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Thread: Trap Loads

  1. #1
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    Trap Loads

    So, got into trap last year and havebeen enjoying it. I'm a hoarder and had been accumulating quite a bit of shotgun stuff (rather eclectic bunch of stuff) and since the cheap shells at Wal Mart are nowhere to be found, I decided to finally get off my butt and do it.

    Loader is a Lee Load All (I'll evetually get a better one, have a MEC for 16 gauge) and I found a combination using the Federal hulls I had a bunch of from saving them after a trap session, Winchester 209, 19 grains of 700X, Claybuster equivalent of the WAA12SL wad and 1 1/8 ounce of 7 1/2, Loaded 50 Saturday and started off good, then had several fizzle out, a couple left wads in the gun which I was being alert for and punched them out, but it was a frustrating start. I was worried that quantity of 700X had gone bad as it's quite old.

    So, back to the drawing board. Reloaded the hulls, same load, only this time I was very careful to keep the powder hopper full, tap the charge bar several times before charging and look in every hull before seating a wad. Back to the range yesterday afternoon and they all worked perfectly. Had that range to myself, didn't even ask for a scorer (they hire high school kids to do it and since I was mainly interested in whether my handloads would work, liked being solo). I think I hit 19 one round and 18 on the other which is a decent day for me, sometimes I do better but can't count on it.

    I know a lot of you guys are old hands and this doesn't sound like much but it was pretty much my first time seriously loading any shotgun shells. Those Federal hulls crimp real nice, I reloaded them after I got back along with 50 more, still holding nice crimps after three firings. They have a big bin there that the kids put all the empties they police up in, free to anybody who wants them so I took a few minutes to get a bag of those same hulls, I should be set for a while.

    I'm pretty pleased with that Load-All too. As cheaply made as it is, it seems to turn out good ammo, though as I learned, one has to be careful with it. All in all, a cool experience, I've been a metallic cartridge handloader and bullet caster forever, it's been a while since I delved into something handloading related that was completely new to me.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
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    Keep a eye on the hulls with a paper base in the hull - due to dampness .

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    I prefer the Remington greens and the handicaps and load on my Mec. The gun club shells work well also. I much preferred to adjust our loads and powder based upon how my son and I shot. I finally settled on the Hodgen International Clay's and Winchester primers. It can be a lil harder felt recoil but it fit our style. Allowed us to play or compete. We would try and hit the bird as close to the ground as possible or as fast as possible out of the trap house. Really worked well for handicaps. Good luck.
    Ron

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrWolf View Post
    I prefer the Remington greens and the handicaps and load on my Mec. The gun club shells work well also. I much preferred to adjust our loads and powder based upon how my son and I shot. I finally settled on the Hodgen International Clay's and Winchester primers. It can be a lil harder felt recoil but it fit our style. Allowed us to play or compete. We would try and hit the bird as close to the ground as possible or as fast as possible out of the trap house. Really worked well for handicaps. Good luck.
    Ron
    These were more, "let me put together something from what I have around" kind of thing. I got probably 3/4th of an eight pound keg of 700X from Dad I've been whittling away at for a few years, great stuff in a lot of things I shoot, but it's gonna go a lot faster now.

    I would like to get the payload down to an ounce rather than the 1 1/8th ounce. I have a few shotgun manuals, I just need to read through them and figure it out.

  5. #5
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    I have 5 complete Hornady 366’s as well as a “parts” press, a decent size box of parts to keep them running, some really nice replacement shot/powder reservoirs from a gentleman named Jim Skeel , a drum of Winchester AA hulls, a few bags of WAA12SL wads, a couple cases of primers and 4 or 5 bags of shot. I always figured “one day” I would get around to it.
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  6. #6
    Boolit Master Half Dog's Avatar
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    I took kiddo to trap shoot for his birthday once, he’s been hooked ever since. I have been able to hit a few but he does much better than I do. I recently took him to shoot sporting clays and he did even better. This is his thing now. I do the reloading so I constantly look for components, which is a challenge lately. I load 3/4 oz of #8 shot. After a while of shooting the 3/4 oz loads I give him a heavier load and he says he can’t hardly tell a difference. So now I squeeze a few more shots out of a bag of shot. Similar to metallic reloading, I enjoy the shotshell reloading too.
    The sooner I fall behind...the more time I have to catch up with

  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    One of my happiest memories from my youth is the fellow that had a little gun shop in my very rural area that would let some of us kids load shells on a load all he had bolted to the counter . He even supplied the components you just needed to bring your own hulls .

  8. #8
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    700x is an excellent powder for your purpose but will sometimes "bridge" in a drop tube. I have used fine sandpaper to smooth the inside of the powder bushing. Also make sure you weigh the charge. I have found that the Loadall bushings drop less than stated and I have to move up one or two bushing sizes to get the correct charge, especially with the flaked powders. Trust your scale, not the chart. One other thing,the Win wads may not seal completly in the staight wall Fed hulls.
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  9. #9
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    there's lots of load data available these days and what hog tamer says rings true, federal cheddite fiocchi and rio hulls are straight walled and should get loaded with wads for straight walled hulls. winchester and Remington for the most part are tapered walled and correct wads for these should be used for best results.
    as far as powder bridging in press there is something that can be said for using a 600jr or size master and slamming the charge bar back and forth when using powder that doesn't flow so well. compared to running a 9000 and being careful to make sure everything is going right all the time. ive never had problems with red dot green dot or blue dot or herco

  10. #10
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    Get yourself some Promo. It is all I used for singles and doubles when shooting competitively. It is inexpensive and does a good job on most pistol light to mid range pistol loads. It is the powder used for "The Load" for CF cast rifle rounds (Promo uses the same data as Red Dot, but varies in density so you need to verify powder drops with bushings on shotshell reloaders).

    Have fun. BTW, you will get a lot of advice on loads. I used 1 oz loads for practice and first shot of doubles as they use less shot so it saves a few $$ and the reduced recoil on the first shot of doubles helps get to the second bird a tad quicker. None of the good (and I mean really good) shooters used 1 oz loads for singles when it mattered. #8 shot is great for singles and short Handicap. Lots of folks talk about 7/8 loads "hitting just as hard"....ignore them. Physics does not support their opinions and the reality is more shot will yield more hits and harder breaks. But for "fun" shooting a 1 oz load is fine.

    Best time you can spend is to pattern your gun/load. It can be an eye opener.
    Don Verna


  11. #11
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    Now that you are hooked on Reloading Shotshells, you need to get a little better machine to load them. Load All's are fine for getting you hooked, but you are going to need a little more production if you are going to shoot much.

    You should be able to load 100 rounds per hour on a Single Stage Press like a Hornady/Pacific DL266 or MEC 600. You should be able to load 400+ rounds per hour on a Progressive Loader like a Hornady/Pacific DL366 or anyone of the more involved Progressives.

    You should get 350-400 rounds per 25 lb bag of shot. Depending if you load 1 1/8 or 1 oz loads.

    My Standard Trap Load is 18 gr of Green Dot 1 1/8 oz of shot in new style AA hulls. Primers are whatever I can get at the time but I prefer Winchester 209's.

    You didn't say what kind of gun you are shooting? Rest assured you're going to need a better one,,, just to keep up with the Jones's.

    Great fun huh?

    Randy
    "It's not how well you do what you know how to do,,,It's how well you do what you DON'T know how to do!"
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    I first started doing this because I wanted to be a more proficient shotgunner, not necessarily a trap shooter. So, I started with the gun I figured I'd hunt mostly with, a 16 gauge side by side. Got some odd looks from guys who were there to actually shoot trap, but I shot that little gun a bunch and got pretty good with it. I did try a few others I have around, but mostly the Stevens double.

    At some point I thought this is fun enough I may want to pursue trap for its own sake and looked and asked around. Being a vintage gun kind of guy, I found a good deal on a Model 12 which had been professionally reworked into a trap gun by an outfit in the Kansas City area, can't remember the name of it, but got an almost embarassingly good deal on it. Seems like everybody wanted the tacticool stuff and fine old guns were available.

    So I have a good gun, better than my wing shooting likely deserves. I'll upgrade to a better loader someday, but I was rather pleasantly surprised by that Load-All.

  13. #13
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    I started with the fed paper hull in 1964, Red Dot and a new fed plastic wad. By 1969 We had switched to Win AA hulls, white Win AA12 wad and 700X. A 3 Dram(20.0grs?) load with 1 1/8 oz of 7 1/2 shot. Used an a pair of Lyman "Easy" shotshell loaders to start, moved to a MEC 650 by 1970. That Lyman Easy is now the Lee load-all made of very cheap materials.
    Unfortunately the newer Win AA hull is now crap. The REM greenie's or golds are the best choice now. Clays powder and a Win AA12 white or Equivalent Claybuster wad. Win 209 work great with Clays. My Hornady Press that I got 20yrs ago came set up for Rem Green hulls.
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    Quote Originally Posted by farmbif View Post
    there's lots of load data available these days and what hog tamer says rings true, federal cheddite fiocchi and rio hulls are straight walled and should get loaded with wads for straight walled hulls. winchester and Remington for the most part are tapered walled and correct wads for these should be used for best results.
    as far as powder bridging in press there is something that can be said for using a 600jr or size master and slamming the charge bar back and forth when using powder that doesn't flow so well. compared to running a 9000 and being careful to make sure everything is going right all the time. ive never had problems with red dot green dot or blue dot or herco
    What's a good wad for the straight walled hulls? Still pretty new and ignorant to this, just followed a book load that used stuff I had. I'll need some more 12 gauge wads soon, might as well buy ones for these Federals since I have a bunch.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master

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    Claybuster 12 S3 clone for 1 1/8 loads or 12SO for 1oz. Excellent wads and 1/2 price of Win,Rem etc. 500 in a bag and available at most online stores.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hogtamer View Post
    Claybuster 12 S3 clone for 1 1/8 loads or 12SO for 1oz. Excellent wads and 1/2 price of Win,Rem etc. 500 in a bag and available at most online stores.
    Thanks very much! I'll order some of those 12 SO clones, maybe some of the 12 S3 as well.

  17. #17
    Boolit Master 15meter's Avatar
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    I suspect the wad stuck in the gun is the fault of the wad. Those are NOT the wad for Federal hulls. Federal are straight wall, those are for tapered. You will get powder migrating past the wad, not a good thing.

    Also check your wad pressure, I would guess you are not seating the wad down onto the powder leaving space that causes erratic ignition.

    I'm surprised that you are getting a good crimp, again going back to the wrong wad. The whole column needs to be one solid mass, powder, wad and shot that builds up to the correct length.

    When that column height is correct you get solid crimps and shells that go BOOM! with enthusiasm.

    And 700x is good powder for shotgun, it's also a great powder for a lot of cast boolit loads, I use it in both 12 trap and skeet loads and 30-06 loads.

    Claybuster wads have been around for a lot of years, used to buy them by the case when I was shooting shotgun all the time. Still have a the equivalent of a case or so in 410, 28, 20, 16 and 12. The only gauge I have "other" wads in is 16, biggest reason is I came across a batch at a garage sale cheap.
    Last edited by 15meter; 07-12-2021 at 11:21 PM.

  18. #18
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    The wads getting stuck was me not being vigilant about keeping the hopper full enough and developing a process to make sure the hulls were getting chargedfully. After I figured that out, they all worked perfectly. The load in my Lyman manual called for this wad and Federal hulls, so couldn't be that bad, but I'll switch to some Winchester AAs to use up that bag of wads.

    Agreed on 700X. I got a lot of it from my Dad a few years ago, probably six pounds and then another unopened canister of about that same size. Been using it in all kinds of things from .38 Special up to light bullet 100 yard loads in .45-70 and it is good stuff, almost as versatile as Unique, and my Lyman 3rd Edition Cast Handbook seems to have data for it in just about everything. I love the stuff.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master beezapilot's Avatar
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    Oh, my. Shotgun sports and reloading. You are gonna like this aspect of the hobby, methinks.
    I'm an outlier on loading for and shooting trap, not everyone agrees and I'm OK with that. This is probably more than you asked.
    I use Remington and Winchester 8 point crimps hulls as a rule, just so I've only to buy one style of wads. Claybusters is my preference in branding. There are wads for tapered hulls and wads for straight hulls, they are not interchangable. Personally, living in humid Fla, I don't trust paperbased hulls at all. Follow the manual accurately.
    Just as you take your rifle loads to the range to see how they shoot, consider taking your shotgun to the pattern board and see how your shot-shells do.

    Pattern size and pattern density. How big a spread and how many pellets in there. You'd not shoot a squirrel with a .300 WinMag, so at the 16 yard line you may to have to beat yourself up with 1-1/8th oz loads if your pattern size does not require that much lead / that many pellets to be effective at the range you shoot.

    16 Yards- I shoot 3/4 OZ loads with Promo/Red-Dot
    21 Yard handicap- 1 OZ loads.
    First shot at doubles 7/8ths OZ second shot is the only time shooting trap that I use 1-1/8 OZ.

    Sounds like a lot to have 4 loads for a 12 gauge, but those 4 see me through being in the field, skeet, sporting clays, and 5 stand as well. I've enough hulls kicking around that all the loads are different colors so should they get mixed, I still know exactly what they are.

    A plug too for MEC loaders should you upgrade, there is a 9000 at the club that may be had at a good deal- should you be interested I'll inquire.

  20. #20
    Boolit Master

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    ^^^^ Plus he sells me good hulls!!!
    These work well too...
    https://www.precisionreloading.com/c...!l=TUW&i=G2212
    For the record I seldom shoot clays. My loads are primarily for doves and we shoot a bunch of them. But I know that 17 -18 gr 700x is dynamite for doves out of IC choke and about 9,000 psi. And yes, as beez suggested, pattern your gun and get a good mental picture of your load.
    Last edited by Hogtamer; 07-13-2021 at 10:59 AM.
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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check