american legacy firearms

[KenH]

I'm curious - I see LOTS of full page ads in American Rifleman (and other places) for commemorative firearms of "collector's value". My question, do any of these limited edition fireames actually increase in value as a true "collector's firearm" would? I see they seem to run in the $2,000 to $3,000 range for rifles.

No, I'm not really looking to place an order - I was reading my latest American Rifleman while waiting for wife to get ready, and got to wondering.

Ken H>

[samari46]

Well Winchester made commemorative lever actions like the Canadian Centennial. In that case you could buy the 20" octagon barreled one. or get the 26" octagon one separately or plunk down the $$$ and get both as a set. Some were made in 5000 limited issues and some were made in more numbers per issue. But they actually did us a favor because the commemorative issues did not sell all that well. Some years back I bought the 20" barreled Canadian Centennial rifle used for cheap at a gun show. Little scuffed up on the receiver and that same exact carbine had problems extracting fired cases. When I mentioned that to the dealer he pulled out a fired case and fed it into the chamber. Sure enough it required more tan what would take to extract the case. So gave me a cut on the price. Funny thing after about 100 rds through it the sticky case problem went away. Few years later Cherry's Fine Guns had the 26" barreled Canadian Centennial brand new in the box. Paid $500 for it and with the longer barrel I get some extra FPS and hangs nicely off hand.Winchester made their commemorative rifles and carbines in a lot of commemorative issues. List is as long as your arm, even did I seem to remember for NASCAR. While I'm only familiar with some of the commemorative issues I wouldn't be at all surprised if the high dollar figure may or may not be due to the limited availability of firearms for sale currently. If you want a good laugh, goggle RTI Royal Tiger Imports and see what they are getting for the firearms they have imported from Ethiopia. And check the listed condition of said firearms then see what they are asking for them.
Frank

[M-Tecs]

You are asking us to predict the future. All we can go by is the past. For the most part they are not a good investment if you are looking to make money, but as history shows, a small percentage will become highly collectable and valuable.

Out of the list of Winchesters most of these would have been a poor investment. In 1982 they made 999 of the Great Western Artist I selling for $2,500. Last year I researched value for a buddy. They were selling for about a $1,000 in perfect condition.

https://winchestercollector.org/winc...ommemoratives/

[KenH]

Thank ya'll for the comments, and past performance is what I was looking for. Just as I was thinking, not very likely to be an investment type of purchase. Perhaps about same odds as a lottery ticket? OR, maybe even less chance of actually increasing in value.

[pietro]

.

The best chance to make a profit on a firearm is to obtain one in excellent condition, preferable with it's original box (SN'd to the gun) & papers for less than half the market value.

All those made as collectibles (like beanie babies or dreamsicles, etc) have value to those interested in that specific item - but not much value to those interested in the gun, but not the story.

They are basically embellish copies of original/discontinued (for the most part) examples of whatever gun.

OTOH, I have enjoyed shooting/hunting with high grade commemoratives because I can own/use a high-grade gun (great wood, engraving, special features, etc) at a fraction of the cost of a gennie (which is a REAL collectible).

As always with guns, evaluate the gun, and not the story (unless the story is historically provable/provenanced).

.

[KenH]

I wasn't really interested in trying to make a profit on one of those rifles, just idle curiosity while reading American Rifleman last night. You've got a good idea there, find one fairly cheap and have the pleasure of shooting a really nice looking rifle (or pistol).

[Norske]

A former neighbor of mine bought a Winchester 92 (list price about $1800) from CDNN for $900. It was chambered 45 LC. But since he didn't have a revolver in that chambering, a bunch of his savings went to the purchase of a Ruger SA 45LC.

[1Hawkeye]

From what I've seen with those collector's pieces they are money pit that you never gain from.

[KenH]

From what I've seen with those collector's pieces they are money pit that you never gain from.

That is what I was thinking when I read the ad in American Rifleman. That is why I decided to ask the question here, to get some real life experiences. I KNEW I was NOT interested in purchasing one.

Again, thanks to all for sharing info and suggestions.

Ken H>

[tai95]

Anything marketed as a collectible will 99% of the time never gain any value. The million dollar comic books are valuable because they were printed on low quality paper and read over and over again. Finding a 70+ year old comic book in off the press condition makes it super rare, hence valuable to some people. Toys, trading cards, coins ect, ect. They were all meant to be used and loved, so finding perfect versions makes then conditionally rare and more valuable.

The marketed collectible items are usually cared for and live in their factory boxes. So theoretically if a limited run of 5000 guns were made, 4500+ are probably still factory perfect. So the rarity is gone, and unless you find that one person who really wants the item you may be lucky to sell it for what you paid for it.

[pietro]

I wasn't really interested in trying to make a profit on one of those rifles, just idle curiosity while reading American Rifleman last night. You've got a good idea there, find one fairly cheap and have the pleasure of shooting a really nice looking rifle (or pistol).

Sometimes, a good deal can be had if you have some trading stock...…..

Remember, dealers and other prospective buyers don't know how much you paid for whatever gun, so...…………..

I've bought guns known to be desirable to others (not me), when I ran across one available for chump change or in a trade for labor or other debt.

I've usually be able to get a 200% return on my cost, when trading it in on a gun that I actually desire.

For instance: buy whatever gun for $300, that usually sells for almost 2x-3x as much, then trade it in against a gun with a $900 price tag, for the donor gun + $200 (+/-).

Go get 'um, pardner !


.

[KenH]

That's one of my weakness for sure - finding a weapon at a fraction of value. Gotta buy it, but then I have such a hard time parting with anything I've got

[Earlwb]

As I see it, the only guns that go up in value are those that belonged to someone who became famous or infamous. Just about all of the other guns wind up losing value over time. There are exceptions for certain ones that gain a following though.

[popper]

About the same as a commemorative hammer. It's a tool.

[Bent Ramrod]

I have heard that even opening the box and disturbing the internal wrapping paper will degrade the “value” of a “Commemorative Collectible.” Not to mention (*shudder!!*) cocking or (*swoon!*) firing the thing.

So if you want to maintain a closet full of heavy cardboard boxes, you have the best chance of realizing a profit on the manufactured collector’s items market.

Especially if you find a mint specimen of the 1974 North Carolina Realtors’ Association Commemorative Winchester .30-30. Just be careful, as Numrich used to sell the Winchester stocks with Commemorative medallions, so some sharp operator could upgrade a mere South Dakota Dental Association Commemorative to a North Carolina Realtors’ Association Commemorative in such a way that only the most knowledgeable appraiser could spot the switch.

I remember reading in one of those “Gun Annual” magazines, that somebody had charted the (alleged) market values of a bunch of Commemoratives after 20 years or so. All, of course, went up in “value,” but the problem with even real collector’s items is that oftentimes that big-bucks Collector is rarer than the Item.