A mold is being offered on ebay to make a 30 cal gas checked paper patched bullet that says:
"Now these two technologies have been combined to form a high velocity cast 30 caliber rifle bullet that is capable of 2,500 feet per second velocity with a semi-soft lead alloy and 1.5 minute-of-angle accuracy (¾ of an inch, four shot group at 50 yards)! "
Is anyone familiar with this mold or its maker/seller?
It says LEE right on the mold, as well as having LEE type alignment bars. I've not yet seen anything like it though. There are no bids as of yet, and the price is $60 for starting bid on a used two cavity LEE mold!
Shiloh
http://cgi.ebay.com/30-Cal-308-Gas-C...3A1%7C294%3A50
Last edited by Shiloh; 01-11-2009 at 10:47 AM.
I think if I was going to go through that much trouble and expense then I’d just buy condom coated bullets and be done with it.
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Sam
I read the e-bay sales pitch completely through.
Looks like this guy is a serious reloader/experimenter who put up some funds to have molds made to his specifacations.
Having been in a few GB's on this board I have some idea of the hassle it is to get Lee to do what you want and what they charge to do it! Considering he handled this whole concept out of his own pocket, and has done quite a bit of reaserch on his own time, I don't think the price for the mold is out of line. I do think he should have included a buy now price and, if this is his first go around with this mold, that may be changed on his next listing!
Now, having said all that, I sure would like to have seen a little bit better target ( cause 1.5 MOA @50Yds doesn't impress me) and I think he should be showing targets shot at 100 yds!
I'm thinking that if he had a 50 yd range he had a 100 as I've never seen an indoor 50 yrd range!
Does anybody know this guy or recognize his work?
After checking this out on ebay, I have the opinion that this guy is a hack bubba horse swindler, at least that's what the ameturish pictures indicate.
I thought it was a gas check/ paper patch mold, designed to have both gas check and still is undersized on the boolit to allow for paper patching. That's what combining the two technologies is about. Is there a necessity of gas checking a paper patch boolit?
The guy is NOT a professional at all. The boolits have top punch marks, which is OK for performance reasons, but NOT OK for "quality" show and tell status, when the story written implies such. The guy is a reseller for someone else who is just tired of jacking around with it. ... felix
felix
I agree with Felix, heck the only thing missing on it is a Lube grove or two. I wonder what they thought at Lee when they got the order? I think W. C. Fields said it best a Sucker Born Every Min. I am going to watch this sale and see if W. C. theory comes to play.
Don
That was Phineas T. Barnum, and he was right, as shown by what happens on eBay!
Echo
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Stand correctedd and you are Right. W.C. didn't like working with kids.
If someone were to contact Lee, (who probably still has the cherry). Do you think Lee would sell to the public? The expensive part is done already.
Lee uses CNC no cherry's
I give the guy an "E" for effort.
The whole art or method and point to Paper Patching is to make a quality wrap and cup around the base of the boolit isin't it?
Far as the price- the market will bear that out. This kind of stuff is a lot of work and no one knows what a guy has to go through to get something started.
Like another old saying... "If it was that easy, everyone would be doing it."
Last edited by PatMarlin; 01-11-2009 at 07:11 PM.
Are you PaperPatch guys inline with this?
Looks like the gluestick residue is smeared on the sized boolit.
Last edited by PatMarlin; 01-11-2009 at 07:12 PM.
Obviously never heard of gluelets has he, what a waste.
The guy's a member here BTW. Nothing wrong with his technology (except the glue). He ordered a bunch of custom grooveless gas checked molds through Lee, and is selling the extra ones.
We need somebody/something to keep the government (cops and bureaucrats too) HONEST (by non government oversight).
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Allright, here's my disclaimer, I do not paperpatch, nor ever have, but I do understand the concept and consider myself relatively mechanically inclined. Here is what I don't understand, from what I read and understand about paperpatching the patch goes around the boolit in the opposite direction of the twist, then is terminated with a tail that is folded, twisted, or somehow terminated behind the boolit, correct? Seems to be this situation with the gas check and the paper patch farther forward on the boolit and not terminated behind it COULD cause the boolit to skid through the paper and potentially leave a bore obstruction.
Would someone that knows more than me about paper patching clear this up for me?
I am a paper patcher, that is why I cast.
What is missing, if the diameter of the casting. My .30s are .301, my .303 is .304.
From the looks of the wrapped example, I have a lot of questions.
First, why the gas check?
I take my 30cal casting, size the lube lands to .308, wrap to .314, then size to .309. The tail is twisted up to the base. The .303, I size to .308, wrap to .317-.318, then size .314. Again, the tail is twisted up to the base. I have sized using checks. I do not now.
It does look like a good patching candidate if it were sans the gas check. Sizing to .301 is probably not an issue. Wrapping that short patch is interesting.
I find wrapping patches that do not overlap the base challenging at best. Since I use a cigarette roller, I do not have to be that picky. Perhaps if the casting is sized without a check, then rolled, the paper would take up the check. I know it does for me.
I read the specs. It looks like the individual is not directing it at patchers in general. It looks like an experiment he made on his own. Good for him. Kinda the hard way though.
I would not go for that mold, as I do not know the dimensions. Too little information for patching. Bore and Groove is critical. I also do much better with grouping than he reports.
1" at 100yds easily. My Enfield does that, so does my Ishapore. My 03-A3 does much better.
You know, patching makes for several relaxing evenings. One night cast a bunch. Water drop, then size. Next night wrap your brains out. Cutting, dipping, rolling, putting in a 9mm bullet tray to dry. Next night, wax with JPW, size. Then load when you need them. The wax makes a good waterproofing.
I guess it would work, but, much more compicated than, just wrapping.
I use conventional molds for lubeing. I size them to .308. The .30cals are .301 for the nose. I feel the lube lands helps hold the patch from slipping. When the patch dries, it shrinks down quite a bit. The lands show as flat ridges. When sized, the lands size down to the unsized paper.
Actually works quite well.
Good idea, just extra steps.
..............I could do some nit-picking but won't. I don't think the guy is trying to swindle anyone, nor is there anything basicly "Oh Crap" wrong. I believe he's done what he's said and shown, using the mould and boolits the way he said he did.
He has another mould on E-Bay for paper patching. A Lee 2 cav also, but for the 45 rifle calibers. I think he's seen an oportunity to fill a nitch for folks wanting to try PPing. His initial price may be high but with the 30 cal mould (didnt see it for the 45) was the fact that he was supplying a patch template and a video.
He's doing a great job in answering people's questions and I can detect no intentional BS or showmanship. Seems to be a straightup guy to me.
...............Buckshot
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I bought one of his 45 cal paper patch molds a while back. I got it for less than what he is asking now a days. I have yet to load or test any of the bullets I've cast with it so I can't speak to how well it will perform for me. The mold casts two different weight slugs (405gr & 505gr) that have a flat nose design and is a custom Lee. The bullet is not the typical round nose shape so, it likely won't be a long range buffalo match winner but should be an effective hunting bullet. The seller shipped the mold quickly and provided me some basic guidance. I was very pleased with the transaction. I would just say to not "knock it till you try it". I think he has made an honest effort to share something that he has put some effort and work into. What works for him may not work for everyone but, that my friends is the name of the game when you cast and shoot your own. Every gun/powder/bullet combo is a puzzle of its own.
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