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Thread: Cast 30-30 for bear

  1. #1
    Boolit Master

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    Cast 30-30 for bear

    The short of it: a good friend can't find ammo for his 30-30. I have a load worked up for my 30-30 that shoots well. It's a Lee 170gr GC, powder coated. It's a full power load that even shoots very close to point of aim for factory 170gr JSPs. The lead is range scrap with maybe 10-15% linotype. (I know, I'm not terribly scientific)

    I don't even want to get into the whole "don't share your reloads" thing; he's been a good friend for the better part of half a century, and one of the few people I have no problem sharing my reloads with.

    The question is: how do you expect these would work on coastal black bear? Are they going to be about as effective as store-bought 170gr JSPs, or should he just spend the outrageous money from a scalper on gunbroker to buy the ammo he needs? He's a VERY experienced hunter, and a good shot. I'm not a hunter at all, so I don't know about these things.

  2. #2
    Boolit Master
    barrabruce's Avatar
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    How well do they feed and shoot in his gun?

    I know nothing about bears thou.

  3. #3
    Boolit Grand Master
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    I've gotten a few bears but am not a true expert, by any means. Black bears are not hard to kill, but good shot placement is paramount. As long as the alloy isn't too hard, I'd say you will be fine. You may want to shoot some water jugs or wet newsprint to see how they perform. If they do not deform, I would think them too hard. I'd opt for a double lung / heart shot.

  4. #4
    Boolit Buddy Ateam's Avatar
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    I think we need a little more info on the hunt/hunter. Is this a hunt he does yearly, or is it a once in a lifetime tag? How many bear has he successfully bagged before?

    If this is NOT a once in a lifetime tag, and he has killed bear before, I think cast is a great choice.
    I suspect your boolits will be a little on the hard side, but Black bear are not hard to kill and it will probably be fine.

    If this is a big hunt for him and he is unlikely to do it again/ has a ton of money into it, then I would tell him to suck it up and pay for the ammo. Regardless of price, in this scenario, it is likely a very small percentage of the total outlay.

  5. #5
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    personally, I go after bears every year. i believe the 30-30 and the lee 170 will be fine for an experienced hunter. just make total sure he gets some range time and knows exactly how it will preform with his gun... i use a bit of a harder bullet on them and they can be tough if they get excited. and a shoulder shot will break down a bigger bear faster then anything and will help keep them planted. always be ready for a follow up shot. have him take his time.. no rushing. Like 725 said above, if they do not preform, soften them up some.. bigger bears are harder to pass through then deer. so i tend to be harder for black bears then my deer alloy. and never shoot a running spooked bear.

    the bigger the metplat, the better.

    hope this helps.

    Marko
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  6. #6
    Boolit Buddy memtb's Avatar
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    With an experienced, cool, calm, collected hunter and good bullet placement.....should work fine. Though, IMO if the bears get quite large.....the challenge increases exponentially! memtb
    You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel

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  7. #7
    Boolit Master
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    In case his bear turns out to be a big Bruin, I would suggest your friend wears a big iron on his hip just in case things turn south that he is good with if possible.

    Personally the 35 Rem in a Marlin lever is my choice for brush bustin’ and I am not even a bear hunter.

    Three44s
    Quote Originally Posted by Bret4207

    “There is more to this than dumping lead in a hole.”

  8. #8
    Boolit Master
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    Depends where he is hunting, once in lifetime?, every year? expected size of bears? black bears in Idaho, Montana tend to be small, 200lbs +/-, some of the PA and Carolina bears can be 400-600 plus. I think in the 30-30, the new Barnes Original(pure lead,pure copper) 190 gr would be my choice, or one of heavier 190 plus/minus molds from Accurate or NOE. Of course the 170gr Swift and Nosler Partitions work well, then there is the good old Core-Lokt.

  9. #9
    Boolit Master

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    I would love to be able to kill a bear but there are none in the areas that I hunt . I can't imagine that your load would not kill a bear though since for as long as I can remember two of the most popular guns with the dog hunters I know who do kill bears are Winchester 92 carbines in 38-40 and 44-40 and the Ruger .44 Magnum Carbine . The fellow shooting the Ruger does use jacketed Hp ammo but he buys the Blazer aluminum cased stuff and it's rather mild compared to most of the brass cased stuff I have shot in mine , still kills his bear with one good shot . The guys shooting the 92's use handloads with cast from wheel weights and so far as I know have no horror stories about wounded bears due to insufficient ammo / bullet hardness . The shot placement as always is the key .
    Grumpy Old Man With A Gun....... Do Not Touch !!

  10. #10
    Boolit Master Win94ae's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fatelk View Post
    The short of it: a good friend can't find ammo for his 30-30. I have a load worked up for my 30-30 that shoots well. It's a Lee 170gr GC, powder coated. It's a full power load that even shoots very close to point of aim for factory 170gr JSPs. The lead is range scrap with maybe 10-15% linotype. (I know, I'm not terribly scientific)
    You need to test them in his rifle, unless he is using your rifle.
    [edit]On second thought, that might not be a good idea, why don't you have him bring over his gun, and you load develop a load for it? Because... see comment below.[/edit]

    Quote Originally Posted by fatelk View Post
    I don't even want to get into the whole "don't share your reloads" thing; he's been a good friend for the better part of half a century, and one of the few people I have no problem sharing my reloads with.
    Not sharing handloads has nothing to do with friendship; it has to do with developing a load for one gun, that is strong, then shooting it in a not so strong gun. You don't want to blow-up your friends gun, while blinding, maiming or killing him!
    Last edited by Win94ae; 04-17-2021 at 11:14 AM. Reason: on second thought

  11. #11
    Boolit Master
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    Most of the bears around my neighborhood on the Olympic Peninsula (and there are lots of them) run less than 300#. We even have a runt adult (over 4 years old) boar bear boar that can't weigh more than 140# soaking wet but he has a really bad attitude making him dangerous. I think any would be a candidate for the 30/30 with the load you created. There is one local, very timid, supersized boar I have seen in my yard that is clearly well over 400#. I might suggest a little bigger gun for that one or just pass on it until a normal one comes by.

  12. #12
    Boolit Master

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    Sorry, I thought it went without saying that we would make sure that these loads would function safely and accurately in his rifle. I expect they will, since they are near twins, same make and model, slightly different vintage. We'll do our due diligence on that part.

    As to whether this is a hunt of his lifetime- no, definitely not. More like the daily go-to-work kind of hunt. He's a government trapper, and it's his job to deal with problem bears from time to time. When I say he's an experienced hunter, he's very experienced. He prefers his old 30-30 and his boss can't seem to source any ammo for him, so I offered to let him try some of mine until his normal sources become available again. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything. He has backup in the form of a Model 29 on his hip, and dogs, but even these smaller bears are dangerous creatures. I wouldn't want to face one under any circumstances with ammo that's not up to the task.

  13. #13
    Boolit Master



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    First and foremost you can not even begin to comprehend how little I care that you may or may not discharge a weapon at a running moving target.

    In the Mid 90s,the third Black bear that fell to one of my shots was actually killed with a 42 gr fragment of a condom wrapped 150 gr 30 cal bullet that had been fired/launched from a P14 that had been re chambered to 30-06. The shot was well placed at a running bear At 65 yards, Redfield rear peep and appropriate front sight, I believe a Lyman single screw . I hit a 3" beech sapling right next to the side of that bear, there was line of wood splinters on the ground that had been stopped by the side of the bear. specs of hair on the snow, visible blood trail on snow starting in 10 feet, Dead bear in sight 41 paces from the Kilt tree. There were 2 tiny entrance holes in the hide that were found as I skinned the beast. the smaller fragment was in the rib meat. the larger fragment penetrated both sides of the ribs and left a small hole low threw both lungs. I found the 42 gr chunk of lead under the hide opposite of entrance.

    Yes a well placed shot from a 22 always triumphs over a Mega magnum poor hit from mega magnum or a 4 gauge. I believe there is nothing that can survive a well placed hit from that Lee cast boolit you reference. I would not hesitate to use it. Even If it were a once in a lifetime hunt ,If that's what I had there I would not hesitate to use it.
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  14. #14
    Boolit Grand Master popper's Avatar
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    I assume the ammo he would be using is 170 coreloc. With proper alloy I don't see a difference
    Whatever!

  15. #15
    Boolit Buddy badguybuster's Avatar
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    Ive used a 187 grain hard cast gas check over 3031 on black bear and its pretty effective. Its on the softer side at and smooshes pretty good making a heckuva hole when it passes thru ribs or shoulder. That being said....I have some 150 grain barnes tsx projectiles for 30-30 that I would sell him as well as some.coreloc

  16. #16
    Boolit Master
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    While i think this load will work I question that they can't find ammo. Do they not have the internet? I can order ammo without trying right now. Yes it's 3-3.50 a round for corelocks or leverlution but it is quick to find.

    My local fed game warden is free to spend as many of our tax dollars as needed. But he only spends what he truly needs to.

  17. #17
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    I'd listen to Markopolo- bears watch TV on his porch....
    This has nothing to do with a bear, but the other day I put a 50/50 Lee C309170F through a 2ft box filled with room temperature gel freezer bags at 100yds. It was found 4" deep in the dirt behind the box.
    Launched from my 30-30 with 25 grs of 3031, probably 1800 fps at the muzzle.
    If I had a good close shot at a black bear- hell yeah, I'd use it.

    Sent from my SM-A716U using Tapatalk

  18. #18
    Boolit Master
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    I consult Buffalo Bore's website when picking bullets for big/dangerous game. Their 30-30 bullets are 190gr flat nosed Hawk bullets, and a non-lead option.

  19. #19
    Boolit Master

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    I did a pretty primitive test today, just for curiosity. I was headed to the range anyhow. I took along some gallon jugs full of water and some 1" cedar boards from some old pallets.

    I stacked four boards and sat a jug in front of it. I shot one with a JSP factory round, and one with a cast 170gr bullet. Both jugs exploded with what appeared to be about the same violence. The JSP bullet was lodged in the 3rd board behind the jug, and the cast bullet went through all four, with a fragment of lead barely lodged in the railroad tie behind the boards.

    Same weight bullet, same velocity, similar penetration and transfer of energy. I'm satisfied with that. I'll give him a box to try if he's comfortable with them.

  20. #20
    Boolit Grand Master


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    Looks like a reasonable comparison test.
    I might adjust that test a bit by going two boards, one jug and two more boards all wrapped together with innertube just to see how the slugs take on variable substance like impacting a critter.
    "Come unto Me, all you who labor and are heavy burdened, and I will give you rest." Matthew 11:28
    Male Guanaco out in dry lakebed at 10,800 feet south of Arequipa.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check