357magnum hunting/hot load

[johnsonian09]

So if anyone recognizes this, I was working up a load for deer in 357 mag. I'm newer to the revolver world. It's a ruger gp100 6 inch barrel.

Been loading mp hammers flush to the cylinder so that the bullet barely clears when rotating around. I figured that would lower pressure and help out a bit since I'm running it on the hotter side, using lyman50th for reference.

Using the cup point they weight out to 166grns so I used the data for 358429

This is what 14.8 grns of h110 does to the primers. Sometimes they're blown pretty flat, sometimes they arent. Can see the rough millwork on the back of the revolver imprinted onto the primer cup too.

I dont normally try to get it all hot rodded up. No need with rifles,and accuracy seems great. Should I stop here or back off some? I think I'd back off but I'm not as familiar as some of you guys may be.

Might be a little subjective but,
My hand says it's not nearly as hot as some factory j-word 158grn pmc stuff that I shot a while ago. was almost painful to shoot a box of that..

That or I'm starting to like the recoil Lol

Any opinions?

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[megasupermagnum]

You aren't even close to max. I'd have to check data for an exact number, but you could safely go to 16 grains. In all likeliness, depending on your bullet, you could go up to 17gr, but I'd need more info first. You are just now at a decent starting load. I'd look at about 15.5-16 gr for best accuracy, although you do not state what exact bullet you are using.

[1006]

They look safe.

I think you have room for more pressure, as well. My 357 loads are based on a 125 grain Jacketed Hollow Point; a rifle primer allowed me to get the maximum velocity with a slightly lighter powder charge (less powder compression)with W296. I was using a 6inch S&W, N Frame.

Of course, if they are already traveling at an acceptable velocity and accuracy, it is time to shoot them.

[zarrinvz24]

I've loaded some 358311's about that weight cast and lubed, 16.5gr. I'd say your load is fine.

[johnsonian09]

Even with the primers being almost completely flat? Cool

the max listing for h110 w/ an 170grn is 15 grains of h110.
These mp hammers are 166 so I didn't want to use the 358311/160 load data which lists 16.5 for max.
But the hammer is an in-between weight.
And I'm paranoid about keeping my fingers attached.

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[44MAG#1]

Even with the primers being almost completely flat? Cool

the max listing for h110 w/ an 170grn is 15 grains of h110.
These mp hammers are 166 so I didn't want to use the 358311/160 load data which lists 16.5 for max.
But the hammer is an in-between weight.
And I'm paranoid about keeping my fingers attached.

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People with experience almost never use primer appearance as a pressure sign. I know I never do and I have been reloading 51 years or so. Of course, that is just me. If the cases don't show excessive pressure go for it if the load shoots well.

[1006]

https://www.hodgdonreloading.com/rel...c=true&type=53


15.5 is max for a Sierra 170 jacketed, and you are loading them pretty long, reducing pressure slightly.

I do not consider the primer flat until the horizontal gap between the brass and the primer is a thin line. Also, I look for for primer cratering.

[NSB]

I’ve shot over fifty deer with the .357mag revolver and none of them required going over book loads to kill them. Not a one. I’ve never lost one I shot either. Muzzle energy isn’t what kills them, it’s putting the bullet on the spot you’re aiming at. Focus on accuracy and forget about max speed, etc. I don’t shoot light loads, but bumping anything up never made a difference. The only deer I lost with a handgun was lost while shooting a full power 44mag. A bad hit is a bad hit and it can happen with any cartridge.

[FergusonTO35]

I’ve shot over fifty deer with the .357mag revolver and none of them required going over book loads to kill them. Not a one. I’ve never lost one I shot either. Muzzle energy isn’t what kills them, it’s putting the bullet on the spot you’re aiming at. Focus on accuracy and forget about max speed, etc. I don’t shoot light loads, but bumping anything up never made a difference. The only deer I lost with a handgun was lost while shooting a full power 44mag. A bad hit is a bad hit and it can happen with any cartridge.

This guy has it figured out, listen to him!

[44MAG#1]

This guy has it figured out, listen to him!

Wouldn't that be common sense? Bell used a 7X57 to kill many Elephants and farmers have used a 22RF to kill Hogs for more years than most can remember using proper shot placement.
Or so it seems to me
Not trying to be a jerk but just using common sense

[freakonaleash]

Deer are easy to kill. I have killed them with a .44 cal 1860 Army percussion gun. Round ball and 30 grains of 2ff goex. They go right down. Shoot your most accurate load, not one with the most recoil.

[zarrinvz24]

Even with the primers being almost completely flat? Cool

the max listing for h110 w/ an 170grn is 15 grains of h110.
These mp hammers are 166 so I didn't want to use the 358311/160 load data which lists 16.5 for max.
But the hammer is an in-between weight.
And I'm paranoid about keeping my fingers attached.

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The 358311 is 160 Gr. in Linotype, with Air cooled WW, sized and lubed to .3575, its very close to 165. Also, this load @ 16.5gr H110 is at 40,300 CUP. Remember the .357 was originally rated for 45000 CUP. You are loading a GP100, you should be more than fine. I shoot mine in an early 60's 6" Python. Start low and work up.

To be honest, you could load some hot .38Special's and they will be plenty effective on deer. Penetration will not be an issue, expansion will be controlled, but always placement is key.

[johnsonian09]

I'm not trying to ask about going over book.
I'm just at a point where accuracy has increased with velocity/ charge weight.

I'm new to reloading handguns and just want to make sure I'm on the right track. My book lists 15 as max and I'm using 14.8, so I'm proceeding with caution just because and checking second opinions

Primers looked flatter to me and the cases stuck a tiny bit when I pulled them. But I also shot some 38special that day to do a warm up before doing the accuracy tests.

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[358429]

Clean your gun and make fire balls! This is h110 from a 2.25" j frame.

[megasupermagnum]

I'm not trying to ask about going over book.
I'm just at a point where accuracy has increased with velocity/ charge weight.

I'm new to reloading handguns and just want to make sure I'm on the right track. My book lists 15 as max and I'm using 14.8, so I'm proceeding with caution just because and checking second opinions

Primers looked flatter to me and the cases stuck a tiny bit when I pulled them. But I also shot some 38special that day to do a warm up before doing the accuracy tests.

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The reason accuracy is improving, is because you are only now just starting to get into a good range for H110. If you were loading these to a shorter length, you might be in a reasonable spot. Since you are loading these long, you are only now at a good starting load. There's nothing wrong with starting slightly lower either as you did. The problem with going "over book" in this case is who's book do you go off of? Ok, so you are shooting the MP 359 Hammer, and you say you loaded these to the GP100 cylinder length, so I'm assuming 1.650".

Quickloads should NOT be considered load data. Some people do, but I don't fully trust it. Anyway, if I plug that info into Quickloads, your load at 14.8 gr of H110 and 1.650" OAL is calculates to 22,695 PSI. That seems about right to me. If I then inch it up, I get to 17 gr, which is 105% full case, which is about the most you will be able to compress it in my experience, and that calculates 37,393 psi. I've found their velocity calculations can be off in revlovers, but they say in a 6" barrel, 14.8gr is 1194 fps, and 17 gr 1429 fps. Both those numbers look reasonably close to what I've seen in the real world.

What matters most in handguns as far as pressure is your seating depth. In your case you are using a bullet that is probably shorter OAL than the Keith bullet, and you are seating it way longer than the books. If you look in the manual you are quoting, you will see their Keith bullet data is at 1.553", which is very short. On top of that, those weights are listed with Linotype. A Keith bullet with more common alloys are usually more in the 175 gr range. All that said, I feel safe recommending you use 158 gr data. 16.7 to 17 gr is a safe max load for H110.

As for your flattened primers, you do not have flattened primers at all. If anything those deep firing pin dents indicate low pressure, which is what you actually have. Pressure signs are just that, signs. You can't trust them fully when you are working with a cartridge that is only loaded to 35,000-43,000 psi. Most real pressure signs rifle shooters know wont show up until 70,000 psi or more. Each primer you use will be unique. You will get best results with a magnum primer, either a CCI 550, or Federal 200, or Winchester SP would be good choices. These likely will never truly flatten. If you were using something like a Federal 100, then they will flatten when you creep up on that 40,000 psi area, but I wouldn't use them in this load. You are using H110. It is a slow enough powder you can not use too much to create a dangerous situation in 357 magnum.

You probably won't have to worry about what the absolute maximum load is, focus on accuracy. Ignore those naysayers that say "you don't need this", "you are wasting powder". Just load, shoot, figure out what shoots best on your own. You are probably going to find that accuracy at a slightly higher level than you are shooting now. H110 has one area it shoots good at, and it almost always is a 100% full case (to bullet base), or pretty close to that.

[243winxb]

Brass will stick in tne chamber when you reach "Hot"

I suggest trading up to at least a 44 mag.

[downzero]

H110 is NOT to be downloaded, ever, with any bullet. You're at least 2 grains, if not 3 grains shy of the book load. What reloading manual are you relying on? All of them should tell you that book loads for H110 and W296 are never to be backed off more than 3%.

[megasupermagnum]

Brass will stick in tne chamber when you reach "Hot"

I suggest trading up to at least a 44 mag.

Both points above are horrible advice.

@downzero, you clearly have not read your manuals. You will not find a load of H110 that doesn't have the starting load more than 3% below max. Most start around 15% low. A quick search through Lyman cast boolits #3 and #4, Lyman 50th, and Lee 2nd edition does not contain this supposed 3% warning. Even Hodgdon themselves does not have such a warning.

[357Mag]

johnsonian09 -

Howdy !

I'd say you are pretty close on the load, if the power is enough for your needs.

I have long used 14.5gr WW296 ( H110 same stuff ) and SP Magnum primers under Lyman SWCs of 156 - 172gr.
Shot the load in both 4, 5 and 6" "N" frames; and in a M1894SC .357Mag.

Make sure you use enough crimp, so that bullets don't migrate fwd w/ recoil; and hang-up the gun.


With regards,
357Mag

[shooter bob]

Winchester says not to reduce 296 same powder as h110 it’s in the 1 book 1 caliber .I can’t post pictures but is sure is in there