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Thread: $540 for seven years for a pickup...

  1. #1
    Boolit Master




    Idaho45guy's Avatar
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    $540 for seven years for a pickup...

    Was going over the remaining financial obligation for my 2019 Toyota 4Runner. I love it, and it will be a great vehicle for at least another ten years if I keep it. But, I would like a 1/2-ton pickup to tow a 22' RV camper, or a half cord of firewood, or whatever you need a 1/2-ton pickup for. So, naturally I looked at Toyota Tundras. The cheapest I could find within 100 miles was $48,000. For a pretty basic 1/2-ton pickup. The "fancy" ones were $52,000 and up.

    So, since i have $6,000 worth of equity in my current vehicle, I would need to finance $42,000 in order to buy a new pickup. To keep the payments to where I could afford them, I would have to get an 84 month loan at 2.5% interest, even with my excellent credit score.

    That's seven years of payments at $536 a month to buy a modest 1/2-ton pickup truck! That is insane! My house payment on a 3-bedroom home in a nice neighborhood is $575 a month.

    I called my dad to discuss the dilemma, and he pointed out that in a couple of years, when my 4Runner is paid off, that interest rates may be up around 8-10% on new vehicles. And prices for new pickups may be nearly twice what they are today due to inflation.

    He lived through the 70's and Jimmy Carter and idiotic economic policies. He thinks Joe Biden is leading us directly into historically high interest rates and crippling inflation.

    He advised me to keep my 4Runner and pay it off and put extra money aside. He said he thinks economic end times are about to hit and a $400 car payment and a $575 house payment are extremely valuable and to not jeopardize either. He thinks the days of Americans moving slowly up the ladder of economic prosperity are over. That the dream of having a nicer vehicle and bigger home with just a bit more hard work and a promotion is gone. We are about to enter a winter of inflation and devaluation of the dollar.

    Seems like now is the time to lock in a $48,000 pickup at 2% finance rate if in a couple of years, the same pickup will cost me $60,000 at 5% interest, right?

    Whatever happens, I just can't believe that a pickup costs a year's wages or more these days.

    My grandpa made $32,000 a year in 1979 as a union carpenter. He bought a brand new 1979 F150 XLT pickup regular cab 2wd for $5,500.

    That brand new pickup cost him 1/5 of his year's wages. Today, a new F150 like my Grandpa's would cost $35,000.

    In 2021, union carpenter wages are about twice what my grandpa made, or $28 an hour. That equals about $56,000 a year.

    So today, a new F150 costs more than half of a year's wages in today's wages. Used to cost a fifth of a year's wages.

    This is why the middle class is disappearing and why people are struggling. Nobody wants to talk about it or acknowledge it. But the facts are the facts.
    "Luck don't live out here. Wolves don't kill the unlucky deer; they kill the weak ones..." Jeremy Renner in Wind River

  2. #2
    Boolit Master


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    I'm not going to dispute that the country is in a real bad place as far as debt and inflation, but why would you want to buy a brand new truck? Someone must be, but it sure ain't me. I've bought every vehicle I ever had with cash.

  3. #3
    Boolit Master

    Winger Ed.'s Avatar
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    If you don't want a fancy, loaded , city truck-- talk to the fleet sales person.
    They're usually out back of the dealership's front showroom in a shack.

    They are where ya buy ambulances, school busses, wreckers, and stripped down bare bones fleet trucks.

    I got a fleet F250-- wind up windows, rubber mat, steel rims, bench seat, etc. for less than half the loaded out city trucks cost.
    It has painted bumpers instead of Chrome, black plastic grill,
    and the old school (cheap) headlight bulbs instead of the expensive lens thing.
    Political Correctness and the cancel culture is only allowed to exist because of the coward culture.


    In school: We learn lessons, and are given tests.
    In life: We are given tests, and learn lessons.

  4. #4
    Boolit Master




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    Quote Originally Posted by megasupermagnum View Post
    I'm not going to dispute that the country is in a real bad place as far as debt and inflation, but why would you want to buy a brand new truck? Someone must be, but it sure ain't me. I've bought every vehicle I ever had with cash.
    That's a great question.

    As responsible consumers and folks of modest means, why would we pay such outrageous prices for new vehicles?

    The reason is entirely open to debate. I see folks posting how they are keeping old and worn out vehicles for years and are completely happy. Others, who don't possess mechanical ability or have the resources to repair vehicles, may feel they are better served with a vehicle that needs little or no mechanical attention.

    Other may feel that a a mechanical breakdown would endanger their lives. I'm one of those folks.

    I live in an area on the edge of true wilderness. I love to explore the outdoors and often find myself 20+ miles from the nearest town or dwelling. Getting stranded in a broken vehicle when nighttime temps dip into the single digits can be deadly. When I was younger, I walked out of the woods many times due to getting stuck or broken down with an older vehicle. Now, in my 50's, I can't hike out 15 miles in the dark at zero degrees. So, I drive vehicles that are reliable and capable.

    Most folks can get by driving a pile of junk that barely makes it a mile or so to the store and back. Many of us can't. I have a 2007 Chevy HHR with 210k miles on it. It might blow up tomorrow on my way to work. No big deal. I could coast to the side of the road and hitch a ride to work.

    But no way would I take it into the mountains to go hunting or exploring, knowing that if it failed, I would face a multi-mile hike out to safety.

    But baring the factor of needing a reliable vehicle to actually live and survive, there is the economic equation.

    What is the price of a used pickup? What is the reliability of a used pickup? What are the current repair costs of used pickups?

    I suspect most people over the age of 40 have no idea of the crazy repair and parts prices of vehicles these days.

    My brother-in-law has a 2012 Ford Taurus with 170k miles on it. His water pump went out the other day. He had it towed to the dealer. Cost of repair? Over $2000. Value of his vehicle? $3500. He ended up trading in the vehicle on a newer used Toyota SUV.

    Years ago, I had a 1966 F100 that I paid $100 for. I drove it all over the country. The water pump went out in the middle of nowhere on my way from Idaho to Seattle. My dad had to drive 100 miles to bring me a new water pump. Cost of the water pump? $20. Cost of the gas to have my dad drive 200 miles? $20. He and I fixed it in 30 minutes. Today? That would have totaled the vehicle. Insane.

    Transmissions today are $4000+. Motors are $5000+ for gas V6 and V8s.

    You want a 1/2-ton extra cab pickup with 4wd and under 100k miles? Cheapest one in my area without a salvage title is $19,000. When you figure finance rates on new vs. used, you are usually within $100 a month for a used vehicle with 90,000 miles vs. new with zero miles.

    Back in 2004, I bought a used 1992 Ford F250 supercab 4x4 with 49,000 original miles in excellent condition for $8995. Beautiful truck! I would give my left nut for a truck like that today at that price.

    They simply don't exist.

    Those days are long gone. Show me a nice condition 4x4 3/4-ton pickup with under 100k miles for under $10k and I will buy it.
    "Luck don't live out here. Wolves don't kill the unlucky deer; they kill the weak ones..." Jeremy Renner in Wind River

  5. #5
    Boolit Master




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    Quote Originally Posted by megasupermagnum View Post
    I'm not going to dispute that the country is in a real bad place as far as debt and inflation, but why would you want to buy a brand new truck? Someone must be, but it sure ain't me. I've bought every vehicle I ever had with cash.
    I did a search on Autotrader.com for a 1/2-ton 4wd pickup with under 100k miles in your zip code, 57402. First pickup listed was a 2007 Chevy Silverado Work Truck with some body damage for $13,900.

    Second cheapest truck for sale was a 2011 Chevy Silverado for $17,950.

    Third truck listed for your area was a 2012 Ford F-150 with 90k miles for $19,990.

    https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...&numRecords=25
    If you can come up with nearly $20k cash to pay for a decent pickup, then you are doing quite well. Pretty sure most of us don't have that kind of cash laying around.
    "Luck don't live out here. Wolves don't kill the unlucky deer; they kill the weak ones..." Jeremy Renner in Wind River

  6. #6
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Brother just bought a 21 crew cab loaded with lift kit and bigger tires here for 42K. Search a little more

  7. #7
    Boolit Master




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    Quote Originally Posted by tomme boy View Post
    Brother just bought a 21 crew cab loaded with lift kit and bigger tires here for 42K. Search a little more
    So, I should drive 1400 miles to save $5k on a new pickup? Would you? As a rule, I don't buy Midwest vehicles. Used Midwest vehicles are junk due to rust and abuse. But, new Midwest vehicles are sometimes a bargain. Had a buddy drive to Wisconsin to buy a new RV camper and saved $8k over what it would cost out here. Midwest prices on boats can be a deal as well. My brother-in-law goes to the midwest to buy used tractors to rebuild and sell out here for thousands of dollars of profit.
    "Luck don't live out here. Wolves don't kill the unlucky deer; they kill the weak ones..." Jeremy Renner in Wind River

  8. #8
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by Idaho45guy View Post
    Was going over the remaining financial obligation for my 2019 Toyota 4Runner. I love it, and it will be a great vehicle for at least another ten years if I keep it. But, I would like a 1/2-ton pickup to tow a 22' RV camper, or a half cord of firewood, or whatever you need a 1/2-ton pickup for. So, naturally I looked at Toyota Tundras. The cheapest I could find within 100 miles was $48,000. For a pretty basic 1/2-ton pickup. The "fancy" ones were $52,000 and up.

    So, since i have $6,000 worth of equity in my current vehicle, I would need to finance $42,000 in order to buy a new pickup. To keep the payments to where I could afford them, I would have to get an 84 month loan at 2.5% interest, even with my excellent credit score.

    That's seven years of payments at $536 a month to buy a modest 1/2-ton pickup truck! That is insane! My house payment on a 3-bedroom home in a nice neighborhood is $575 a month.

    I called my dad to discuss the dilemma, and he pointed out that in a couple of years, when my 4Runner is paid off, that interest rates may be up around 8-10% on new vehicles. And prices for new pickups may be nearly twice what they are today due to inflation.

    He lived through the 70's and Jimmy Carter and idiotic economic policies. He thinks Joe Biden is leading us directly into historically high interest rates and crippling inflation.

    He advised me to keep my 4Runner and pay it off and put extra money aside. He said he thinks economic end times are about to hit and a $400 car payment and a $575 house payment are extremely valuable and to not jeopardize either. He thinks the days of Americans moving slowly up the ladder of economic prosperity are over. That the dream of having a nicer vehicle and bigger home with just a bit more hard work and a promotion is gone. We are about to enter a winter of inflation and devaluation of the dollar.

    Seems like now is the time to lock in a $48,000 pickup at 2% finance rate if in a couple of years, the same pickup will cost me $60,000 at 5% interest, right?

    Whatever happens, I just can't believe that a pickup costs a year's wages or more these days.

    My grandpa made $32,000 a year in 1979 as a union carpenter. He bought a brand new 1979 F150 XLT pickup regular cab 2wd for $5,500.

    That brand new pickup cost him 1/5 of his year's wages. Today, a new F150 like my Grandpa's would cost $35,000.

    In 2021, union carpenter wages are about twice what my grandpa made, or $28 an hour. That equals about $56,000 a year.

    So today, a new F150 costs more than half of a year's wages in today's wages. Used to cost a fifth of a year's wages.

    This is why the middle class is disappearing and why people are struggling. Nobody wants to talk about it or acknowledge it. But the facts are the facts.
    https://www.bls.gov/data/inflation_calculator.htm

    According to this inflation calculator $32,000 in Jan 1979 comes out to $125,120. $5,500 comes out to $21,505. Looks like trucks have increased in price and the wages haven't kept up with inflation.

    Wish I knew the solution.
    quando omni flunkus moritati

  9. #9
    Boolit Master
    GARD72977's Avatar
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    If you want a new truck and you can afford it buy one.

    No telling what stupid regulations are coming for gas vehicles. Intrest rate is good and every thing is going up in price.

    Any body that put off building anything cant afford lumber prices now.

  10. #10
    Boolit Buddy
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    When I bought my GMC 1500 club cab 4WD pickup in '92 for $24,000! I thought I'd drive it until the wheels fell off. It now has about 180,000 miles and is still going strong. Every time I think i'd like a newer smaller truck, I check prices of 3-4 year old trucks and just say, Jimmy your good for another 100,000 miles!

  11. #11
    Boolit Master

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    I went in to a dealer looking to get a new F-150. Sticker prices were in the high $40s. The truck that I ended up getting stickered at $48K but with incentives came down to $35K. Even though I get X-Plan pricing, I would have paid more going that route. I financed it and paid it off in 18 months or so.
    We have zero debts so financing a vehicle that I can pay off in less than 2 years is fine for me.

    Right now it is a sellers market. Supplies are lean and prices are high. A guy that I know bought a truck for $33K and had a dealer offer him $37K on trade. It's nuts out there right now.

    Your best bet? Keep what you have and pay it off as fast as possible.
    “Coincidence is God’s way of remaining anonymous.”

  12. #12
    Boolit Buddy
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    The problem was looking at Toyotas. Trucks are profitable products and even though Toyota is, depending on who you ask, at best an "even" competitor, their products, new and used, command a premium.

    Say what you will about the big three, but pickups are their game. Shop around some and you might find that you don't need that kind of money to get into a good one.

    I bought a new truck 16 years ago, it's long paid off, and I hope to have it at least another ten years before I let it go and get another new one. I figure a man can buy a new pickup every 25 years or so.

  13. #13
    Boolit Buddy jessdigs's Avatar
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    The time to buy a tundra was late 2019 early 2020. I put 15 down on my 2019 limited TRD, to get the payment down to $600, and got 0% financing for 60 months. My co workers uncle owns two Toyota dealerships, and I paid $200 more than they paid for it. No dealer markups, no BS. My mom just bought a Tacoma and all we could do was MSRP but they removed the $2500 dealer markup. She got 2.9%

    Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

  14. #14
    Boolit Master


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    Lock in low rates now folks. For those to young to remember, rates at one time were near 20%. If you have an adjustable rate mortgage, refinance and get a fixed one. Get those credit cards paid off or take an equity line if you can and pay them off. Things will be just like the latter 70's again.

  15. #15
    Boolit Master
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    I'd keep the Tundra for a knock around plywood hauler and find some old man that just kicked the bucket and granny wants to sell out...cheap
    Several times a year I see these package deals, Truck and camper combo for sale.
    One thing about old men, They tend to take care of what they own.

  16. #16
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    you need one of those new F150 electric trucks like Biden was driving yesterday...He even offered to drive over a reporter with it, when the reporter asked a question that Biden didn't like. Ha Ha Ha Ha !!!
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    “If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.”
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  17. #17
    Boolit Mold
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    I agree that the new truck prices are insane, and that is why I don't have one. My old trucks definitely are lacking in some areas, but I put money in shooting gear, and get by with used up vehicles.

    Sent from my SM-A505U using Tapatalk

  18. #18
    Boolit Master
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    Seems like getting a trailer is the cheapest and easiest solution. You can haul whatever and more than you could haul in a half ton pickup. And you can just disconnect the trailer and leave it full if you aren’t feeling like unloading everything before you have to head somewhere.
    8500' Wet Mountain Valley, Colorado

  19. #19
    Boolit Buddy
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    Financially you could possibly come out better by purchasing a used truck through your bank. New trucks are much like current ammo prices, the reason prices are so insane is because people are lined up and willing to be raped.

    IMHO, the 50k 1/2 ton falls far short of a 25k 3/4 ton everyday of the week. Most especially in the mountains.
    Cargo

  20. #20
    Boolit Master
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    Toyotas go for more $$ than other brands, it's a good truck backed by a good company, period.

    Put the $536 a month aside until something worthwhile used comes up. If things start sliding downhill there will be a lot of late model trucks for sale.

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