Spencer rifle receiver

[trenches]

First off it's been a long time since I posted here. Been busy building rifles. Still shooting black powder rifles. Latest was a Gras Mle 1874 in 11mm. Bought a barreled receiver from Century, scrounged the bolt parts, the trigger, and then made the stock. And a fold away rear sight.
But now I'm attempting a Spencer rifle build. I have to make one as I can't afford almost $2000 for a repro.
I bought a lower block from S&S Firearms and repro hammer. I have a Green Mountain .500 S&W barrel blank. Since I have a Handi Rifle in that caliber I have the brass and dies. I intend to trim the brass to about the same length as a .45 Colt. And of course use BP and lead bullets.
My intention is to make the receiver. And the other parts. I just happen to have a SB 405 lathe and a mill.
One thing I need to know is the width of the receiver. I've been looking all over for any specs on a Spencer and they're are as rare as hens' teeth.
So I was hoping one of you guys might have a Spencer and could give me some measurements.
I did think of going 56-50 but as funds are a bit scarce I'm going with what I have right now.
Oh, and I have figured out the way to make that inside radius in the receiver by using a rotary table mounted vertically on the mill table. Just in case anyone asks.
I would appreciate any help you can give me.
Thanks.

[cub45]

Could you look up the patent drawings for what you need?

[trenches]

can't seem to find them. I've looked.

[john.k]

Patent drawings dont have dimensions....I recall that quite recently on another forum(or this one?) someone gave a website for CW gun plans....I think in respect of a Gibbs carbine?

[Wayne Smith]

You might want to check with the Smithsonian - at one time they had over 100 Spencers in a room with just a cable through the trigger guards. I was 19 at the time, now 67 so it was a while ago. But I don't think they ever 'get rid' of anything!

[trenches]

I don't think they do either.

[elk hunter]

I checked Marcot's book on the Spencer, no dimensioned drawings.

[ndnchf]

The receiver on my M1865 Spencer receiver is 1.110" wide plus/minus .010" depending on where I measure it. Have you checked out the Spencer forum on CASCITY? A lot of great info there.

[trenches]

Yes I have but couldn't find the info I needed.
Thanks for the dimension. Could I bother you for the length?
right now I'm working up a drawing using the lower block laid against a drawing of the receiver on my computer. I enlarge the picture until the lower matches the drawing.
You might say I'm reverse engineering the Spencer.
Found some parts left over from a French fusil de chasse I built years ago. Or was it the Howdah pistol I made in.45 Colt.
For that guy I made the entire pistol except for the barrels. I used a 12ga barrel breech for the barrel installation. But made the receiver from 4140 PH. Took almost a year to build. Lots and lots of machine work.
I was going to make it in .577" but ran into the no pistol bore over .501" rule. Even had 2 .577 short barrels to use. One of them I gave to a friend to make a horse pistol. It's bit of a gray area because of the commonly available rule but I didn't want to poke the bear.
Any other dimension you could give me will be greatly appreciated.
This will basically be a scratch built project. Something I'm known for over at WG. LOL.

[ndnchf]

Length is not so easy to measure because it is not a square or rectangle. But I get 5.250" from the front face to a line perpendicular to where the stock meets the upper rear edge of the receiver.

[ndnchf]

BTW, Mine is a US model 1871 Springfield Spencer rifle, made from a M1865 Spencer carbine.

[redneck1]

I haven't been on w-g for a very long time ...
I can't quite remember the members id but it might be nevadablu or something similar .
Anyhoo some one there built a spencer , I believe they did it in two halves and welded it .

Wish I was more help

[trenches]

I lucked out. Found a stripped 1860 Spencer receiver at Lodgewood. Needless to say, I bought it. Sure makes building this rifle a whole lot easier. And the price was right.
Yeah, I know Nevada Blue. I named a top magazine fed AK after him. LOL he gave me the idea after I stopped working on belt fed AK. Hated to ruin a perfectly good MG-42 top cover and feed tray.
My name over there is trenches.
But lately I can't get on as the site was moved because of well let's just say circumstances. I put in my username but I forgot my password. I'll have to try again. I've been a member there almost since they started.
And thank you very much guys for all your help.
Once I figure out how to post pictures I will.

[redneck1]

Well if you've been there from the start then you know why I've been banned , I'm still waiting on my grease gun or the large sum of money jestis owes .....

Anyhoo , when you get your receiver share some dimensions

[trenches]

Don't mention that guy to me. He screwed me on a PKM barrel.
In any case when I get the receiver I'll definitely post dimensions.
Now I have to learn how to cut square threads as I understand that the threads are square. Like those on a 1903. This should be fun.
But I watched a video where the guy showed how to do that. After he cut the threads he ran the test piece into a 1903 receiver.

[redneck1]

Square threads aren't all that difficult in theory , a very rigid lathe helps a whole bunch .
If your using the original receiver I guess you'll have no choice . but if your going to make your own , well you can do as you please

When you get that far let me know if you have any problems grinding a tool , I have a single lip tool grinder that makes life a bit easier .

[trenches]

I will do that. Not much experience on grinding tool bits. I use carbide inserts. i've been reading how to do that in the SB "How to Run a Lathe" book I have. trying to wrap my head around how to make one.
I'm thinking of making a "chamber" case of the receiver threads. I don't have cerrosafe. Maybe I should get some. We used that at the shop when I was the gunsmith there. Guy brought in an old Indian owned Sharps that he wasn't sure what the chamber was. So we did a chamber cast. Turned out it was 50-70. Was a very interesting rifle. He bought it out west.
Also was thinking of using acraglas. Coat the threads with release agent and then stick some acraglas in.
Just bought some cerrosafe on ebay. $20 with the shipping. Cheaper than Brownells.

[redneck1]

That isn't a bad idea using cerrosafe , worst that can happen is you need to melt it back out .

Grinding HSS isn't all that difficult , most mechanically inclined people can pick up on it within a couple tries . you'd also be surprised at how less then perfect you can get away with with a bit of honing .
A good wheel that is properly dressed is a big part of getting good results.

[elk hunter]

Trenches;

It's shame you're not closer to my location I'd have you bring the barrel and receiver over and have you cut the threads using my lathe and threading tool while I watched and supervised. Square threads are not difficult to cut but the compound is set to feed straight into the cut not at an angle like V threads. The threading tool must have relief on the front and both sides and must be the exact width of the thread plus there is a specific angle/side rake for each thread size so the tool doesn't drag on the sides of the thread. Cutting square threads is not difficult just a little different than V threads. I would suggest practicing on a piece of round stock until you're sure about how to do it. Depending on the caliber you choose a chamber reamer may be difficult to find. I assume you're going to make it centerfire. If so you can buy a breech block ready made or if you're up to the challenge make one yourself. I re-barreled my 1860 carbine and chambered it in 56-50 centerfire rather than the original 56-56 as I had a 50 caliber barrel plus dies and bullet moulds were readily available. I had to make the breech block and the chamber reamer.

Keep us posted on your progress and pictures, pictures, pictures.

Good luck.

[trenches]

Been a while.
Bought a breech block from S&S. Square threading tool bits from Brownells. And a10tpi change gear from MRO Supply. as soon as the gear gets here I'll be practicing on a piece of 1" round stock. As far as caliber I'm going outside the box as it were. I have plenty of .500 S&W cases. and a Green Mountain .501 barrel. I already made a dummy round.
I'm going to trim the .500 S&W cases back to the length of a 56-50. I bought a .501" 350 gr bullet mold from Accurate Molds.
Also been gathering parts from S&S and Lodgewood. No butt stocks to be found anywhere. The guy who made the stocks for S&S retired. Allergic to walnut dust.
However I got to thinking. Talyors & Company sells the repros and parts. So I ordered a stock from them. One of their guys called me to tell me that the stock description was inaccurate. It is only a rough stock. No parts on it. I told him that's great as that is exactly what I want. While I was at it I ordered a lever. Another part that is unobtainium.
I repaired the receiver. Silver soldered a new piece to it and threaded it 14-24 threads. It's holding up well.
So this build is coming along ok. I still have parts to get for it.
Some parts I'll buy and some I'll make.