RotoMetals2Reloading UKTitan ReloadingInline Fabrication
Lee PrecisionRepackboxMidSouth Shooters SupplyADvertise here

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 41 to 51 of 51

Thread: Dipping my toes into PCP Air Guns

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by NSB View Post
    For me, it was ditto on everything Don Verna said. Great accuracy, cheap to shoot (not to buy, but to shoot), and the angst associated with supply and demand is gone. Air and pellets are pretty cheap and they are FUN to shoot. Don has pointed out that you DON’T have to spend a great amount to still get a good quality/accurate air gun.
    I think the emphasis on the DON'T is misplaced it should be on the HAVE. You don't have to spend a lot, but you certainly can.

    I went crazy and bought myself a Daystate Redwolf highpower and my wife a Daystate Delta Wol'f since she has always liked the AR form type. Of course she hated the Delta wolf and loved the Redwolf. She made me buy her another Redwolf in a different color stock. So about 7500 dollars later we're all satisfied for the minute. Gotta love it when the little woman makes you buy a new rifle.

  2. #42
    Also, if you've already got a large bottle, you might consider a QD regulated tether directly from bottle to gun. I'm probably preaching to the choir here though.

  3. #43
    Boolit Grand Master


    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Northern Michigan
    Posts
    5,784
    Quote Originally Posted by Shanghai Jack View Post
    Also, if you've already got a large bottle, you might consider a QD regulated tether directly from bottle to gun. I'm probably preaching to the choir here though.
    I have thought about that and am going to look into it. Do you have any recommendations??

    BTW, went out after lunch and shot 12 groups with better pellets. Wind had picked up to 12 mph and gusting

    The JSB 15.89 gr pellets did well. Average .41" groups and a bit less horizontal stringing than the Crosman's. IMHO not worth the premium for plinking but nice to see groups getting smaller. Had a .16" "wallet group".

    For S&G's tried one target at 50 yards with the JSB's during a lull in the wind. .4" and perfectly round!!!! About 3/4 low from 25 yard zero. I expect it is a "wallet" group but promising none the less.

    I have put 200 pellets down the gun so things should get better but I will be pleased if it stays like this. One make of pellets was dismal (H&N Barracuda Match 21.14 gr) NSB sent me a sampler pack but I am holding off using those up; and shooting some of the stuff I bought with the Daystate.

    I will likely get another 10 tins of the Crosman pellets. At $10/500 they will keep the grandkids happy shooting for the weekend for less than going to Baskin-Robins. I have a spinner target for them, as punching paper gets boring, and those pellets are plenty accurate. If they put a few dings in the DAR it is not the end of the world.
    Last edited by dverna; 07-01-2021 at 07:23 PM.
    Don Verna

    NRA Endowment Member

  4. #44
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Location
    Thomaston, GA
    Posts
    47
    A couple of months ago I jumped in to big bore air rifles with an Airforce Texan SS in .457 caliber. I also went whole hog and started casting my own boolits for it. It is lots of fun, and is certainly addictive! The dynamics of shooting it is quite different from powder burners, but I like the change.

  5. #45
    Boolit Master

    sparky45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    SE, KS
    Posts
    2,095
    Might I suggest these; they seem to work very well in my Venturi Avenger.
    https://utahairguns.com/jsb-knockout...-39gr-200-pcs/

  6. #46
    Boolit Grand Master


    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Northern Michigan
    Posts
    5,784
    Yesterday was my birthday and decided to put all the chores on the back burner and shoot. I had to send the Daystate to Airguns of Arizona awhile back and when I got it back bought a good scope (Aztec) for it from a member here...NSB. NSB recommend a nice set of rings for it and wanted to try it out. The Daystate had not shot well when I first got it. That has changed.

    It was a great day to shoot. Sorry but I cannot get pictures to transfer from my phone so no pictures...you will have to trust me. LOL!! I shot a total of 47, 5 shot groups. I will list the smallest, largest and average of each 5 of 5 shot groups. BTW, I am a big believer is not quoting "wallet groups", or those itsy bitsy ones we get "when we do our part". Out of the nearly 250 shots fired I only dismissed one shot that I pulled. Everything else was recorded so this is REALITY.

    Started at 25 yards:

    Crosman 14.3 gr Domed Smallest .27", Largest .54", Average .35"
    JSB Match 15.89 gr Smallest .19", Largest .44", Average .29"
    H&N Barracuda 21.14 gr Smallest .19", Largest .42", Average .29"
    Air Arms 16.0 gr Smallest .30", Largest .46", Average .37"


    Then moved to 50 yards:

    Crosman 14.3 gr Domed Smallest .52", Largest 1.20", Average .92"
    JSB Match 15.89 gr Smallest .25", Largest .89", Average .55"
    Air Arms 16.0 gr Smallest .43", Largest 1.3", Average .70"


    After taking a break, I decided to run another set of groups for the JSB's and AA's. The one 1.3" group with the AA's bothered me....

    JSB Match 15.89 gr Smallest .33", Largest .68", Average .61"
    Air Arms 16.0 gr Smallest .38", Largest 1.08", Average .67"

    I continue to be impressed with the cheap Crosman 14.3gr Domed pellets. At short range they perform very well. In the Daystate they averaged .35" at 25 yard for 5 groups. In the DAR, they averaged .46" for 41 groups. At a cost of $10-12/tin of 500 they are a good plinking and training pellet at 25 yards.

    I have more work to do with the Daystate, with over 20 pellets to evaluate. I got a sampler pack from member NSB and have held off testing until the gun proved it could shoot. At this point, the JSB's tested above are the most consistent with groups ranging from .25" to .89" at 50 yards with a 10 group average of .58". At a cost of $18/500 they shoot about twice as accurately as bargain bulk .22's.

    It was very pleasant not to have to constantly put hearing protection on and off. And I had no casings to pick up at the end of the day.

    Any small critter within 50 yards is toast and I would not hesitate to reach out to 75 yards with the Daystate.

    BTW, the Daystate is not top of line but not inexpensive either. With the scope and rings it will be a $1600 rig. The DAR I have is at about $600 with a cheaper scope and set of rings. I hope to shoot the DAR later today at 50 yards, but at 25 yards, the extra $1000 gets a difference of .35" vs .46" using the inexpensive Crosman pellets.

    I will report on how the DAR performs at 50 yards later.

    One last comment. I am new to "quality" air guns and these guns are still getting broken in. With a better shooter and more barrel "seasoning" results should improve. In spite of those caveats, a decent air gun has a lot of advantages over a .22 LR. If you want to shoot inexpensively, and not be held hostage by .22LR market conditions, air guns are worth thinking about.

    I now spell FUN differently....PCP!!!
    Last edited by dverna; 09-13-2021 at 11:52 AM.
    Don Verna

    NRA Endowment Member

  7. #47
    Boolit Master

    sparky45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    SE, KS
    Posts
    2,095
    Not only that Don, but N.O.E. makes molds so you could cast your own if times get real bad.

  8. #48
    Boolit Grand Master


    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Northern Michigan
    Posts
    5,784
    Was able to get some rounds downrange with the DAR at 50 yards today.

    Again, using 5 - 5 shot groups as is my norm for testing.

    Crosman 14.3 Domed Smallest .78", Largest 1.53", Average 1.08"
    Barracuda Match 21.14 gr Smallest .68", Largest 1.38", Average .99"
    JSB 15.89 gr Smallest .59", Largest .85", Average .73"
    Air Arms 16.0 gr Smallest .64", Largest 1.25, Average .89"

    Then cleaned the barrel...put about 15 pellets through it and tested the AA 16's again

    AA 16 gr - clean barrel Smallest .45", Largest 1.1", Average .81"

    The DAR does not match the Daystate in overall accuracy, but with the JSB 15.89 pellets it comes close. .73" for the DAR compared to .55" and .61" with the Daystate (average of 5 strings of 5 shots). It may not sound like much of a difference but we know how difficult it is to shave a bit off small groups. So far, the DAR seems a bit more particular about what pellets it likes, but that is not much of a concern once you find its preference and stock up.

    I use an average group size of 1" to determine practical hunting accuracy for small critters. The DAR does that with all the pellets tested and with the JSB's it could be OK to 75 yards. That is respectable for a $300 PCP rifle.

    A few other comments. I prefer the lever loading on the DAR over the bolt on the Daystate. The DAR comes with a shroud so it is a lot quitter. I had to put a moderator ($150) on the Daystate. The trigger on the DAR is not very good. I have adjusted it as best I can without tearing into it and stuffed some Lubriplate into the innards and that helped a lot...but still not a target trigger. Magazines for the DAR are $20, and $100 for the Daystate. Both are easy to handle and not "monsters" like some of the other PCP's

    I have about $5-600 into the DAR and $1600 into the Daystate.

    For plinking at 25 yards, it is difficult to justify spending another $1000 to shrink groups from .45" to .3-.35". The DAR is a winner for that kind of fun. And with most pellets it is an effective small critter getter to 50 yards and a bit more with pellets it likes.

    I will likely set up the DAR as a short range plinker for fun shooting, and training gun for the grandkids using the Crosman pellets that is seems to love. Nice to shoot for $20-25/1000. I will keep working with the Daystate as a critter control gun as it has more potential. Even with premium pellets it will still cost about $40/1000 to shoot it.

    Caution for those not familiar with PCP's. It is easy to overcharge the reservoir and I will not let my 7 year old grandson do it. Also, the lack of noise does not make them appear to be "real" guns but these are not toys. The boards on the pallet I use to mount targets are obliterated using .22 pellets.
    Don Verna

    NRA Endowment Member

  9. #49
    Boolit Master
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    WNY
    Posts
    1,959
    Don, nice write-ups on your findings. I think you’ll find you can squeeze a bit more out of the Daystate when you go to the heavier JSB and heavier AirArms pellets. Mine shoots good with both, but the heavier pellets out perform the lighter ones on a regular basis. Let us know how it goes with further testing.

  10. #50
    Boolit Bub
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Location
    Thomaston, GA
    Posts
    47
    In find my .22 AirForce Condor does best with real heavy pellets like the 25.39 grain JSB Diabolo Exact Monsters.

  11. #51
    Boolit Grand Master


    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Northern Michigan
    Posts
    5,784
    Did some more target work today. Was dealing with 10 mph crosswind so result were not stellar but still acceptable. Range of 50 yards.

    I fired 10 5 shot groups with each pellet listed. Photos should get posted soon. (I have to send them from my phone to my email and then download them from the email. For some reason, it takes a long time for AOL to receive them even though they show as "sent")

    Anyway,

    The JSB Exact 15.89 pellets continue to perform well. Average group was .80" with smallest .62" and largest .96". Previously averaged .58" with smallest .25" and largest .89...under near ideal conditions.

    Next up was the Air Arms Field Diablo. Today they averaged .73", with smallest group of .36" and largest of .97. Previous testing results were average of .68" with smallest of .38 and largest of 1.3.

    Then tried a new pellet. The H&N Baracuda Hunter (18.21 gr). Average was .89 with smallest of .45" and largest of 1.54". I am 90% sure the wind got me on the 1.54" group and if I take that one out, average comes to .82" with the largest of the 9 groups at .93"

    What I have learned....
    First, a good air rifle with good pellets will shoot sub 1" groups at 50 yards consistently. That was my goal and it is easily met with the Daystate using four out of 6 pellets tested so far.

    Second, wind can spoil your day. A 10 mph wind will drift a .22 pellet over 3" at 50 yards. Guessing wrong by 5 mph will cause the shot to be 1.5" out of group.

    Third, I suck at reading wind. The air gun provides great training for learning to deal with wind at long range with a CF rifle. Note: a 10 mph wind will affect a .308 168 gr Match King bullet travelling 2600 fps 3" at 200 yards.

    Today I tried shooting when the wind appeared to be steady as well as waiting for the wind to die down and shoot under calmer conditions. But like mentioned above, getting caught by a 5 mph puff or guessing wrong will not make for a happy ending.

    Looks like my tank will need a top up as I cannot get over 210 bar. That will be fine with the DAR for a bit.
    Don Verna

    NRA Endowment Member

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check