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Thread: 30 carbine and hunting deer?

  1. #61
    Boolit Man
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    The 30 carbine certanly works on killing feral goats and pigs in the island of Maui. Easy to carry and can handle harsh conditons. And they cost about $50.00 in the mid seventies.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by NWPilgrim View Post
    What? .35 or greater south of the line? Never heard of such a limit. What are the popular calibers there? .35 Whelen? .45-70? That seems an odd limit. Do you know the reasoning behind that?

    Learned something new today!
    South of the "Restricted Firearms Line" (which we used to call the "Shotgun Zone") Michigan now allows rifles with straight-walled cartridges 35 cal or larger with a case length minimum 1.16" and maximum 1.80". Therefore, .30 carbine is excluded. .450 Bushmaster and .350 Legend have become super popular in this area now. Like Lloyd said above, it's about the higher population in the area and trying to keep bullets from carrying too far and hitting a house (which happens once every couple years). A lot of farm country there but I've hunted areas south of the line where the grapevines, locust and buckthorn are so thick you'd be better off with a pistol- stands where the maximum shot is <30 yards. Just the kind of spots that deer head to when the shooting starts.

    I've hunted all three Zones in Michigan and the longest shot I've taken in my life I made this year with a muzzleloader- 153 yards. That shot was at our camp in the Northern Lower (north of the "line") down a shooting lane I'd cleared with a chainsaw. In pretty much all areas of Michigan, if you're not hunting a farm field the only way you'll be able to make a clear 200 yard shot is shooting across a lake. My daughter's ex-boyfriend was from Wyoming. He said all the trees here made him feel claustrophobic! LOL

    Want to know something really silly? The restriction only applies to firearm deer season. South of the Line on private land and in State Game areas I can hunt coyotes in the daytime with a 50 BMG and at night I can use up to 6.5mm. Go figure....
    Last edited by Beaverhunter2; 03-05-2021 at 12:07 AM.

  3. #63
    Boolit Master
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    My hunting buddy Montana Pistol Hunter has killed a trainload of Central Texas whitetails with a .32 flint rifle and a .36 Navy, and almost that many with a baby rolling block in .38 SPL. Paco Kelly writes about killing scads of deer with a series of .32-20s. My latest woods-walking pair is a Browning B53 and a 4" S&W M1905 in .32-20 and I'm confident in handling whatever I encounter. One of my sons killed his first deer with my hot-rodded M1 Carbine and a handload with the Hornady 110 grain JHP, with both my hunting buddy and myself jammed into the little ground blind micromanaging him and ensuring that he was shooting the designated cull spike. And until I could berate my then-agency into providing us with M4s, that Carbine with the Remington 110 JSP was my entry- and building-search- rifle and I was never undergunned. As many will say, it's the equivalent of a 110 gr .357 Magnum. When I found another one at an estate sale for a good price, I snapped it up and hot-rodded it as well. These two M1 Carbines still serve as the front- and back-door "estate rifles" here, and get warmed up at the range "right regular".
    Yeah, I'm a fan and so is SWMBO. So are all my sons, three of whom are combat veterans.
    Use a quality cup-and-core 110 grain bullet over H110/296 or LilGun and have Pops shoot enough of it to be competent and confident. Just to reassure him and yourself, do a couple of water-jug splats with it and you'll see it has plenty of torque for the job.
    Ed <><

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old School Big Bore View Post
    My hunting buddy Montana Pistol Hunter has killed a trainload of Central Texas whitetails with a .32 flint rifle and a .36 Navy, and almost that many with a baby rolling block in .38 SPL. Paco Kelly writes about killing scads of deer with a series of .32-20s. My latest woods-walking pair is a Browning B53 and a 4" S&W M1905 in .32-20 and I'm confident in handling whatever I encounter. One of my sons killed his first deer with my hot-rodded M1 Carbine and a handload with the Hornady 110 grain JHP, with both my hunting buddy and myself jammed into the little ground blind micromanaging him and ensuring that he was shooting the designated cull spike. And until I could berate my then-agency into providing us with M4s, that Carbine with the Remington 110 JSP was my entry- and building-search- rifle and I was never undergunned. As many will say, it's the equivalent of a 110 gr .357 Magnum. When I found another one at an estate sale for a good price, I snapped it up and hot-rodded it as well. These two M1 Carbines still serve as the front- and back-door "estate rifles" here, and get warmed up at the range "right regular".
    Yeah, I'm a fan and so is SWMBO. So are all my sons, three of whom are combat veterans.
    Use a quality cup-and-core 110 grain bullet over H110/296 or LilGun and have Pops shoot enough of it to be competent and confident. Just to reassure him and yourself, do a couple of water-jug splats with it and you'll see it has plenty of torque for the job.
    Ed <><
    Hi Ed!

    Would you share more details on your "hot-rodding"?

    Thanks!

    John

  5. #65
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    I am also interested in hearing what 'hot rodding' an M1 carbine means.

  6. #66
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    Dale & BeaverHunter - I don't want to hijack the thread but I guess it's germane...
    I should point out that both these Carbines are SHOOTERS, not "collectors", and that I don't have and won't tolerate any safe queens - firearms are meant to be fired, and all of mine are regularly and respectfully warmed up. As close as some of them are to being "works of art", they are first and foremost TOOLS and since they are MY tools, I will modify them as I wish.
    The first thing I did to 'em was to feel my way down the bore with a tight patch (I don't have a bore camera). I suspect that most of the stories you hear about inaccurate .30 Carbines are due to the heat-shrunk gas block making a tight spot in the bore. If a bullet gets swaged down there, it's not gonna recover in the rest of the barrel, and that rifle will most likely never group well. If your Carbine has that tight spot, you can lap it away in the classic manner. Luckily, neither of mine needed lapping.
    Both of them did, however, come to me in stocks that had become oil-soaked over the years. The wood came off and the fixed, not folding, Choate synthetic stocks went on. While I was fitting the stocks, the issue bayonet-lug front bands were replaced by the non-lugged type, and the left-side sling loops were replaced by simple spacers. I drilled the toe of the stock for a sling-swivel stud, and attached a pair of studs to the underline of the fore-end, reinforced with heavy washers in the op rod inletting area. Now the little rifle is not only bipod-capable but works with a no-fooling, actual-factual-for-real shooting sling as well. Next addition was the Ultimak railed upper handguard, because optics. In the past I have tried several versions of the type of scope mount that bolts to a threaded wedge in the rear sight dovetail. THEY DO NOT WORK. That one little screw is not going to support the weight of any scope. I did have minor success after sawing one of the mounts down to basically a one-slot pic mount, and it survived with a very lightweight red dot, but then I no longer had backup irons, and that reaffirmed the dovetail mount as a Bad Idea. Both of the guns wear a small, light red dot on a QD mount, and the irons and dot are both zeroed with the same ammo. One of the guns got a Williams rear sight bolted on; the other soldiers on with the issue rear sight. Both needed new front sights, apparently after previous owners had needlessly shortened/narrowed the originals. Both were also treated to rebuild spring kits and judicious polishing of their feed ramps and other parts as needed. The Remington 110 ball and JSP, and my ball and JHP handloads, all shoot into the same group.
    When I "butchered" the first Carbine, I was the Operations NCO at the TXARNG SARTS and the appearance of the unforgivably Bubba'd little rifle was the target of much derision. Once you've heard "WALNUT AND STEEL WALNUT AND STEEL WALNUT AND STEEL" screeched at you from every inhabitant of billets, shop and range over an entire weekend, you kinda get the idea. BUT when we were whanging on some "E" Iron Mikes at the 300 yard line of the Camp Swift KD range on that same trip, and I got prone/bipod with the little gem, the hidebound jeering purists suddenly got interested, because I ran off a 30 round mag at just about cyclic, with all rounds clanging satisfyingly in the middle of the silhouette. Squad Automatic Carbine, anyone? Everyone wanted to shoot it, and did.
    That was the Carbine used by my youngest son to bag that first TX Hill Country spike, and which rode in my patrol unit until supplanted by a series of M4s, sometimes my .44 B92, and finally my shorty AR10 which I call an M5.
    If you got a chuckle out of this, you should have heard my fellow shooters when they saw my "modernized" Garand....
    Ed <><

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by smkummer View Post
    I am not adding anything new here but Winchester originally advertised the 32-20 as a deer cartridge. While they don’t do that anymore, the 30 carbine has about twice the energy. Many cast bullets will work for both 32-20 and sized properly work in the 30 carbine.
    I remember a story from N. Dakota deer hunting. Sometimes hunters wanted a deer no matter what so they would hunt to fill tags, even though I believe that was illegal. Anyway, a group of 4 hunters went hunting with the hunter carrying a 30 carbine first to come upon a herd of deer at close enough range. I don’t know how many shots ( he was limited to a 8 round mag.) but killed 4 deer very soon after the season opened. Most ND deer are well fed and of good size. The rest of the story was the other hunters were a little upset that they barely started the season and it was over.
    Another current ND hunter swears by his Remington 222 as a deer killer. I cringe at using a 50 grain 222 bullet.
    There was a guy in our gun club when I was growing up who was about the same age as my Dad. He farmed and basically only used one rifle, a Remington 722 in .222 he had bought as a very young man when they first came out and put a top of the line Zeiss scope on it, must have cost a young famer deerly to get that rifle. Anyway, he pretty much lived outside in the state with the longest and most generous deer season in the US and had a ton of shot opportunities at deer and the patience and steady nerves to wait for perfect shots. He was a very good shooter under field conditions and killed dozens a year to feed the family, always at he base of the skull and never had one that wasn't DRT, if he squeezed the trigger, the deer was as good as instant dead.

  8. #68
    Boolit Buddy Prairie Cowboy's Avatar
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    As a younger man back in the early 80s, I was able to consistently hit pop cans with my .30 carbine at 50 yards offhand, and to cluster all of my shots into a small paper pie plate at 100 yards. So, practical accuracy is not a problem if you have learned proper shooting skills.

    I would think that it would make an effective 75 yard whitetail deer rifle if you can hit where you shoot. People do kill whitetails with standard velocity .44-40 and .45 Colt factory loads from their carbines.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prairie Cowboy View Post
    As a younger man back in the early 80s, I was able to consistently hit pop cans with my .30 carbine at 50 yards offhand, and to cluster all of my shots into a small paper pie plate at 100 yards. So, practical accuracy is not a problem if you have learned proper shooting skills.

    I would think that it would make an effective 75 yard whitetail deer rifle if you can hit where you shoot. People do kill whitetails with standard velocity .44-40 and .45 Colt factory loads from their carbines.
    Your comment on .44-40 reminded me of a statement a writer made in a review of the cartridge that I read- "The .44-40 has probably killed more game (big and small) and more people (good and bad) than any other cartridge in the country." Today most folks would look at a rifle with a 200gr bullet at 1200fps and think "popgun". At one time it was the most popular cartridge in the US.

    Bullet placement (with sufficient penetration) beats kinetic energy nearly every time. The same thing would apply to .30 Carbine.

  10. #70
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    My uncle in the interior of British Columbia was a logger who carried a huge chain saw and was a faller. During hunting season while he was in the bush he slung a m1 carbine over his off shoulder he harvested deer and elk yearly don’t know of the caliber of legality he really didn’t care unfortunately after he pasted his firearms were sold off before I had a chance to get ahold of any of them I would have loved to get that m1 carbine I did get to shoot it a few times it was a GM model if I remember correctly


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gundogx2 View Post
    My uncle in the interior of British Columbia was a logger who carried a huge chain saw and was a faller. During hunting season while he was in the bush he slung a m1 carbine over his off shoulder he harvested deer and elk yearly don’t know of the caliber of legality he really didn’t care unfortunately after he pasted his firearms were sold off before I had a chance to get ahold of any of them I would have loved to get that m1 carbine I did get to shoot it a few times it was a GM model if I remember correctly


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    And that was what the M-1 Carbine was really developed for; an easy to carry light rifle that was more effective than a pistol, for people whose primary job is not infantry.

    Robert

  12. #72
    Boolit Man MOshooter's Avatar
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    30 carbine was the first rifle I started hunting whitetail with, and took my first 2 deer with the M1 Carbine back in the early 70's.
    30 Carbine will definitely kill deer with proper bullet placement.

  13. #73
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    "Wounding Doctrine" was nothing more than an attempt to justify the adoption of smaller bullets. A search of The Mighty Internet will turn up hundreds of stories of soldiers on all sides who were wounded by by larger/more powerful cartridges and continued to fight.
    7.62x39 is thought to be a fantastic medium game cartridge but I personally knew a former helicopter pilot who took nine of those bullets when he was shot down (he has since passed on). He told me if his buddies hadn't cared for him he never would have made it to the prison camp because the NVA weren't interested in providing first aid to Americans. Is it good enough for deer? Sure it is.
    30 M1 has the ballistic performance to do the job but it can't make up for poor marksmanship.
    Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.

  14. #74
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    With a FN 120 grain cast the carbine M1 cartridge makes a very effective 50 yard yote round.
    If all I had was our Inland sure I would brain or spine shoot corn crunchers up close under 50 yards.
    But I will prefer other more powerful cartridges to include caliber .54 and up flinters as I have no desire to be using the minimum gun just to see if I can.
    "Come unto Me, all you who labor and are heavy burdened, and I will give you rest." Matthew 11:28
    Male Guanaco out in dry lakebed at 10,800 feet south of Arequipa.

  15. #75
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    First CF rifle I shot was a M1 Carbine back around ‘63, maybe ‘64. At the time a fella I knew was whacking hogs and a few deer with the M1 using issue ammo. This was on Guam and he was a USAF Sgt. So, there are better cartridges and guns, but it does not mean the M1 is inadequate.

    A very few years later I fired my second CF rifle courtesy of the Army. Still don’t care much for the M14 but the cartridge is fine. #3 was the M16, used in self defense about a week after it was issued. My thought at the time was that it was sure ‘nuff a dinky little round. Well, here’s a list of what I saw it kill, and I’ll toss in a report on some other cartridges just because too many folks worry about FPS/FPE than placement.

    M-16; people, monkeys, deer, hogs, water buffalo, elephant (1 shot and that bet cost me a case of beer)
    1911 Colt; hogs, water buffalo on the run, one shot
    S&W .38 Spcl; 3 NVA. That were poking my flight school buddy in the butt when he regained consciousness after crashing and being ejected from the chopper. 3 shots followed by a severe hangover the following morning.

    Back in the states and retired I wound up doing volunteer work for the state in effort to eradicate feral hogs on a coastal island for about 15 years. 95% of the 200+ hogs killed to date were put down within the first 3 years, and all them were killed with .22 RF. I used CCI CB shorts for the most part and only had to shoot one of the first hundred or so a second time.

    A fella needs to do what he can with what he can use. Success or failure is likely bettered determined by hunting and shooting skills than debate about ballistic characteristics.

  16. #76
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    Have a 43 Inland around here in something protecting it? Haven't shot the thing in years.

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by JSnover View Post
    "Wounding Doctrine" was nothing more than an attempt to justify the adoption of smaller bullets. A search of The Mighty Internet will turn up hundreds of stories of soldiers on all sides who were wounded by by larger/more powerful cartridges and continued to fight.
    7.62x39 is thought to be a fantastic medium game cartridge but I personally knew a former helicopter pilot who took nine of those bullets when he was shot down (he has since passed on). He told me if his buddies hadn't cared for him he never would have made it to the prison camp because the NVA weren't interested in providing first aid to Americans. Is it good enough for deer? Sure it is.
    30 M1 has the ballistic performance to do the job but it can't make up for poor marksmanship.
    https://www.businessinsider.com/ak-4...-an-m4-2015-12 My buddies daughters moose dropped dead after 3 /123gr SP's from a CZ 527 7.62x39.The last two rds weren't really needed.Two rds exited broadside at 75 yards.One found nicely mushroomed.

  18. #78
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    Many, many years back I was in a 'dog' hunt club wherein both the latter and horses were utilized. One of the old fella's had a .30 carbine that he'd apparently 'liberated' from his time in service, even had a leather military scabbard as an accessory........only problem was that since he was on horseback, when he yanked that piece from its carrier he 'tripped the switch'.......you see, his liberated piece was an M-2 model and so marked!...........he solved that problem by literally breaking off the selector with pliers! And no, I do not know if or not it was papered, frankly I doubt it, but it wasn't any of my business and other than enjoying listening to his amusing diatribe about never being able to get off a 'good' second shot it made little little difference to me. So much for the value of automatic fire!

    For what it's worth, that old man killed a bunch of deer, usually with a single shot and the ammo I saw in use was FMJ military stuff......looked as old as the man using it! Worked good on hogs as well.
    Last edited by dogrunner; 05-07-2021 at 02:51 PM.

  19. #79
    Boolit Grand Master Char-Gar's Avatar
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    Back in the early 60s, when the DCM was selling the M1Carbines for very little money, I got one. It was a very good shape Rock-Ola. I never shot a deer with it, but several others did. I keep it as a loaner. I loaded a 110 Hornady Spire Point, but I would have to look up the powder charge. Three or four deer fell to the little carbine and my handloads. I am certain there are better deer rifles, but the little carbine will do the job.
    Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pioneer2 View Post
    https://www.businessinsider.com/ak-4...-an-m4-2015-12 My buddies daughters moose dropped dead after 3 /123gr SP's from a CZ 527 7.62x39.The last two rds weren't really needed.Two rds exited broadside at 75 yards.One found nicely mushroomed.
    I got nothing against the 7.62x39, I think it's generally more effective against humans, since we usually don't weigh as much medium-sized game animals and our hides are fairly thin. It is an effective cartridge but it has the same limitation as any other: shot placement matters. If it was a Totally Awesome Stone Cold Killer my deceased friend would not have lived to tell me his story. Had he been shot nine times with a 30 M1 Carbine the results might have been identical but either of those cartridges are still adequate for deer.
    Warning: I know Judo. If you force me to prove it I'll shoot you.

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