Advice wanted for a 458 wm build...

[mbarasing]

A rifle in 458 Win Mag loaded like you are talking about is basically nothing in recoil or blast. If that level of recoil is beginning to intimidate you you need to go to a smaller caliber
A Marlin 45/70 at the level you are talking about is child's play. In the Marlin 45/70's I had I typically shot 550 grain bullets at 1500 fps.

The recoil isn't intimidating... the reloading is, never done it before but willing to learn.

[mbarasing]

GR.: 485 gr
Bullet Type: LFP (Meister)
Primer: CCI 250 Mag
Powder: Trail Boss (Hodgdon)
Case: WIN
Trim Length: 2.490"
C.O.L.: 2.925"
Powder: 13.0 gr
Powder: 19.0 gr
Velocity: 860
Velocity: 962
Pressure: 15,500
Pressure: 22,700
Diameter: 0.458"

Another from shooter's reference...putting here so I can find easily

[44MAG#1]

I you have any amount of intellegence you can reload. It is not intimidating. You will have all kinds on forums that like to get technical and use terms and rhetoric but it is as much to make themselves look loaded with knowledge to be impressive. You learn as you go. Get with someone local that will help you. You will be better off. Someone than can come over to watch you, give pointers, a hands on approach.
Many like to make a mystery out of reloading to help further their persona. I've been loading for around 51 years. Heard it all, seen people at the range talk a big game and me knowing them and their ability which wasn't much and people would be gathered around them to listen to them.

[mbarasing]

How about using filler with a suppressor...cause for concern?

[44MAG#1]

I don't know. I've used it with the brake on my 458 Mag Encore and it is good to go on that. But I was using 2400 with a 515 grain at around 1100 in 14 inches. I would try it if I every wanted to use a powder that would benefit with a filler and carefully keep an eye on it. That is the learning part. If it is a no no then don't. If it is good use it. Can you take the suppressor off when you want to?

[mbarasing]

I don't know. I've used it with the brake on my 458 Mag Encore and it is good to go on that. But I was using 2400 with a 515 grain at around 1100 in 14 inches. I would try it if I every wanted to use a powder that would benefit with a filler and carefully keep an eye on it. That is the learning part. If it is a no no then don't. If it is good use it. Can you take the suppressor off when you want to?

No, it's machined right onto the barrel. I guess if the filler causes problems then I start cutting down brass and deal with the free bore jump

[Gone_rabid]

Not trying to talk you out of anything but why a 458 win mag?

And if you fell intimidated by reloading you may go with 44 mag?

That’s a pretty large span. The 45-70 can be loaded all over the place from hot to not.

Here’s a single shot 45-70 that was cut to 16” that I have.

[mbarasing]

Not trying to talk you out of anything but why a 458 win mag?

And if you fell intimidated by reloading you may go with 44 mag?

That’s a pretty large span. The 45-70 can be loaded all over the place from hot to not.

Here’s a single shot 45-70 that was cut to 16” that I have.

45-70 would be great. But I can't get a supressed barrel on a lever and I'd like more than one shot when the piggies are running.

I'm hunting for a bolt action that can be integrally supressed. Ruger makes a 77/44 that would work...but as you hint at, would definitely not be ideal.

I would like to load the 458 win mag down to 45-70 level. I figured that brass could be cut from any win mag and selection of boolits is great.

[Gone_rabid]

I assume you dead set on the integrally suppressed barrel vs a screw on?

I’m trying to see what your thoughts are on all your options so I see your point of view on why you want what you want.

[kenton]

Ruger makes a short barreled bolt in 450 bushmaster, it would use .452 bullets instead of .458, but if .429 bullets would work that should not be an issue.

https://www.ruger.com/products/ameri...ets/16950.html

A M77 based option
https://www.ruger.com/products/scout...eets/6837.html

[44MAG#1]

Downloading a 458 Win Mag is easy. If he wants a 458 WM he wants a 458 WM. If he really, really wants one he won't be satisfied unless he gets one. Plus the 458 WM is fun. As he learns to reload he will become more understanding. Now 8f a filler can't be used because of the fixed suppressor I would be investigating one that could be removed so I could use a filler.

[mbarasing]

I assume you dead set on the integrally suppressed barrel vs a screw on?

I’m trying to see what your thoughts are on all your options so I see your point of view on why you want what you want.

Set on integrally supressed. I've used twist on for predator competitions and they always feel front heavy... but more importantly, this will be a truck gun. Wielding a long gun inside a truck is unwieldy.

[mbarasing]

Why use a huge cartridge case for subsonic shooting? The 45 Colt or 45 ACP will do that just fine, and is way, way easier to load. Subsonic loads are published in abundance, you can use carbide dies (no case sizing lubricant), cast bullets are readily available, powder charges are small, fillers are not needed, and the list goes on.

Yup... that's why 44 mag would be my choice if I decide not to start reloading.

One thing I should note... I'd like to try out subsonic just to see what it's like with heavy lead. I have been unimpressed with 300 blk subs so I am not sold on the concept yet. 45-70 type loads will be the main use. But the thought of cranking it up to factory 458 win mag all the way down to heavy subsonic intrigues me.

[mbarasing]

It seems the 458 win mag is designed with a long throat and a lot of free bore. Maybe cut brass and free bore jump wouldn't be a big issue. In the interest of using standard 458 win mag brass; could the boolit be recessed into the case on light loads thereby preventing the need for filler? Cycling rounds may be an issue if the edge of the brass hangs but...what other problems occur?

[Gone_rabid]

Set on integrally supressed. I've used twist on for predator competitions and they always feel front heavy... but more importantly, this will be a truck gun. Wielding a long gun inside a truck is unwieldy.

I didn’t even give the truck gun a thought even though I read it. Haha

Please make sure you follow up once you get it.

[mbarasing]

Ruger makes a short barreled bolt in 450 bushmaster, it would use .452 bullets instead of .458, but if .429 bullets would work that should not be an issue.

https://www.ruger.com/products/ameri...ets/16950.html

A M77 based option
https://www.ruger.com/products/scout...eets/6837.html

A neighbor of mine has a bushmaster on an AR platform. To be honest I never gave this round a second thought coming from the autos. I'll look into this more, thanks for the suggestion. I imagine the ammo options are more limited but it's worth investigating.

[RustyReel]

I have the 458WM, 458 American (458x2) and the 450 Marlin all on Mauser actioned rifles.

The 450 Marlin was the result of Shaw listing some sale barrels in that caliber and I have enough brass to last me the rest of the time I'm here. If I got desperate I could set the barrel back a few threads and rechamber to the American or WM version.

The American was simply a caliber I had always wanted for some unknown reason. I have shot a few of these in my WM rifle and they worked fine but I would imagine a steady diet of them would have some ill effects on the WM chamber. The American's big advantage over the other two calibers is that it can be made from just about any ole piece of magnum brass you find at the range.

The WM can also be downloaded to 45/70 ballistics without issue. Lots of data on line and you might want to pick up the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook. Someone put a brake on the WM before I bought it and it does seem to make a significant difference.

[mbarasing]

Here is my 30-30 truck gun that I want to replace with a suppressed gun of equal or better versatility.

[mbarasing]

The WM can also be downloaded to 45/70 ballistics without issue. Lots of data on line and you might want to pick up the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook. Someone put a brake on the WM before I bought it and it does seem to make a significant difference.

Do you use a filler when downloading the WM? is the only purpose of the American to avoid the need for a filler when downloading the WM? What would happen if you simply recessed a boolit into the WM case by 1/2" OAL? Essentially, it would be an American load in a WM case...what's the downside?

I'll look into the book, thanks. I have "40 years with the 45/70" on the way thanks to Tatume's suggeston.

[dverna]

The integrally suppressed concept is very interesting. So is your application.

There are a couple of issues that need to be addressed. Will the rifle going to be used only for sub sonic loads? Will you ever want to shoot more powerful loads? BTW many .458 commercial bullets are not going to work well at sub-sonic velocities. Bear in mind most here shoot cast bullets that can be made to work. IMO, if you intend to use commercial bullets, staying with a pistol caliber gives you a better choice of bullets that work well at lower velocity.

Also, you are investing a lot of $$$$ without a lot of experience.

Do let reloading deter your choices. There are plenty of good YouTube videos that will ease your concerns. It is not a complicated process.

Anyway, based on what you have shared, I think the .458 is a poor choice unless this will be a dual purpose rifle. I would go with the Ruger 77/44. The .458 WM will be a heavier rifle and have a longer action...both things that negatively impact your goals of a light, quick truck gun. There are plenty of good commercial .44 bullets that will work well.

I cannot see any "need" for a full house .458 WM rifle for Texas hunting unless you just want to use it for ****s and giggles, or you plan a trip to larger game.