best black powder

[Riverside]

Goex----Olde Eynsford or Swiss. Which is best?

[Savvy Jack]

I don't know which one would be first but Goex is last

[indian joe]

I don't know which one would be first but Goex is last

looks like Goex still beat the pants off Wano

[Bad Ass Wallace]

I have a stach of Swiss No.2 and Goex 'P" grades. Tried Elephant, C&H, Goex etc, but these two seem to burn clean and have the highest energy output!

[rancher1913]

my homemade, hands down.

[Savvy Jack]

looks like Goex still beat the pants off Wano

...of the three listed

[Bent Ramrod]

You ought to be able to get a good load with minimum finagling with either Swiss or Olde Eynsford, with grease-groove boolits. Paper-patch loads might be a little more preferential to one or the other, depending.

Swiss used to be a lot denser than OE, but a comparison of pack density (poured through drop tube into case) would indicate that, if anything, OE is now at least as dense as Swiss, if not a little more so. Which is not to say that OE was ever dense; it’s as “fluffy” as other Goex.

Too bad—it used to be almost as easy getting a good load with Swiss in BP cartridges as with smokeless and grease-groove cast boolits in modern cartridges. Compression was totally optional, and all the lots of the red-and-blue labeled Swiss seemed to be interchangeable, at least the ones I got. The pink-labeled stuff is more expensive than OE, but that’s getting close to being the only major difference between them.

[Savvy Jack]

You ought to be able to get a good load with minimum finagling with either Swiss or Olde Eynsford, with grease-groove boolits. Paper-patch loads might be a little more preferential to one or the other, depending.

Swiss used to be a lot denser than OE, but a comparison of pack density (poured through drop tube into case) would indicate that, if anything, OE is now at least as dense as Swiss, if not a little more so. Which is not to say that OE was ever dense; it’s as “fluffy” as other Goex.

Too bad—it used to be almost as easy getting a good load with Swiss in BP cartridges as with smokeless and grease-groove cast boolits in modern cartridges. Compression was totally optional, and all the lots of the red-and-blue labeled Swiss seemed to be interchangeable, at least the ones I got. The pink-labeled stuff is more expensive than OE, but that’s getting close to being the only major difference between them.

Simply measure out 40gr by volume of any black powder, then put it on the scale and see if it weighs 40gr. At the time I was using Swiss, it was the best but I think OE, never tried it, was "hard on their heels" and closing in fast on quality!!!!

Photo from John Kort's collection
12 Dec 2016
Attachment 287520

https://www.shootersforum.com/thread...ourney.102691/

[Carrier]

Really don’t have a choice other than Goex where I’m at. So it’s make do with it.

[Riverside]

I find a difference between the swiss 1 1/2 in the red and blue can and swiss 1 1/2 in the pinkish colored can (marked 1 1/2 no. 4). The same wt. of each powder fills a case to a markedly different level. I buy my powder at The Maine Powder House and shipping for 25 cans or more is free. I get together with friends to order.

[curdog007]

I don't know if OE 1 1/2F is better or worse than anything else. Everybody's got their own criteria.
What I do know is, if I use the same weight of it as C&H No.6 in BPE cartridges, it behaves the same.

[FLINTNFIRE]

The best black powder is the one you have or can get , if availability is no problem it is what you can afford for the amount of shooting you do

[Savvy Jack]

The best black powder is the one you have or can get ,

I guess this is what folks did back in 1875 when out in the middle of the desert!!!!!

I have never been able to purchase quality BP locally. For CAS, I was able to group buy Skirmish....by far the worse BP ever...floor sweepings in my book.

[FLINTNFIRE]

It is what anyone in a desert or not no matter what year it is , like it or not , use what you can get or make your own .

Never had to buy skirmish , or use sweepings , but local is hard to find for most of us , so it is mail order or make it .

[ulk77more]

I know the preference is the three listed, but quality BP breaks down to quality materials. NO mass manufacturer of of commercial BP will use the quality of materials as a private person will. I have tried all three types and prefer a willow or poplar based BP.
the commercial grades of BP in my opinion rate close to BP alternative powders but understand, that is my opinion.

[country gent]

Since I have and douse all three mentioned with good results here is what I have found. I use 1f, 1 1/2f, and 2f in different rifles / calibers coming up with a 25.lb order isnt hard.

Swiss:
Requires little compression, usually around .060 is plenty after the drop tube. Fouling is "light" when the load is right. meters and flows well. A simple load work up will normally give a good load

Olde Ensdorde:

Almost or as good as swiss, in one of my rifles its better than. Compression is a little more around .080 - .090 after the drop tube. Meters and flows good. Fouling is a little more when the load is right but manageable with lubes and blow tube. A normal load work up will generally result in a good load

Goex:

My last choice for powder but it can do well. Requires he most compression to get consistent loads usually .125 + after the drop tube. Dosnt meter and flow as well as the other 2. Fouling is the heaviest of the 3 and may be harder to control. I think its a harder fouling, lubes can make a difference here. It sometimes takes extra steps to get to the good load. I use very little of it as I can order the others. For those on a budget it is also the cheapest.

I use a chronograph during load work up and watch not only the velocity but Extreme Spread and standard deviation. AS ES and SD go down so does the fouling. I work up from no compression / no airspace in 2 grn increments then retest .5 grns above and below. With Olde Ensforde and Swiss I normally get into single digit ES. Goex isnt quite as good normally being in the high teens pr so. ( 17-19 but 20s can be there also).

I throw charge on a Lyman bp 55 measure or a Belding and Mull then weight on a scales. Primers are normally Rem LR standards ( this is going to change probably with REM out of business). Cases are Starline.

[Lead pot]

This question which is best will always be around. Swiss was good and maybe it is again after the last couple lots, I don't know I'm working on the second case since they changed the label.

Except the last two years I shot up 4 to 5 + cases a year between Swiss and OE and I personally don't see any difference between the Swiss and OE. These last two years I'm down to less that two cases a year. I load the OE as I do Swiss, treat them the same, and I get the same results using both brands. I have switched during gong matches from Swiss to OE using the same caliber and /primers/bullets and test range results here at home finding the best results and switched to OE between relays using Swiss that gave me 50% hits to OE that ended up 100% hits, and I also had the same results switching the other way also.
Is it the powder or is it the shooter????? one cant go wrong with either powder.

[Don McDowell]

Your rifle will tell you which is best. All 3 mentioned can turn in excellent accuracy. My preference is Olde Eynsford, due to what my rifles and the targets tell me.

[bedbugbilly]

Which is better? Coke or Pepsi? Well . . . gooooooooolly . . . neither . . . . I prefer q good ole Red Pop! LOL

I'm guessing that some are truly better tha others , , , but I think FLINTNFIRE said it pretty well and it was pretty much what I would answer - what you have sitting on the shelf.

I started shooting BP in muzzleloaders almost 60 years ago now. In those days, the only BP available in our area was from a 80 plus year old small one man gunshot. When I started shooting - he had DuPont on the shelf - then later Goex. A pound of Goex in !F up thru $F was 75 cents a pound. If I didn't have the money and still wanted to plink and hunt, I cut down old BP shotgun shells that I accumulated from friends of my Dad who would give them to me if they ran across them. It all worked and I honestly never gave a thought if there was something "better".

I could get Goex so I just kept on using it - rifle, shotgun & cap & ball revolver. Over the years - I sometimes bought old powder horns and flasks - sometimes they had BP in them and it got emptied into a jar and eventually got used as well. When I was still shooting N-SSA, when we were down at Winchester for the Nationals some of us were given a pound of Elephant as a sample to try. For some reason, I could never bring myself to shoot a BP named after a Packaderm. LOL I still have it.

Now don't get me wrong = I fully understand those folks who try to find the "best' - especially with the types of rifles they load for and the type of shooting they do - I have a lot of respect for them. I also have a lot of respect for those that make their own - kind of intriguing when you think of it.

Lead was kind of the same way - especially when we were kids. I scrounged it where ever I could find it and old shotgun shells furnished a lot of good shot to use in the shotgun - and old newspapers furnished all the shotgun wadding we needed.

Not being able to find any BP a year or so ago when things were drying up, Grafs had some of their name brand BP left so I ordered a quantity - haven't used any of it yet but my understanding is that it is Goex packaged under Grafs name. When our local supply dried up, my brother and I would stock up each spring and fall when we went to Friendship for the Nationals - yep! Goex.

When I started shooting and loading BP cartridge - well, with the shortages and bare shelves - whatever is sitting on the works just fine for the shooting I do - if it's BP - it's all good!

I don't hunt anymore now, but there is one thing that sticks in my mind from when I was a kid. I fell in love with BP and muzzleloaders at a young age and I never remember a squirrel, rabbit, pheasant or any other critter ever knowing what brand of BP was loaded in my gun - it all worked just fine. A lot of good memories!

[brassrat]

I can't say much but my one lb can of Gearhart -Owens is my favorite and only. Only have a Pietta .36 but the last six shots were loaded for a yr. with a hand rod and covered with wads that I also stumbled on and shot around a quarter at 50' on bench. I'm set for life, blackpowderwise,