Useless Calibers

[missionary5155]

I recon due to growing up in a reloader / casters home I have never been afraid of buying an old caliber that I figured was a "sure I can waggle something together" candidate.
Had a Army / Navy Colt in 41 Colt that got shooting by "expanding .358 170 gr SWC's in a vice and loading the "fattened nose first" into 38 Special brass wrapped in masking tape to proper diameter. Propelled by 3F Elephant. Pop can accurate at 20 yards.

[cwtebay]

I recon due to growing up in a reloader / casters home I have never been afraid of buying an old caliber that I figured was a "sure I can waggle something together" candidate.
Had a Army / Navy Colt in 41 Colt that got shooting by "expanding .358 170 gr SWC's in a vice and loading the "fattened nose first" into 38 Special brass wrapped in masking tape to proper diameter. Propelled by 3F Elephant. Pop can accurate at 20 yards.

Love it!!!

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[Daekar]

After reading this thread, something occurred to me. As reloaders, the market looks different than it does to folks who just have to buy factory ammo. That is, while to us there are far fewer useless cartridges, there are far more redundant ones.

For example, let's say that you reload 30-30. To us, with access to any bullet and powder, that cartridge can be made to do a LOT of different things in the right gun. We can download it to a pop-gun with a light little soup can, make traditional loads, put spire-point bullets in if we want, make heavy subsonic loads, or make some strong-action-only loads where we disregard the standard max pressure and load to the safe capacity of the gun instead of the traditional cartridge... Which lets us turn it into a high-velocity varmint cartridge or a heavy slugger that hits far above its weight. Whether or not you are willing to load above max (and no criticism to you if you aren't) that still means the 30-30 can fill a LOT of shoes as long as you've got the guns for it.

If you're not a reloader, the world just doesn't work that way. If you can't buy 30-30 ammo that does the thing you want, you need a whole different cartridge to do the new thing. I think that explains a lot of what we see.

[centershot]

Useless calibers....hmmm....did someone mention .20 caliber? I mean, hey! We already had .17's.....and plenty of .22's.......but .20 caliber? WHY?? What niche does this fill that wasn't already covered? Oy!

[dverna]

After reading this thread, something occurred to me. As reloaders, the market looks different than it does to folks who just have to buy factory ammo. That is, while to us there are far fewer useless cartridges, there are far more redundant ones.

For example, let's say that you reload 30-30. To us, with access to any bullet and powder, that cartridge can be made to do a LOT of different things in the right gun. We can download it to a pop-gun with a light little soup can, make traditional loads, put spire-point bullets in if we want, make heavy subsonic loads, or make some strong-action-only loads where we disregard the standard max pressure and load to the safe capacity of the gun instead of the traditional cartridge... Which lets us turn it into a high-velocity varmint cartridge or a heavy slugger that hits far above its weight. Whether or not you are willing to load above max (and no criticism to you if you aren't) that still means the 30-30 can fill a LOT of shoes as long as you've got the guns for it.

If you're not a reloader, the world just doesn't work that way. If you can't buy 30-30 ammo that does the thing you want, you need a whole different cartridge to do the new thing. I think that explains a lot of what we see.

Might work differently than you suggest. I will use my situation as an example.

My “standard” rifle is a .308. I have wanted a bolt action .30/30 for a number of years and had a chance to get one. My little voice of reason starts in on me. “What will the .30/30 do that you cannot do with the .308?

It happened again when I saw a .300 BO on sale. What will it do that the .308 cannot do?

As a reloader, the .308 made those calibers “useless”. Same with .32 cal offerings like the .32/20 or 32/40. I can do it all with cheap and plentiful military brass.

[farmbif]

The only cartridge that might be "useless" would be an obscure wildcat when you don't have, and no one makes, the reloading dies.

if the dies are not on this list, they will most likely make them for you

https://www.ch4d.com/products/dies/caliber-list

[todd9.3x57]

Useless calibers....hmmm....did someone mention .20 caliber? I mean, hey! We already had .17's.....and plenty of .22's.......but .20 caliber? WHY?? What niche does this fill that wasn't already covered? Oy!

my 20 vartarg is the reason why i sold the 223 and 22-250ai. it is quite accurate, .1 - .2" at 100 yards(5 and 10 shots/bench). while i do sloppy reloads it is 1/2"+/- at 100 yards. the .17's are just too small for my hand!!!!

[cwtebay]

my 20 vartarg is the reason why i sold the 223 and 22-250ai. it is quite accurate, .1 - .2" at 100 yards(5 and 10 shots/bench). while i do sloppy reloads it is 1/2"+/- at 100 yards. the .17's are just too small for my hand!!!!

Do you use it for varmints? I have an employee who received a 20 Vartag from her husband for Christmas. She liked his 204 Ruger too much apparently!
Looks like a fun round.

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[Glwenzl]

There are no useless calibers… just some better than others ��

That said, I am still holding out for Remington to reintroduce their 591/592 5mm magnum

[trails4u]

43 Spanish? 11.15x58R Werndl?? I don't find them useless.....I rather enjoy them!!

[tazman]

How about those Remington electronically/electrically fired rifles?
As far as I know, there is no longer any ammunition being made for those.

[cwtebay]

How about those Remington electronically/electrically fired rifles?
As far as I know, there is no longer any ammunition being made for those.

Now there may actually be one!!
I saw an ad during normal times that listed primers for $225/1000!
But I hear that preparing primers for them is quite simple? I need to revisit that issue for my curiosity. What an oddity in our world, likely derived from the Vulcan cannon or similar ventures.
I understood what Remington was driving towards - but I would like to speak with a competitive shooter that could see the difference. But without flops there can't be successes!

[todd9.3x57]

Do you use it for varmints? I have an employee who received a 20 Vartag from her husband for Christmas. She liked his 204 Ruger too much apparently!
Looks like a fun round.

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groundhogs, foxes and coyotes out to 200 yards or so. i have shot groundhogs at 300-350 yards when the wind ain't blowing. i have shot at paper 500 yards, i don't recommend so. unless you count feet

i was going to go with 204 ruger, but i like wildcats........and you don't have to use so much powder for a 32 & 34gr bullet(17.0 - 18.9gr of rel7, i use 18.7gr) and 3500-3700fps isn't too hard to reach.

i gave up on trying to find a "one hole" rifle. well, i gave up on careful handloading, weigh the case, bullet, trim the outside neck, case length, primer pockets.......and all that. i'll use "sloppy" reloads and be happy with that.

altho, i used to have a savage m340 in 222. it was a used gun when i bought it, but after 5000-6000 shots, i got my money out of her. i should have rebarreled it, but in my youth, i was careless and i sold it and bought a 223. i could not find a load for the 223 that equaled my 222. i was and am a dummkopf.

now that i am much older, i like old cartridges and rifles.

[Lloyd Smale]

Might work differently than you suggest. I will use my situation as an example.

My “standard” rifle is a .308. I have wanted a bolt action .30/30 for a number of years and had a chance to get one. My little voice of reason starts in on me. “What will the .30/30 do that you cannot do with the .308?

It happened again when I saw a .300 BO on sale. What will it do that the .308 cannot do?

As a reloader, the .308 made those calibers “useless”. Same with .32 cal offerings like the .32/20 or 32/40. I can do it all with cheap and plentiful military brass.

i agree. I did buy a 300bo bolt but just because ive got 3 ars in that chambering and tons of cast bullet ammo and i use it mostly to blast up odds and ends and then to shoot subsonic which its shines over a bolt because you can use any bullet and some bullseye or unique and not have to worry about cycling an action. But honestly i never saw the big hupla with bolt action rifles in 3030 or even 44 mag and 357. Id much rather a lever gun. there just so much more fun.

[Loudenboomer]

Useless? How about a synthetic black tactical 30-30 Lever gun with all the Mall Ninja bells and whistles?

[Plate plinker]

Useless calibers....hmmm....did someone mention .20 caliber? I mean, hey! We already had .17's.....and plenty of .22's.......but .20 caliber? WHY?? What niche does this fill that wasn't already covered? Oy!

Thousands of prairie dogs disagree. I like the 204 Ruger, 4300 FPS and cheaper projectiles makes for lots of economical varmint elimination.

[M-Tecs]

I learned my lesson on labeling certain calibers/cartridges as useless when the 17HMR and the 3 1/2 12 gauge came out. At the time I believed them to be useless. Today I have a love affair with both. The 17 HMR accounts for 500 to 1,000 prairie dogs a year for me. The 3 1/2 12ga in a Super Black Eagle accounts for 60 plus late season Canandian geese a season for me. Not bad for "useless cartridges.

I am with the poster above on the 204 Ruger. It is a superb prairie dog, fox and coyote rifle.

[cwtebay]

groundhogs, foxes and coyotes out to 200 yards or so. i have shot groundhogs at 300-350 yards when the wind ain't blowing. i have shot at paper 500 yards, i don't recommend so. unless you count feet

i was going to go with 204 ruger, but i like wildcats........and you don't have to use so much powder for a 32 & 34gr bullet(17.0 - 18.9gr of rel7, i use 18.7gr) and 3500-3700fps isn't too hard to reach.

i gave up on trying to find a "one hole" rifle. well, i gave up on careful handloading, weigh the case, bullet, trim the outside neck, case length, primer pockets.......and all that. i'll use "sloppy" reloads and be happy with that.

altho, i used to have a savage m340 in 222. it was a used gun when i bought it, but after 5000-6000 shots, i got my money out of her. i should have rebarreled it, but in my youth, i was careless and i sold it and bought a 223. i could not find a load for the 223 that equaled my 222. i was and am a dummkopf.

now that i am much older, i like old cartridges and rifles.

I may have to hit you up for some of your favourite loads. Neither of them reload (I know.... wildcat and all), but I have been getting the husband over to put together his 204 for a while now.
Is there factory brass available? They ordered the multi-die kit for conversion from 223, but it sounds like fire forming is almost necessary? Wonder if Hornady makes a hydraulic forming die?

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[44MAG#1]

Could this thread be likened to the statement "one man's trash is another man's treasure" type thing? Or is it we feel what is useless to us is useless to all? Or could it be that because it is useless to you may not mean it is useless to another? Or is useless just useless plain and simple to one and all and if that is the case who sets the standard of what is useless?

[bowfin]

There are no useless calibers… just some better than others ��

That said, I am still holding out for Remington to reintroduce their 591/592 5mm magnum

I second that!

One would think this would be a no-brainer. I bought a 591 from somebody who needed the money back when Aguila had not started making the ammunition yet. Once I got it out into the field, I found out that it was the best squirrel rifle I could imagine. (We often shoot fox squirrels in cut cornfields, so it is closer to prairie dog hunting traditional squirrel hunting.)