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Thread: How to make copper boolits

  1. #1
    Boolit Grand Master


    GregLaROCHE's Avatar
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    How to make copper boolits

    With all the talk of one state after another going to only copper for hunting, I was wondering how copper bullets were made. I am thinking they will be swaged, but I could be wrong. Can they be cast or made on a high production lathe or mill. Anyone have an answer. Maybe there are different ways.

  2. #2
    Boolit Buddy HumptyDumpty's Avatar
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    If it is just a prohibition on lead projectiles, why not cast up a bismuth boolit?

  3. #3
    Boolit Buddy
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    Most of the solid copper bullets I have handled have been individually machined.

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    Boolit Grand Master Nobade's Avatar
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    a lot of them are made on swiss screw machines.

  5. #5
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    Fort Scott Munitions makes their solid copper bullets on lathes. Lots and lots of lathes.....

    Hope this helps.

    Fred
    After a shooting spree, they always want to take the guns away from the people who didn't do it. - William S. Burroughs.

  6. #6
    Boolit Master

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    There’s a big difference between casting lead and casting copper.

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    I had a friend who said that he made 17cal bullets when the 17 Rem first come out as projectiles were hart to get. I understand he started with copper wire and drilled a small hole in one end then swaged them to shape. Regards Stephen

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    Boolit Buddy M.A.D's Avatar
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    Automatic Screw Machines...

  9. #9
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    I’m not thinking about doing it myself. I was just wondering if one day the major ammunition producers started doing it, how it would be done. Might there be any economy of scale, that some day would make them available for plinking? There are already some rumblings about bismuth not being much healthier than lead.

  10. #10
    Boolit Grand Master Nobade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GregLaROCHE View Post
    I’m not thinking about doing it myself. I was just wondering if one day the major ammunition producers started doing it, how it would be done. Might there be any economy of scale, that some day would make them available for plinking? There are already some rumblings about bismuth not being much healthier than lead.
    The spot price on copper is pretty high at this point. Even without being turned into a bullet that much material is rather expensive.

  11. #11
    Boolit Buddy pacomdiver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HumptyDumpty View Post
    If it is just a prohibition on lead projectiles, why not cast up a bismuth boolit?
    or cast them out of zinc like some guys have done.

  12. #12
    Boolit Buddy JLF's Avatar
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    Bronze tips ... having the mold and the furnace to melt, you can not make bullets?
    "When the homeland is in danger, everything is allowed, except not to defend it."

    Gral. Don José de San Martin.

  13. #13
    Boolit Buddy Liberty1776's Avatar
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    The Barnes XPB .500 S&W Mag 325gr is solid copper. Does not appear to be made on a lathe. They have slight surface texture, like they've been tumbled or some other manufacturing process.

    https://www.barnesbullets.com/bullets/xpb/

    Click image for larger version. 

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    They also cost $1.55 EACH.

  14. #14
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    You could use copper jackets filled with copper powder. If you talking about making a solid copper bullets, that’d be a different story...

  15. #15
    Boolit Grand Master

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    I believe most if the all copper bullets are turned from bar stock thats very close to size. A screw machine would do but even better would be a multiple spindle machine, On the screw machine tolerances would be harder to hold, My guess is a small cnc lathe with bar feeder and tool changer. For a standard non hollow point bullet thus would be a 2-3 tool program. running with full coolant it would probably drop a bullet every 2 seconds into the tray. This set up would also be easy to make changes / improvements with a change to the program. With the feeder machine could run unattended or little attention. A 10' bar of copper would probably make 110 bullets or so since you will lose roughly 7" to the cut off tool.

    Swaging solid copper bullets would require a press of heavy ton age and very expensive dies, Probably 200 ton to form ogive and boat tails.

    Bismuth, zinc and other castable materials are also harder than desired an can be brittle, abrasive or require dangerous fluxes. Aluminum can be cast in the home shop and might be doable as well as some of the mish metals that are used in die casting but these material almost require a pressurized casing (shot tube) to get proper grain structure and air out.

    For the home tinkerer they can be turned on a standard engine lathe with form tooling but set up and cutter grinds will be critical.

  16. #16
    Boolit Master

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    IF a person had a 25 ton press and dies that withstood the force copper wires should be usable to make a bullet of pure copper that would peel apart in a soft target.
    I do it with .185 lead wire in a 45 short jacket I do not have the pressure needed for copper .Click image for larger version. 

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    When I think back on all the **** I learned in high school it's a wonder I can think at all ! And then my lack of education hasn't hurt me none I can read the writing on the wall.

  17. #17
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    I've just commissioned a copper bullet design. So I can judge whether its worth getting them made to sell on or just for me to hunt with.

    Once i get a price i will let you know.

  18. #18
    Boolit Grand Master

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    For the home booliteer I'd think, as mentioned above, either bismuth or zinc are the obvious choices if lead becomes scarce or even illegal to use. They both have relatively low melting points and are castable in standard moulds. For commercial bullet production I'd have to think that swaging would be the only way to keep costs down. It takes a big press and substantial dies but would waste a lot less copper.

    Setting up to machine using CNC lathes is pretty easy, repeatable and fairly high production rates but the amount of copper waste is very large. The chips could be collected and would have scrap value but still high waste/bullet which = cost.

    Possibly some enterprising individual or company like Rotometals will come up with a castable alloy that meets legal/environmental requirements but is similar to lead for casting. As the saying goes... "Necessity is the mother of invention!"

    Longbow

  19. #19
    Boolit Grand Master

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    I believe the big press would be to slow to be truly productive, Our end presses ere roughly 50-70 ton and ran at around 400 strokes per minute, this was coining and blanking can ends. Very light steel and not a lot of profile. The 100 ton presses at the last shop ran at 15-20 strokes per minute. I believe this is closer to the press it would take to swage solid copper bullets.

    Starting with 5/16 copper for a 30 cal bullet there wouldnt be a lot of chips. mostly from the ogive and boat tail if there was one. Im thinking 2-3 bullets to make a teaspoon of chips.I believe the speed would beat out the chips produced

    forging may produce a good bullet also

  20. #20
    Boolit Mold
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    Just wondering if anyone has tried/used copper powder, to substitute a lead core, and guessing that you would require a longer jackets to achieve a similar weight to a lead cored jacketed Bullet.
    If you have…. Any issues with seating/compressing the copper powder
    Just thinking would it be possible to make a copper Bullet with a copper jacket-powdered core
    Thanks Guys for your input

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check