How do the best shooters in the World resize their brass for maximum accuracy?

[M-Tecs]

[BigAlofPa.]

I have always full length sized. Good post.

[Winger Ed.]

I tried neck sizing for awhile, and had a little bit of an issue with sticky chambering, and went away from it.

I got small base dies for the M1A, Garand, and rat gun, but really can't tell any difference with them and standard.

[rbuck351]

Beats me, I'm not one of them.

[onelight]

Well I am no target shooter but that video was a surprise to me I thought all those guys neck sized .
Learned something new.
Thanks for posting it.

[Three44s]

Bolt guns: Lee collet die when available.

In 7 mm TCU I have the Redding body and bushing neck sizer dies but have not used them yet.

In 300 RUM I have a custom Lee Collet die and the Redding body die.

You can say you full length size your bench and F-class loads but when you leave out the fact that (likely) your FL die is custom to your rifle, an off the shelf mass produced FL die is going to have some short comings IMO!

Three44s

[Driver man]

Full length size if you have a perfect chamber etc. I neck size and get better accuracy in my revolvers and military . Full length size in my very tight target 308

[trails4u]

I do wonder about the differences in equipment. I know for my own experiences, with my Tikka T3, neck sizing does seem to improve groups albeit slightly. Are these guys using custom dies? Custom chambers? Chambers and dies made from the same reamers? Most of us don't have access to that level, so I guess I get it for the top shooters in the world, but does it apply to the rest of us trying to shoot factory guns to the best of their abilities? Don't have answers......just questions. But I will continue to neck size for my Tikka...proof is on the paper and in the freezer.

[Winger Ed.]

You can say you full length size your bench and F-class loads but when you leave out the fact that (likely) your FL die is custom to your rifle,

At that level of the game,
I'd suspect a bunch of them have the reloading die cut right after the custom barrel had its chamber cut-- and with the same reamer.

[M-Tecs]

At that level of the game,
I'd suspect a bunch of them have the reloading die cut right after the custom barrel had its chamber cut-- and with the same reamer.

Doesn't work that way. The die would be nothing more than a second chamber. Finishing reamer won't cut a resize die. Sizing die reamers are cut undersize. The die reamer is normally .003" or 004" undersize.

[Iowa Fox]

I started full length sizing in the late 60s. After about the forth loading with my pound in Lee loader I couldn't close the bolt so I knew I had to do something different. I get a chuckle out of Erik Cotinas video, he puts a lot of humor into it. The guys are right on full length sizing. About .002 is the key.

[Half Dog]

My guess is that they don’t use factory rifles or Lee dies.

[lotech]

I full-length size for ARs. For bolt-actions, I size enough so that the bolt closes on a loaded cartridge with slight resistance. This can help considerably with case life. After several loadings, a full-length size will usually be necessary, then you can go back to partial sizing. As for accuracy, I've never seen a difference between partial sizing and full-length sizing. I've used just about every maker's dies including Lee. A good die is a good die regardless of the manufacturer.

[jmorris]

Yeah, full length size with dies made for the chamber, brass must be turned and things are so tight that one can fire, replace the primer, add powder charge and fire the case several time without even sizing at all. Even when resizing there is so little movement occurring that they use tiny little presses to do the sizing.

The details that are not shown by blanket statements.

[M-Tecs]

20 years ago Abor press dies fell out of favor with the benchrest crowd. Today the vast majority are using press mounted dies. Same for the Long range NRA, F-Class, Palma and PRS type shooters it's 99% press mounted with a large percentage using progressive's.

For factory dies Redding neck bushing dies are by far the most common. Forester also have a following as do a variety of Custom dies. These dies match the chambers used for these types of competitions not the other way around. If you want the true custom die makers will build dies to your chamber from the chamber print or a fired case.

That being said I personally know at least a half dozen National Champions that do not use “Pure Custom” dies. They use Redding neck bushing or a off the self custom dies like the Whidden's that are dimensioned so the "Die Dimensions well-matched to PT&G reamers used for match chambers". I know two that use true custom dies that are built to their chamber specs. They have about $600 into their FL sizing die. They are Warner Tool FL dies. The Whiddens are more cost effective but I don't know anyone using them.

Good example here and John Whiddens thoughts:

https://www.accurateshooter.com/gear...meter-seaters/

John Whidden Talks about Sizers, Seaters, and Expanders

Whidden Gunworks Sizing Die SeaterThere are two sides to our die business. First we are stocking dies in many calibers that are of interest to those who visit this website (such as the 6PPC, 6mm Dasher, 6.5×47 Lapua, .260 Rem, 7mm Shehane, .308 Winchester). These dies are a good fit to the “match chamber” reamers and very few people with these calibers should have to have “Pure Custom” dies made. We have both sizers and micrometer-top seaters ready to go for the many cartridge types listed above. The sizer dies will include a shoulder datum collar that makes it easy to measure shoulder “bump” during the full-length sizing process. This is important to control headspace precisely.

On the “Pure Custom” side, we have a huge amount of flexibility. We can make one-of-a-kind sizers and seaters for wildcats in a short period of time and at an excellent price. We can work with the customer to make full-length sizers, neck sizers, shoulder bump dies, small base dies, or most anything else they can need. We can of course provide micrometer-top seaters for these cartridges as well. We can make non-bushing sizers with specific neck inside diameters tailored to customer specifications.

We will also be offering custom-sized expanders. These expanders will fit our dies as well as Redding dies. Our tapered expanders will be available in .0005” (one-half thousandth) increments for the common calibers. In our shop we have had excellent results using expanders in the dies as long as the expanders provided the correct amount of neck tension and didn’t overwork the brass. Expanders have gotten a bad reputation in recent years but we find them to be excellent tools when the same precision is applied to their use that careful handloaders apply to the rest of their process. Expanders can be most valuable for those who choose not to neck-turn their brass (because the expander pushes neckwall variations to the outside).

One last thing — many gunsmiths with their own wildcats (or “specialty” chambers) have asked us to provide dies for their customers. We gladly do batches of custom dies and encourage gunsmiths to contact us. — John Whidden

For more information visit WhiddenGunworks.com or call (229) 686-1911.

[onelight]

Doesn't work that way. The die would be nothing more than a second chamber. Finishing reamer won't cut a resize die. Sizing die reamers are cut undersize. The die reamer is normally .003" or 004" undersize.

Yup a couple of them said they size .002 under chamber size .

[Winger Ed.]

Doesn't work that way. The die would be nothing more than a second chamber. Finishing reamer won't cut a resize die. Sizing die reamers are cut undersize. The die reamer is normally .003" or 004" undersize.

That selling point may have been one of those flash in the pan ideas that didn't catch on.

Years ago, I was checking into getting a high end bench rest rifle built.
That's how I learned how horribly expensive they can be too.
One or more of the builders advertised they made the sizing die at the same time they made/fitted the barrel.

With Hornady and others offering custom die services, I guess the concept of the barrel maker doing it went away.

[M-Tecs]

That selling point may have been one of those flash in the pan ideas that didn't catch on.

Years ago, I was checking into getting a high end bench rest rifle built.
That's how I learned how horribly expensive they can be too.
One or more of the builders advertised they made the sizing die at the same time they made/fitted the barrel.

With Hornady and others offering custom die services, I guess the concept of the barrel maker doing it went away.

There are a couple of steels alloys that shrink when heat treated. It sometimes works and sometimes the shrinkage is not enough. That was most for the home builders.

I believe what your are referring to is these makers would have a resizing die reamer made with the chamber reamer. It was a two reamer set That was very common. Not sure how common it still is. PTG doesn't offer that as a standard service anymore.

[M-Tecs]

Yup a couple of them said they sizer .002 under chamber size .

Warner Tool is the tightest I am aware of. https://www.warner-tool.com/reloading-dies/

"WTC Dies are made from samples of your fired brass to full length size only .001 to .0015″ on the body diameter and just enough on the necks to get 30, 40, or even 50 reloads from your brass (neck annealing required)."

Keep in mind that is on fired brass that has some spring back. The issue of case life is very doable with mild loads. Warmer loads the primer pock goes first and most of the long range competitors tend to run warmer loads since that game is mostly won or lost on wind reading or lack of wind reading abilitily.

[Murphy]

I have RCBS Precision Case Mic's for my rifles. I go with .002 thousandths and a small base sizer. It's been working for me for over 20 years. I'm not a precision shooter, but I like knowing I have the most precision cartridge I can get in the rifle I'm using.

My go to hunting rifle is a Remington Model 7 in 7-08 I bought back in the late 90's. Once I found 'The Load' for it, I loaded up a 100 round lot. That rifle has never missed, I do. Year after year, when I prepare for deer season I head to the range. I make sure the bore is clean, paste a 1" target dot at a 100 yards and sit down at the bench and take the shot. Year after year, it's always did what I asked and scored a hit on the dot.

Erik Cotinas, he's a great one to watch. I wish more Youtube videos were as well done as his.


Murphy