Where are all the workers?

[Handloader109]

I dont believe we have a shortage of workers. What we have are business owners who will not pay wages the workers want. At $20 an hour a worker would have a really tough time trying to afford a wife and 1 child, small house, car payment and all the rest such as food and utilities. Medical coverage is off the charts expensive.
Right now we are at a stall mate. Workers want more than most employers want to pay so they stay home and collect freebies.

Maybe..... But you don't have to have a house, or a new car, and a new cellphone, and a new 65"tv, and on and on.
My daughter is single, she makes roughly $35k a year. She's paid off about $10k in student loans and saved $30k in about 3 years of working. In addition, paid $6k for her car. She just spent her saving on her new home, and yes, we helped her financially, but she still has a $140k mortgage that she can pay along with her other expenses. Healthcare costs her $25 a week. Which is cheap. It all depends on your priorities. Which should be work first. Government is PAYING folks to stay home. It isnt sustainable, and we will all soon find that out

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

[30calflash]

Many reasons already covered here, all in force to a large degree. I think covid consciousness has overcome folks thought patterns and many choose to not be out of their comfort area, safe space, to deal with once common everyday life occurances.

I think part of it is work has become a dirty 4 letter word. Why work when you don't have to, no reason to get to a job and deal with whatever. Older folks found that with the handout they could do fine and maybe get ahead, now that it's done they adapted and can stay cozy as is.

A lot of younger people, not all, have their folks to keep them comfortable, no reason to go back to work or get a job. I know of a few instances of this, friends nephews have pt job for whatever they need and the older family members pay the bills and keep them warm and safe.

If things take a fair turn downward in our economic situ they will be the ones wondering what happened and who turned the lights off. And not have the motivation to do much about it.

[C.F.Plinker]

I've been in my house over 25 years now. About half of my neighbors were here when I bought. According to the assessor my house is worth about 4 times what it was when I bought. When I bought, the rule of thumb was that you could afford a house that was twice your income. Or, to put it another way, your income had to be about half of the value of the house. With many houses going for over $300,000, the household income has to be $150,000 a year or $75 per hour or more. That can be tough for a two earner family, so many seem to be extended families with more that two earners or rentals occupied by unrelated individuals.

It's easy to tell the old timers from the newcomers. The old timers seem to have only one or two cars and generally keep them in the garage. Unless they have kids who may park in the driveway. The newcomers fill their driveways and overflow into the streets. There will be a cluster of cars on the street and in the driveway followed by several houses where the driveway and streets are clear.

Sometimes I think that kids expect to come out of school and get a job that will allow them to buy a house that is at least as good as their parents house and also get a new car (or two) right off the bat without having to put in the hours that their folks did in order to afford what they (the parents) have toward the end of their careers.

[BrassMagnet]

I've been in my house over 25 years now. About half of my neighbors were here when I bought. According to the assessor my house is worth about 4 times what it was when I bought. When I bought, the rule of thumb was that you could afford a house that was twice your income. Or, to put it another way, your income had to be about half of the value of the house. With many houses going for over $300,000, the household income has to be $150,000 a year or $75 per hour or more. That can be tough for a two earner family, so many seem to be extended families with more that two earners or rentals occupied by unrelated individuals.

It's easy to tell the old timers from the newcomers. The old timers seem to have only one or two cars and generally keep them in the garage. Unless they have kids who may park in the driveway. The newcomers fill their driveways and overflow into the streets. There will be a cluster of cars on the street and in the driveway followed by several houses where the driveway and streets are clear.

Sometimes I think that kids expect to come out of school and get a job that will allow them to buy a house that is at least as good as their parents house and also get a new car (or two) right off the bat without having to put in the hours that their folks did in order to afford what they (the parents) have toward the end of their careers.

This is a very interesting thread. So much has already been covered that I will not beat a dead horse any more.
So this is the only point I will address: Financial responsibility and budgeting!
Our current culture and our financial industries push a version of financial responsibility that is not recognizable by my Grandmother or any of the adherents of the Dave Ramsey plan. Our financial industries push debt to earning ratios that are unbelievably high and impossible to keep under control. A sneeze will lead to bankruptcy for these people and our government is pushing policies that guarantee the sneeze will happen very soon. Long ago, I realized I was too far in debt and I needed to fix it. My friends were so much more financially responsible than me that I felt inadequate. As time went by and I reduced my debt ratio, I realized that my friends were much worse off than I was and they were merely much better at fooling themselves about their financial health.
I have been debt free for many years with a well paying job and a military retirement. Now that I am no longer working, I have purchased a new home and I am trying to get out of the old home and fully into the new home so I can sell the old home. My goal is to make myself debt free again as soon as possible. I am not planning on years to accomplish this, just a few more months.
I fear our economy is failing so fast that I may not have those few more months I need.

[MUSTANG]

I think that we have a high risk group of new hires out there, They havent done a lot, few or sketchy work references. little to no experience. Yet they want to start out at top pay before being trained and or proving themselves.

They dont want to start at a smaller shop or business and gain experience. But at the top of the pay scale.

I have seen these people come into a shop and inside 2 weeks are telling the bosses owners how to run the business.

I worked a local shop until 1997 then went looking for a new job. I could document 20+ years experience at 35 years old. ( I started in my first job shop at 15 after school and weekends.) then went to the above factory. The "joke" at this place was it was a good place to be from. What Im getting at is I had a skill set and work record that was valuable to would be employers. The owner of the small job shop gave the best reference of all, If I could afford to hire him back I would in an instance.

When I chose the new job I went from $13.00 and change to almost $24.00 an hour, benefits went from 80/20 to 100%.

Until you have the references or journeyman's card you are a risk to employers.

Much wisdom in this vignette of one man's life experience.

[Idaho45guy]

Maybe..... But you don't have to have a house, or a new car, and a new cellphone, and a new 65"tv, and on and on.
My daughter is single, she makes roughly $35k a year. She's paid off about $10k in student loans and saved $30k in about 3 years of working. In addition, paid $6k for her car. She just spent her saving on her new home, and yes, we helped her financially, but she still has a $140k mortgage that she can pay along with her other expenses. Healthcare costs her $25 a week. Which is cheap. It all depends on your priorities. Which should be work first. Government is PAYING folks to stay home. It isnt sustainable, and we will all soon find that out

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

You have to figure in the cost of living as well for the region. You are in one of the poorest states in America. #5...

https://legitinformant.com/15-poores...median-income/

Which means you have a much lower cost of living than most other places. Arkansas is actually the third cheapest state in the US to live.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/st...cost-of-living

"The state with the third-lowest cost of living in Arkansas. Arkansas has a cost of living index of 87.8, with housing, transportation, and healthcare costs all being significantly lower than the national average. Arkansas's housing index is just 75.2, meaning that residents spend about $708 per month on average on rent or mortgages. To live comfortably in Arkansas, one would need to make only $44,571 for a family, which is just below the median household income of $45,726."

Your daughter, making $35k as a single person, is actually quite wealthy in Arkansas.

[Plate plinker]

All the marginal workers are collecting gov money and staying home getting drunk or high if your in a marijuana state. Stupid government do goodies are doing the best they can at wrecking the country.

[Thundarstick]

Chicken processing plant is advertising for help desperately since going along with mandates, ain't that strange? My son will tell you that a lot of places are still very picky about hiring. They want you to work like an elephant for peanuts and have a record like a Saint!

I'll agree with others that the perception of hiring and staff shortages is a smoke screen in mass by instances.

[1hole]

Our liberal/progressive/socialist government and its "useful idiots" have finally proven to our new professional indolents what their school teachers always told them is true: "Yawl vote Democrat and kindly bureaucrats will take money from the "greedy rich" (aka, the people who have money because they work for a living) and give it to the "starving poor" (aka, the people without money because they won't work but will reliably vote for more handouts). As Lady Margaret Thacher once observed, the dreams of socialism is very attractive and will work great until all the "rich" people run out of money. At that point, America's already staggering national economy will surely collapse and human life will become a murderous "dog eat dog" fight to survive from meal to meal.

[country gent]

What is really worry some with this is the history that predates it. When Pearl Harbor was bombed (up till then the government was doing ll it could to stay out of the war). When war was declared auto plants and most manufacturing was converted to war effort / goods in around 6 months, new plants were built and in production almost as fast, building were built in sections from start to end of the line when the section was finished equipment moved in and production started usually before the building was finished.

Today if the same need arose I dont think they could tool up for the need production in 3 years. Ford went to making planes chevy made heavy trucks and some arms chrysler retooled for tank production singer was retooling for arms the machine makers made the production equipment for the new lines. Kaisrer came up with the "production line" to make liberty ships, Here completed sections of the hull were completed off site ( hulls inner and outer decks equipment wiring all in place) brought to the ways and assembled.

Im ashamed to say today I just dont think the work force has this in them.

[1hole]

.... When war was declared auto plants and most manufacturing was converted to war effort / goods in around 6 months, new plants were built and in production almost as fast, building were built in sections from start to end of the line when the section was finished equipment moved in and production started usually before the building was finished.

Today if the same need arose I dont think they could tool up for the need production in 3 years. Ford went to making planes chevy made heavy trucks and some arms chrysler retooled for tank production singer was retooling for arms the machine makers made the production equipment for the new lines. Kaisrer came up with the "production line" to make liberty ships, Here completed sections of the hull were completed off site ( hulls inner and outer decks equipment wiring all in place) brought to the ways and assembled.

Today, getting passed gubbermint itself would be the biggest obstacle. Complying with the stacks of insane govvy regulations and studies before any such construction could legally begin would take years.

Im ashamed to say today I just dont think the work force has this in them.

Sadly so. I believe maybe 10-20% of our teens and maybe 25-35% of our adults are willing to actually work (but no more than that). The rest of today's employees seem to think standing around yakking in the company parking lot or making cell calls in a break room is human health destroying "work".

[Idaho45guy]

Im ashamed to say today I just dont think the work force has this in them.

I am continuously amazed at the lack of work ethics displayed by my young co-workers. Just a couple of days ago, we got a few inches of snow. Normal for this area. Five out of ten people on my team called in. And two of them lived in town!

[Charlie Horse]

I live in the St. Louis region, just retired, and am willing to go back to work. Just sayin'.

[john.k]

Crazy prices for real estate are the weak link in the social contract......young people have no hope of buying a house ,so they dont even consider any need to plan for a future..........in fact the greatest fraud of the century will be the near zero interest rates that have somehow happened the last 15 or so years........The already rich can buy houses at almost no cost ,and continuously inflate the cost of real estate......Yet ,even though a house can be bought for almost no cost,credit tests and income requirements prevent working people from ever owning a house ,and so they are required to rent a house from the rich all their lives.

[rancher1913]

Crazy prices for real estate are the weak link in the social contract......young people have no hope of buying a house ,so they dont even consider any need to plan for a future..........in fact the greatest fraud of the century will be the near zero interest rates that have somehow happened the last 15 or so years........The already rich can buy houses at almost no cost ,and continuously inflate the cost of real estate......Yet ,even though a house can be bought for almost no cost,credit tests and income requirements prevent working people from ever owning a house ,and so they are required to rent a house from the rich all their lives.

depends on the young uns, our kid and her husband bought a house at 21. they searched for a small house in a good area in a price they could afford, she is a waitress and he is air force reserves and going to collage, no family helped them, they did it on their own. he does pick up any extra jobs he can along the way and she makes their weals, no eating out.

[Thundarstick]

Crazy prices for real estate are the weak link in the social contract......young people have no hope of buying a house ,so they dont even consider any need to plan for a future..........in fact the greatest fraud of the century will be the near zero interest rates that have somehow happened the last 15 or so years........The already rich can buy houses at almost no cost ,and continuously inflate the cost of real estate......Yet ,even though a house can be bought for almost no cost,credit tests and income requirements prevent working people from ever owning a house ,and so they are required to rent a house from the rich all their lives.

Look into what happens when a country monetizes is debt. Inflation goes insane, but assets generally increase as well, homes, investments, ect. However wages fail to keep up and the bottom 60% go backwards, while the upper third do well, and the 1% make out like bandits.

[thxmrgarand]

beechbum444, Seattle is the closest large city, US city that is, to southern AK. No one goes to Anchorage on purpose, especially for health care, where they can pay up to 70 percent more for surprisingly poorer outcomes.

[JSnover]

I don't have any links but there is a recent trend that popped up in my news feed twice in the last 3-4 months: The 'quit' rate.
A LOT of people who chose and were able to continue to work through the pandemic are and have been quitting their old jobs for better wages and benefits. I've done it and so have half the guys I worked with in the last year.
All of us were 'long term' employees with 7-10 years at the same company but when everyone else decided to lay on the couch and collect "stimmies" (hipster/slacker lingo for government stimulus checks), employers started offering better wages because it was the only way to stay in business.
To answer the OPs question, the workers are still out there and a lot of them are doing better these days. The slackers who never really wanted to work... they got their wish. Hopefully the Biden/Harris Covid syndrome is mitigated and we get back to normal soon but if/when that happens the couch potatoes might be disappointed. The decent job they quit last year either disappeared or was taken over by someone else. And it pays better now.

[BrassMagnet]

I don't have any links but there is a recent trend that popped up in my news feed twice in the last 3-4 months: The the 'quit' rate.
A LOT of people who chose and were able to continue to work through the pandemic are and have been quitting their old jobs for better wages and benefits. I've done it and so have half the guys I worked with in last year.
All of us were 'long term' employees with 7-10 years at the same company but when everyone else decided to lay on the couch and collect "stimmies" (hipster/slacker lingo for government stimulus checks), employers started offering better wages because it was the only way to stay in business.
To answer the OPs question, the workers are still out there and a lot of them are doing better these days. The slackers who never really wanted to work... they got their wish. Hopefully the Biden/Harris Covid syndrome is mitigated and we get back to normal soon but if/when that happens the couch potatoes might be disappointed. The decent job they quit last year either disappeared or was taken over by someone else. And it pays better now.

Well said!
WooHoo!!!

[elmacgyver0]

Elections do have consequences.