you will likely be setting yourself up for a lot pain, suffering and heartache. It's likely to become a real eye-opener for anyone who has always had the idea that "it won't happen to me."

We can all wake up now or we will be awakened in the moments before we get taken out along with our families.

--Wag--

[MUSTANG]

What in a "Civilized" Society is now considered MURDER will be normal in a collapse of Society. People will be killed for crossing a Line that no one else even knows exists. Such as:

If you cross this road you will be shot from hidden cover.
If you pass this intersection you will be shot from hidden cover.
If you take this exit, you will be shot from cover.
If you are seen attempting to go in these buildings you will be shot from cover.
If you cross this ridgeline you will be shot from cover.

Put simply; the "Bug Outers" attempting to get to their chosen locations (even if they own them and stocked them) will not find getting there and living there an easy effort. (By the way; the "You Will Be Shot" are actually trigger points for locals I have heard discussed in Real Conversations in the Carolinas, Virginia, Texas, Nevada, and Montana over the Years