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Thread: Converting a .38 Special to .41 Long Colt?

  1. #21
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by contender1 View Post
    MrWolf,, a Ruger Blackhawk is a single-action revolver,, the OP is wanting to do this in a double action design. DIfferent revolver designs.

    For the OP.
    I would look LONG & HARD at the cylinder, with attention to the chamber wall thickness. Specifically,, the latch notches. That's the thin section of a chamber.
    When stuff like this gets discussed,, I often ask; "What about the future? Who's kids are going to inherit this gun & what loads will they use in it? Who's going to be liable,, or better yet,, who's kids are going to get injured or killed?"

    I recently found a different, kinda new gun forum. Seeing all the new, uneducated gun owners comments is SCARY. Some of the things I see people posting about what they do where handloading is concerned,, or what they want to do to firearms,, makes me think we'll be seeing all kinds of firearm related injuries & even deaths in the next few years.

    There are reasons custom gunsmiths like Clements, Linebaugh, Bowen, Tyler, Gallagher, and many other KNOWLEDGEABLE smiths won't do certain things.

    I teach shooting, reloading, & hunter safety. One of my teaching aids is a blown up Ruger Super Blackhawk in 44 magnum. The cylinder has 2 chambers blown apart. One still has part of the brass stuck in it. The topstrap has buckled upwards enough to be completely broken through. But the best part is one chamber SHOWS the thin walls where the latch notch is/was.

    If you persist in your idea of using a Colt,, here's what I'd do.
    Using PIN gauges,, check the internal diameter of each chamber. Next,, using a pin head depth micrometer,, check the depth of each cylinder notch. Follow that with a measurement of the wall thickness of each chamber on the outer edge.
    Using those 3 dimensions,, you can get an idea as to the chamber wall thickness under the notches.
    Then subtract 1/2 of the diameter needed to get the chambering you desire. That will give you the amount of wall thickness left.

    Lastly,,, look up the highest SAMMI specs for .41 Long Colt in relation to pressure.

    Then ask yourself; "Can this be done safely for my kids to enjoy?"
    Ah, you bring to mind something I saw many years back...many. In roughly '66 I happened to step into a gun shop a friend owned........heard some serious hammering in the back room so I went in...found my good buddy, (incidentally a North Carolinian) beating hell out of a super black hawk's top frame in a heavy duty vise. asked what the devil was going on and he tossed me the unfluted cylinder of that revolver........missing three chambers!....Said some dumb *** had brought it in, wanted it working and he was trying to do that! Said he'd pulled the remaining rounds in that cylinder and they were stuffed with what he thought was bullseye.....stuffed under a 250 JHP....cylinder apparently went on the first round up.

    Told him if it was me I'd call the fool that blew it and have him pick it up.....Think he did, never heard any more about it,

    One can talk and teach safety all one wants, but one cannot educate a fool!

  2. #22
    Boolit Mold
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    That will not clean up. The 38/40 is as large at the base as a 44/40. Much larger than the 41 Colt.

  3. #23
    Boolit Buddy
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    Quote Originally Posted by StrawHat View Post
    One of the fellows that supplies and fits conversion cylinders for C&B revolvers does this conversion using a 38 S&W Special cylinder and the .380ish barrel of an 1851 or 1861 Colt clone. He rechambers the cylinder and throats the barrel for the larger boolit.

    Kevin
    This is what I ended up doing. I am sacrificing a new Pietta 1851 reproduction, and having a Kirst .38 Special gated Konverter added and rechambered. Since I only use the .386" soft lead bullets to load .41 colt anyway, it should be fine. I actually saw an original 1861 Colt manufactured in 1868 on Gunbroker with a nearly identical conversion that was likely done in the late 1800s. So it seems like it will work. And hell, it is yet another excuse for me to get back into Cowboy shooting.

    -Mb

  4. #24
    Boolit Master Jim22's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by contender1 View Post

    For the OP.
    I would look LONG & HARD at the cylinder, with attention to the chamber wall thickness. Specifically,, the latch notches. That's the thin section of a chamber.
    It is for this reason, the thin spot over the chamber of a six round revolver cylinder, that I would suggest a five round revolver. In most cases the latch notches are between cylinders. Wikipedia says that the .41 Long Colt was loaded with .386" diameter boolits. They further say that Colt put .38-40 barrels on their revolvers with .400-.401" groove diameters.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.41_Long_Colt

    That does not sound like a recipe for accuracy. Starline makes brass but, of course it is out of stock.

    https://www.starlinebrass.com/41-colt-brass

    I wonder where you would acquire a barrel that would match boolit size?

    Chuck Hawk has a piece on the gun and cartridge:

    https://www.chuckhawks.com/41_LC.htm

    With the boolit diameter of .386" and the .357" diameter of the .38 Special boolit it seems that the difference is less than .030" or .015" reduction in chamber wall thickness at the thinnest part. That could be too much in a six round cylinder with the cylinder stop notch directly over the chamber but mebbe not with a five shot cylinder.

    Have fun and stay safe. I think I would be happier with a .41 revolver with the correct bore diameter than one of the originals.

  5. #25
    Boolit Master
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    Quote Originally Posted by gun toting monkeyboy View Post
    This is what I ended up doing. I am sacrificing a new Pietta 1851 reproduction, and having a Kirst .38 Special gated Konverter added and rechambered. Since I only use the .386" soft lead bullets to load .41 colt anyway, it should be fine. I actually saw an original 1861 Colt manufactured in 1868 on Gunbroker with a nearly identical conversion that was likely done in the late 1800s. So it seems like it will work. And hell, it is yet another excuse for me to get back into Cowboy shooting.

    -Mb
    Mb,

    Glad to hear you were able to bring this to fruition. I like the idea of the 41 Colt but I prefer N frames. Your conversion should right in with CAS! What will your second revolver be?

    Kevin
    Knowledge I take to my grave is wasted.

    I prefer to use cartridges born before I was.

    Success doesn't make me happy, being happy is what allows me to be successful.

  6. #26
    Boolit Grand Master

    Wayne Smith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim22 View Post
    It is for this reason, the thin spot over the chamber of a six round revolver cylinder, that I would suggest a five round revolver. In most cases the latch notches are between cylinders. Wikipedia says that the .41 Long Colt was loaded with .386" diameter boolits. They further say that Colt put .38-40 barrels on their revolvers with .400-.401" groove diameters.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.41_Long_Colt

    That does not sound like a recipe for accuracy. Starline makes brass but, of course it is out of stock.

    https://www.starlinebrass.com/41-colt-brass

    I wonder where you would acquire a barrel that would match boolit size?

    Chuck Hawk has a piece on the gun and cartridge:

    https://www.chuckhawks.com/41_LC.htm

    With the boolit diameter of .386" and the .357" diameter of the .38 Special boolit it seems that the difference is less than .030" or .015" reduction in chamber wall thickness at the thinnest part. That could be too much in a six round cylinder with the cylinder stop notch directly over the chamber but mebbe not with a five shot cylinder.

    Have fun and stay safe. I think I would be happier with a .41 revolver with the correct bore diameter than one of the originals.
    41 Colt was originally loaded with a heeled boolit, just like the .22. The outside of the boolit was the same diameter as the outside of the case which was the diameter of the groove. The .386 diameter boolit was a soft, hollow base boolit designed to bump up in the larger barrel. I don't consider that a good idea either and shoot mine with a heeled boolit as originally designed.
    Wayne the Shrink

    There is no 'right' that requires me to work for you or you to work for me!

  7. #27
    Boolit Bub
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    Aug 2017
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    I have been wanting an Official Police/Army Special in 41 Colt for a long time. They are like looking for unicorn poop. The idea of trying to get accuracy with a .386 diameter bullet in a .401 barrel does not bold well. I have given this some thought and come up with the following:
    1-Rechamber the cylinder by running in a 10mm Mag dealer to the same depth as the 41 Colt case.
    2-Take 41 Special/41 Mag brass, run it through a 40 S&W/10mm die and trim to 41 Colt length.
    The result will be a case .008 larger that would hold any 40 caliber bullet without the need of a hollow base or a heel.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check