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Thread: Selling Cast Boolits - FFL Needed?

  1. #21
    Boolit Master
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    ^^^^^^^ what dale says

  2. #22
    Boolit Grand Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by dale2242 View Post
    If I had the mold that the OP wanted to buy the bullets to try , I would simply give them a few to try.
    I have had a few generous members on this site give me bullets to try before I bought a mold.
    I would find it hard to believe that giving away a few cast bullets as breaking any laws.
    Exactly.

    And for me, casting and reloading are not hobbies. So anything that involves those activities is done to save money or help others. If someone wanted to buy a sizeable quantity bullets from me, I would charge $20/hr for my time plus cost of materials. I would rather get a part time job than spend 10-15 hours a week casting/lubing bullets. If someone needs 100-200, I am not charging them.

    A bit of common sense comes into play. No one "needs" to try out 1000 bullets. The amount of lead in 200 200 gr bullets is less than 6 lbs....about $10. Not worth charging for IMHO. The few times someone has offered to pay for stuff like that, I told them to put $20 into the collection plate at their church. Maybe I look at this wrong, but helping someone out means just that...not trying to make $10. If it is someone I do not want to help, I ignore the post.
    Don Verna


  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by quilbilly View Post
    Don't forget federal excise tax. For fishing tackle it is 10% off the top for manufacturers and it may be the same for ammunition. The form is IRS Form 720 if you want to check. Nevermind - FET for firearms and ammo is not on that form. It must be a separate form.
    "Pittman-Robertson Act" 11% excise tax

    https://www.fws.gov/laws/lawsdigest/fawild.html
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.”
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  4. #24
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    gwpercle's Avatar
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    There are so many Laws ,Ordinances , Rules , Regulations , Statutes , Acts and Guidelines ...
    By Federal , State , Parish (County) , City and Subdivisions ....
    There is nothing you can legally do any longer !

    Everything is either Illegal , Immoral , Fattening or Contributes to Global Warming .
    Gary
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    Proud Member of The Basket of Deplorables
    " Let's Go Brandon !"

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by gwpercle View Post
    There are so many Laws ,Ordinances , Rules , Regulations , Statutes , Acts and Guidelines ...
    By Federal , State , Parish (County) , City and Subdivisions ....
    There is nothing you can legally do any longer !

    Everything is either Illegal , Immoral , Fattening or Contributes to Global Warming .
    Gary
    https://www.amazon.com/Three-Felonie.../dp/1594035229

    A great read about how invasive Government is in our lives.

    The basic premise is that the average professional commits several felonies a day...all without knowing about it.
    NRA Benefactor.

  6. #26
    Boolit Grand Master fredj338's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim147 View Post
    Last I looked, if you don't do $10,000 a year it's not a business as far as taxes go.
    Uh sure it is. IF you make $10K, the IRS wants its cut.
    EVERY GOOD SHOOTER NEEDS TO BE A HANDLOADER.
    NRA Cert. Inst. Met. Reloading & Basic Pistol

  7. #27
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    405grain's Avatar
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    I'm not even going to jump into this swamp - just going to point out that the laws regarding both firearms and ammunition in California are way more restrictive than they are in the United States of America. In America they have this thing called "constitutional rights". In Kommiefornia that doesn't mean so much. Common things like sharing some ammunition with a friend or enjoying shooting sports are either highly illegal, or will result in you feeling the full effects of Karen Cancel Culture's wrath. Please note that I am being sarcastic, but the sad truth is that things which shooters take for granted in other states can cause difficulties here. The less that the state knows, the better off you are.

  8. #28
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    Larry Gibson's Avatar
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    For crying out loud folks. An FFL is required to sell guns if you are "engaged in the business" of selling guns. Selling your own personal guns every now and then w/o the FFL is still legal under federal law. Same with selling your own bullets that you cast. If you are "engaged in the business" of making and selling bullets then get the FFL. If you sell a few bullets, cast or otherwise, to friends now and then the FFL is not needed because you're not "engaged in the business.

    If the FFL is needed just to sell your own bullets now and then there are a whole lot of law breakers over on the "for sale" forum.....me included. When is the last time anyone on our for sale or trade forum got investigated, arrested or prosecuted for selling bullets w/o an FFL? Some need to take off their conspiracy tin foil hats and just enjoy our sport.
    Larry Gibson

    “Deficient observation is merely a form of ignorance and responsible for the many morbid notions and foolish ideas prevailing.”
    ― Nikola Tesla

  9. #29
    Boolit Buddy
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    Hear hear Larry seams a whole lot of folks take themselves too serious. And are always ready to jump on someone for doing something anything that they deem wrong. Oh well it is the internet after all

  10. #30
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Gibson View Post
    For crying out loud folks. An FFL is required to sell guns if you are "engaged in the business" of selling guns. Selling your own personal guns every now and then w/o the FFL is still legal under federal law. Same with selling your own bullets that you cast. If you are "engaged in the business" of making and selling bullets then get the FFL. If you sell a few bullets, cast or otherwise, to friends now and then the FFL is not needed because you're not "engaged in the business.

    If the FFL is needed just to sell your own bullets now and then there are a whole lot of law breakers over on the "for sale" forum.....me included. When is the last time anyone on our for sale or trade forum got investigated, arrested or prosecuted for selling bullets w/o an FFL? Some need to take off their conspiracy tin foil hats and just enjoy our sport.
    Truth.

  11. #31
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimB.. View Post
    Truth.
    Agree. It really is that simple.

    Who's going to come after me for selling 100 bullets for $10 to someone at the range or on this website? The ATF, FBI, IRS, the local federal prosecutor, All of the above?

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stopsign32v View Post
    You guys are way too scared of the boogeyman.

    Look at it from the other angle guys...Someone, anyone, find a single (just one) case of a law abiding citizen going to jail over selling brass, molded boolits, primers, or powder.
    The one case remotely close that I can think of is the guy who supplied the Las Vegas shooter and doesn't even fit your criteria and he was only found out after the Las Vegas shooting happened. He had a website and visited gun shows for years and apparently was able to make it work without an FFL. To think someone is going to come knocking on your door for selling a few bullets over this website is insane.

  13. #33
    Boolit Buddy
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    "(B) as applied to a manufacturer of ammunition, a person who devotes time, attention, and labor to manufacturing ammunition as a

    ###regular course of trade###

    or business with the ##principal objective of livelihood and profit## through the sale or distribution of the ammunition manufactured;"


    If your casting bullets for a day job you need an ffl AND itar liscencing. The ffl is easy. The Itar is a $2500+ fee if I recall correctly.

    If your casting to help out a forum member. And they want to buy your 100 grain ingots, at the cost of materials and shipping go ahead.

    You can also just label them 'airgun slugs, not for firearms use' with a sticker, and be totally legit. My airrifle and revolver shoot the same boolits. At almost the same speeds sometimes too. Boolit or slug, dont care what barrel it flies from as long as it's the right size.


    Sent from my SM-J337VPP using Tapatalk

  14. #34
    Boolit Master murf205's Avatar
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    If a hammer and chisel is called "burglar tools" by the police department, then I guess a Lee 20 lb pot and a mold would be what? Destructive devices? Gimme a break!
    IT AINT what ya shoot--its how ya shoot it. NONE of us are as smart as ALL of us!

  15. #35
    Boolit Master


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    I believe Trump got rid of the ITAR for non export.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Gibson View Post
    Some need to take off their conspiracy tin foil hats and just enjoy our sport.
    No kidding. Some of the replies in this thread sound like they came out of a lawyers' convention ... the only people who, if they can't find trouble, will manufacture some.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim147 View Post
    Last I looked, if you don't do $10,000 a year it's not a business as far as taxes go.
    There are plenty of business that lose money. Several do so intentionally.
    [The Montana Gianni] Front sight and squeeze

  18. #38
    Boolit Master Castaway's Avatar
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    Not to beat a dead horse on this question but most every responder to this question had logical points on both sides of the issue, but logic doesn’t always rule when it comes to the law. Just talked to “Charley” of the Tampa ATF with the question and he emphatically stated whether you sell one or 10,000 bullets you cast, you’re in the business and therefore required to have an FFL. Now that aside, will you be prosecuted for selling a few? I maintain in all likely hood probably not with the small quantities requested; but, as with anything, there’s the possibility. The post was academic, not whether it makes sense or not. As an aside, the forum where the question was asked was not mentioned.

  19. #39
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by Castaway View Post
    Not to beat a dead horse on this question but most every responder to this question had logical points on both sides of the issue, but logic doesn’t always rule when it comes to the law. Just talked to “Charley” of the Tampa ATF with the question and he emphatically stated whether you sell one or 10,000 bullets you cast, you’re in the business and therefore required to have an FFL. Now that aside, will you be prosecuted for selling a few? I maintain in all likely hood probably not with the small quantities requested; but, as with anything, there’s the possibility. The post was academic, not whether it makes sense or not. As an aside, the forum where the question was asked was not mentioned.
    “Charlie” is full of crap. His response is exactly what you’d expect, his job is to tell you what you can’t do, not what you can do. Besides, you’re asking a LEO a legal question, who thinks that’s a good idea.

  20. #40
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    If I sell 10 pounds of lead, does it matter the shape of the ingots?

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check