Which Least Expensive Bench Lathe ??

[Scrounge]

I got a big old South Bend, I got it from a school that got 3 of them on govt. surplus deal. They couldn’t use them because they couldn’t be brought under safety codes. I gathered up all kinds of tooling, “surplus” when mines & mills around here were going under.
I have been looking for a deal on a good small lathe, bench top. They are hard to find used, they are snapped up quick. The low end Chinese stuff is a waste of money. You fool yourself if you think you are going to turn any precision parts on them. Not even brass or alumilum.

We're going to have to disagree on that. I know people who've made parts with .0001" tolerances on the chinese import lathes. Standard tolerance for most machined parts is +/- .005". I can hold .001" easily. What you can't do on these lathes is work as fast, and cut as deep. You have to take it slower, and with shallower cuts. Sharper tools work better, too. Carbide tooling can be used, but it is still limited. Depending on the lathe you get, you can do some work on the lathe itself, that will make it work better. I didn't find I needed to do that on mine. What I needed was to learn how to measure better, and not be in so much of a hurry. If I can do it, anyone can.

This gentleman bought one of the earlier versions of the HF lathe. He thinks they're a fine tool: http://www.varmintal.com/alath.htm

[bangerjim]

Thread is wandering a bit.............. back to OP's question:

Right now the "least expensive" functional metal lathe you can buy (new) is the HF unit. I have one and know all the goods and bads of it! After some serious tweaking and adjusting and swearing, I got it hone in to an accurate little machine. Adding a zero-set chuck and an Aloris-style tool post helped! I never change the gears on it....in fact I don't even know where the gear set is in my hobby shop! Variable speed control takes care of my needs on that little hobby lathe.

He is not trying for production speed and output and not making fine Swiss watches, so the accuracy of the little HF machine as-purchased will probably fill his needs.....for now! Later, by keeping a sharp eye out, a used quality lathe could/will show up. And sell the HF thing on here! Enough people on here are hungry for small inexpensive lathes, well-maintained, one-owner, and not mistreated, it would move rapidly.

I started out old, used, and small, on all my many metal and wood working machines as you can read in my above threads. But I finally got the tools of my dreams by watching and waiting (and saving $$).

Good luck to the OP in his choices!

banger

[Scrounge]

Thread is wandering a bit.............. back to OP's question:

Right now the "least expensive" functional metal lathe you can buy (new) is the HF unit. I have one and know all the goods and bads of it! After some serious tweaking and adjusting and swearing, I got it hone in to an accurate little machine. Adding a zero-set chuck and an Aloris-style tool post helped! I never change the gears on it....in fact I don't even know where the gear set is in my hobby shop! Variable speed control takes care of my needs on that little hobby lathe.

He is not trying for production speed and output and not making fine Swiss watches, so the accuracy of the little HF machine as-purchased will probably fill his needs.....for now! Later, by keeping a sharp eye out, a used quality lathe could/will show up. And sell the HF thing on here! Enough people on here are hungry for small inexpensive lathes, well-maintained, one-owner, and not mistreated, it would move rapidly.

I started out old, used, and small, on all my many metal and wood working machines as you can read in my above threads. But I finally got the tools of my dreams by watching and waiting (and saving $$).

Good luck to the OP in his choices!

banger

Exactly right. On all counts. Or he can keep the HF once he finds a bigger better lathe, if he ever decides he needs one, and use it for small parts-pins, screws, etc. Just depends on how addicted to machine tools he gets.

7x12 is the same price as the 7x10, but my local store has the 7x10 in stock. https://www.harborfreight.com/search?q=metal%20lathe So then it depends on how much of a hurry he's in.

There is another mini-lathes group that is a good resource, if you can stand a bit of political stuff. https://groups.io/g/7x12MiniLathe I am no longer an member there, since they don't like the signatures I've used in my emails to the group. Still a lot of good info. Kind of funny, the were formed after the original 7x10 Yahoo group went way to political and way off-topic.

Bill

[country gent]

I do fine precision work on my HF 7 x 10 ( +/- .001) but like most small light machines you have to "sneak" up on it, On mine the dials read movement nit cut ( on cross slide and compound this means that every .001 movement gives .002 cut). I seldom use the power feed on this size machine but feed by hand. a well honed sharp HSS cobalt tool performs better for me than carbide. The big drawback to these machines is the lack of stops on cross feed. Setting the gibs is also touchier than on the heavier machines as it is a simple set screw adjustment not the tapered slides.

Hardringe made a very basic tool room lathe with a cam locked carriage no lead screw. you couldnt thread but it was a very accurate precise machine. you set the compound parallel and used it to turn or face.

Like a lot of things its not so much the lathe but the operator using it. Learning the machine and taking a little time makes a big difference.

I have 3 lathes currently A nardinni a clausing style and the harbor freight 7 X 10. For a few years it was only the HF. For bigger parts and short runs the nardinni is great turn to the numbers and its right there, the clasusing style is good for one offs threads and work as you go. Its a lighter machine so easier on the operator. The HF is good for those small parts where yo just want to do it quick and dirty or turning a second part when the others are set up. Now here is an idea of these three machines The nardinni is 3500 lbs the clausing style is 2000 lbs and the HF is 75 lbs. You can expect the 75 lb machine to perform with the 3500 lb one

The biggest thing I dont like with the HF is the compounds lock screws are under the compound it has to be backed out almost all the way to get to them to set the angle.

Buy what you can afford and have room for then learn to use it. Thats one of the pluses to the HF mini, when not in use it can be set on shelf out of the way not taking up room

[ulav8r]

The 7 inch lathes are small enough for the loading bench but big enough to make repair parts for a much bigger lathe. A small lathe can also make parts when the larger lathe has a setup you don't want to tear down, so an emergency part can be made without disrupting a job in progress.

Another thing to consider is that is is often easier to find a machine for sale if you already have a machine in the shop. I looked for an affordable lathe for years. Finally went to a school auction and got two lathes the same day(10 inch Rockwells, about $650 for both). Traded one of them for an engine worth $500 about a year later. About 3 years later got a South Bend Heavy 10 on a sealed bid auction at work($199). Then about 6 yrs ago got a 6 inch Dalton Pattern lathe at a yard sale for $50, it is about the same size as an Atlas 6x18 but heavier. The Rockwell and SB both have quick change gear boxes, but the Dalton can not do threads. Had the opportunity to bid on a 17 inch SB at the same job where I got the Heavy 10 but it was bigger than the space I had, about 10-12 feet long and the ways had a bit of wear in the first foot from the chuck.

[bangerjim]

ulav8r

You bring up a great point! Excessive ways wear in the 1st foot or so of bed space is critical and should be checked out B4 ever purchasing the used lathe. Older well-used lathes that are not of high quality (hardened ways) will exhibit this wear and it will cause problems - if you plan on turning/finishing very long pieces. Up close short work will not suffer.

I do not believe the little HF units have fully hardened ways. Someone please speak up if they have documentation that says otherwise. Not much on the web on that subject. I guess people in that low-end segment of the lathe market do no know the advantages of fully hardened, ground, an lapped ways are.

[uscra112]

If they HF beds are hardened at all it's just flame-hardening. Many years ago the company I worked for was, among other rackets, an importer of a Taiwanese lathe which hsd flame-hardened ways, They didn't last long, and they were un-rebuildable. Ditto a lot of the cheap Japanese machining centers that flooded the market in the '80s. Those machines were essentially throwaways. They sold based on their "shop-floor" CNCs, (i.e. Fanuc) which the American builders of higher-quality machines had no counter for.

[Scrounge]

If they HF beds are hardened at all it's just flame-hardening. Many years ago the company I worked for was, among other rackets, an importer of a Taiwanese lathe which hsd flame-hardened ways, They didn't last long, and they were un-rebuildable. Ditto a lot of the cheap Japanese machining centers that flooded the market in the '80s. Those machines were essentially throwaways. They sold based on their "shop-floor" CNCs, (i.e. Fanuc) which the American builders of higher-quality machines had no counter for.

Most if perhaps not all the 7x imports do not have hardened beds. For a hobby machine, that is not a necessity. If you plan on having someone operating the lathe all day every day, as in a production shop, it would become a problem. On a hobby lathe, it's a benefit. If you do wear out the bed, you can buy a replacement of the same or a longer size for relatively small money. Or you can learn to scrape lathe beds on a small lathe, and make it work again. Or you could upgrade to a larger & more powerful machine.

https://littlemachineshop.com/produc...ory=1687114045 is a 16" bed with the extended leadscrew and rack to convert the shorter 7x mini-lathes to a 16" lathe.

They also have a hi-torque 16" lathe on sale for $1199: https://littlemachineshop.com/produc...ProductID=5100
It has a more powerful motor than the HF and similar lathes. It's not the cheapest, but it's pretty cheap for a 16" mini-lathe, and it shows as in stock. A little more than the MicroMark, and probably doesn't have true inch dials, but still a pretty good price.

https://littlemachineshop.com/produc...ory=1271799306 shows the 7x & 8X lathes they have now, including the two I mentioned above, and a 7x14" for $749.95, and the Deluxe version of the 7x16 Hi-Torque, which has a QCTP & DRO included for $1599.

Again, not the cheapest, but a fine starting point for someone who is pretty sure they're going to be doing this stuff for a while as a learning machine that will remain capable. Though you can add a DRO & QCTP yourself for probably under $400, when you get to the point you need it. That was & is my plan. I've got the QCTP, haven't gotten the DRO yet, as I'm considering the 16" bed. Though if I do that, I need another rolling tool cabinet to mount it on. Right now I have the 7x10" lathe and the mini-mill on one 46" tool cabinet, and it's a little tight. The 7x16" mini-lathes weigh about 125lbs, my 7x10 is about 98lbs.

Bill

[country gent]

Just received the Grizzly summer sale flyer in e-mail today. They have a nice looking 4" X 6" table top lathe on sale Its $525.00. This would cover case mods, firing pins and small parts nicely. Has a feed wheel at the end of the bed like tags do.You would need to look and see what tooling it comes with.

[Scrounge]

Just received the Grizzly summer sale flyer in e-mail today. They have a nice looking 4" X 6" table top lathe on sale Its $525.00. This would cover case mods, firing pins and small parts nicely. Has a feed wheel at the end of the bed like tags do.You would need to look and see what tooling it comes with.

It is cheap, but also very limited. Not a threading lathe, only a 10mm/.39 spindle through hole, and a very limited number of accessories. Not at all expandable, either. Very similar, size-wise, and the 14mmx1 thread on the spindle will let you use some of the later Unimat accessories. But it isn't a Unimat. I am sure it would be better than nothing, but for another $175, you could get a much more capable 7x10 or 7x12 mini-lathe. Which takes MT2 tailstock taper accessories, and MT3 spindle accessories. I share mine between my 7x10 mini-lathe and the 10x24 Atlas TH42, and the tailstock of the Smithy CB-1220XL, which uses MT3 taper accessories, too. Yes, I guess it is the cheapest, but not as compatible.

Bill

[uscra112]

I would not want any lathe that doesn't have power feed to the carriage.

That Grizzly 7 x 12 looks like a good choice. For one thing it comes with a steady rest. For another it has 2-1/2" of quill travel in the tailstock. I'd pull the compound slide off and mount a Little Machine Shop quick-change toolpost on an adapter plate, if it were mine. Which it might be. My ancient Prazi has about had it, and there's no support for them here anymore.

[bangerjim]

When buying a lathe (or other machine tool) like a mill, be sure the head stock threads are standard and use a standard Morris taper. All my equipment uses MT2 or MT3 along with C3, C5, and r8 collets. That way you can interchange tooling among the various current (and future!) machines! And the ER style collets are really nice when you have the right fit-up to the spindle.

Power cross-feed and threading are nice features to have on a lathe. Unfortunately you are getting into some rather pricey machines with those features. One can always buy a FULL set of good taps and dies for threading the turned product from the lathe.

[uscra112]

LOL! You DID mean Morse, of course.

[Scrounge]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHajnIraFQM Another guy who shares my opinion on the 7x mini-lathes.

Bill

[bangerjim]

LOL! You DID mean Morse, of course.

Don't ya just love those spell checkers!

[Scrounge]

That $1099 MicroMark lathe has been backordered for many months. I've had a "notify me" set with them since forever. I don't think they intend for it ever to come back into stock, especially at that price.

A thing to know about Asian almost-anything: As a U.S.A. retailer you buy from "trading companies", not from a manufacturer directly. These trading companies have what we might call "quality grades". Harbor Freight will buy the lowest grade, so they can undersell everyone. Corners will be cut. They don't care because they don't intend to provide support. LMS/Grizzly/MicroMark will buy better, because their clientele expects support, and will get it. While I don't know from personal experience re: small lathes, I have played in that export/import sandbox, and seen how it works. The worst actors are Amazon/evilBay sellers. Buy one lot of xxxx cheap, sell until it's gone, then fold the tent and pop up as someone else.

Got an email today that says they're back in stock. If anyone is interested...

Bill

[8shot]

Would be interested in a mini lathe like this unit, they come in 750 and 850 watt...the feature I like is the 38mm (1-1/2") spindle bore...really handy for working on 1+" barrel stock.

As mentioned in an earlier post...not to sure if this ebay seller would be a credible "warranty tool seller" specifically machine tools ...check out the sellers "other items/tools" for sale

https://www.ebay.com/itm/26446711563...Cclp%3A2334524

[john.k]

If buying a tiny lathe ,ignore all the silly machines with with huge centre heights.......a small machine should only have 3 or 4" centre height ,otherwise it loses all rigidity.......i reckon these machines are value for doing stuff like small brass work,aluminium,but generally struggle with steel......Once upon a time ,a guy I owed a favour too was having problems with a small ,very old lathe he was making fountain pens on.......anyhoo,he bought a real Chinese cheapie with ball bearings.....then he wanted me to grind a tapered pen adapter from his old lathe to fit his new one ........with the adaptor made and fitted ,i checked for runout......the little Chinese lathe had zero runout on a tenths gauge.......I checked it twice ,first time ,I thought maybe my gauge was stuck,but no ,it had zero runout.

[Drm50]

I could kick myself for not buying a German jewelers lathe at auction. It was so small it was in wooden case with carrying handle. Had lots of stuff in drawers. It ended up going for $80. I knew nothing about them at the time. I think it was 220volt, which is not uncommon in parts of Europe.
That’s why it went so cheap. It still only under 15amp.

[country gent]

A lot of those little jeweler lathes were very accurate machines. Most were hand feed and small. in the 3" swing and 7-14" between centers. Always wanted one to use. A guy in the last shop I worked in had one in his tool box for small bushings pins and odds and ends.