.45acp Mags for SWC

[35remington]

I would be greatly surprised if any reasonably set up or factory 1911 of any sort really needed to be “throated” or “polished.” Pretty much all come that way as purchased now and need nothing in that regard. Misapplied “polishing” has caused more problems than it has cured most likely.

If you don’t understand how the gun works, think twice about polishing anything.

GI magazines will, in fact, run with a wider variety of ammo types than ball, to include rounded ogive hollowpoints and HG 68 clones. They will not run with short OAL button nosed target semi wadcutter.

A rule for getting along with a 1911 is do not feed it whatever you can dream up, feed it what it feeds well. In short, this is a longer overall length round with a rounded ogive and a rounded meplat edge if it has one.

JMB knew what straight lip magazines were. In designing a magazine for the 1911, he bypassed a straight lip design for a tapered lip design.

With apologies for my thumbs in the photo, here is a photo of what a tapered lip design does that a straight lip design does not....e.g., provides a less angled approach to the chamber, and a smoother and potentially more reliable feeding path for most 1911’s. The photo shows a round in a tapered lip magazine rises as it goes forward while a straight lip design does not.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=...AAAAAdAAAAABAD

Scroll down until you can see the picture with my thumb in it midway through the thread.

[35remington]

The photo was one I took illustrating the point, and occurred shortly after m1911.org participants made a large enough group buy of hybrid lipped and GI magazines to prompt Checkmate to start making them as a regular item again.

Having them back on the market again when the only type available previously were designs of the type JMB specifically avoided was and is an event of major significance for the 1911 user. Far too many are unaware of their existence or reason for being. It is now wonderful to have this choice available.

I’d tell you how much I paid per magazine but you’d be tempted to call that robbery. Ah, the cost benefits of ordering in many thousand number lots......

Subsequent to that time Checkmate cleaned up the weld seams with a handsome brushed back and, if you order via phone call and ask for the “extra power springs” you can get them for about 2.50 or so extra without having to pay 8 bucks apiece for aftermarket Wolff equivalent. At least last time I ordered anyway.

[35remington]

And......the flat follower with a dimple also has a specific redundant reliability feature inherent to its design. The follower is flat with a bump on it for a reason.

[Boogieman]

Get a long nose 200gr. SWC ,H&G #68 style loaded to 1.240 -1.260 OAL. That bullet was made for the 1911. It feeds 100%out of every mag I've tried it in. My mold is a Lee nontumble lub SWC. It's my every day S.D. load

[45DUDE]

The H&G style 68 flat base or the Lyman 460 with a good midrange load is very hard to beat. A good gun will do 1 1/2'' on the bench with 10 shots and open sights. I have had to swap a few mags but the new Kimber mags will feed 185-swc to 245 wc in my 45's. My favorite is the 195 H&G short nose flat base but most 1911"s wont feed correctly.

[Bigslug]

A few years ago I went off on a tangent in which I played around with finding the best system to feed Keith's .45 Auto Rim revolver bullet - the 452423 - out of a 1911. It's a blunt, chunky, 75% meplat, root-beer barrel of a bullet intended for short range, blunt-force trauma. I like to say that Elmer must have been more cross with the world than usual when he designed that one. At any rate, it was NOT designed with a diagonal trip up a feed ramp in mind.

What I found on testing it through unaltered GI and various other 1911 platforms, was that the noses of the bullets that were fed from tapered-lip, GI pattern magazines took less damage travelling up the ramp and into the chamber than those that fed from the more straight lip styles.

The reason for this seems to be that the GI mags are more in step with Mauser's controlled feed magazine system. They allow the nose of the round to pivot upward gradually as the back of the round is still held by the mag. The straight lip mags pretty much lock the round into one line until they reach that point of sudden release. Ball rounds generally don't care; SWC's like the HG68 or hollowpoints that are profiled to make the gun THINK it's shooting ball rounds may not care; the 452423 was an exercise in extremes that told me a lot about how a 1911 runs - and it got me thinking that JMB had the mags right to begin with.

[cp1969]

I've shot buckets of 45acp's with 185 and 200 grain bullets with mixed no name mags without notice out of at least half a dozen different 1911's. I didn't know you need special mags for wadcutters....

I didn't either. All of the lead bullets I've put through the two stock Colts I've had (one 70 series and one 80 series) were with the two factory Colt magazines that came with them and a handful of gun show cheapies, pettigree unknown. No modifications to guns or magazines.

Bullets were all cast semi wadcutters, either bought from vendors or cast by me, including the Lyman 195 grain semiwadcutter, which is virtually a wadcutter with a tiny raised portion in the center.

I was expecting problems but never had any.

[9mmskng]

the classic 200gr SWC feeds best from a ***tuned*** 1911

Wilson Combat and CMC mags work well

overall length is a bit critical

once dialed in, they run like a top, shoot accurately and cut nice holes in targets

Not true at all! I ONLY load 200gr SWC cast bullets, from various bullet mfgs, and shoot them through ALL my Factory 1911's, with NO feed issues at all, 100% reliability in not only my guns, but friends' production guns as well. I've used Wilson & Chips over the years, but phasing out the Wilson's, as I prefer metal follower. Both mfg mags work 100% feed wise.

[mvintx]

I am reading through this topic with interest as I'm having feed issues with my Gold Cup and the SAECO H&G 68 clone. I'm using Brownell's 8-round magazines and the second, third and sometimes fourth round in the magazine nosedives and jams into the outside lip of the chamber just above the feed ramp. Remaining rounds feed without issue. The Brownell's followers do not have the little bump on top. Compared to photos of other magazines, they appear to be of the hybrid design. COAL is 1.250". Looks like I need to get some other mags.[IMG][/IMG][IMG][/IMG]

[Burnt Fingers]

Just get a Lee Carbide Factory Crimp die. I've heard they solve every problem.

Now being serious, have you tried any other SWC boolits?

I've got a SA TRP that will chokes on H&G 68 boolits, yeah I have an actual H&G mold. But if fed the RCBS 201KT it runs like grass through a goose. I've tested at least a dozen different mags in the TRP, they all give the same feeding problem.

I have a SWC seating plug for my Dillon dies that index on the shoulder of the boolit. I always have the same amount of shoulder above the case mouth using this plug.

The slightly longer nose of the RCBS 201KT makes a difference.

[Jtarm]

I run the M&P version in a Springfield Defender.

Ed Brown or factory magazines, they feed fine.

[mvintx]

Just get a Lee Carbide Factory Crimp die. I've heard they solve every problem.

Now being serious, have you tried any other SWC boolits?

I've got a SA TRP that will chokes on H&G 68 boolits, yeah I have an actual H&G mold. But if fed the RCBS 201KT it runs like grass through a goose. I've tested at least a dozen different mags in the TRP, they all give the same feeding problem.

I have a SWC seating plug for my Dillon dies that index on the shoulder of the boolit. I always have the same amount of shoulder above the case mouth using this plug.

The slightly longer nose of the RCBS 201KT makes a difference.

ya know, I first read your post and thought "what the heck does a LEE FCD do that any other taper crimp die doesn't"? Then I saw it was said tongue in cheek.

No, I have not tried any other boolits and I've got that same seating plug in my Dillon dies. When I first got the mold I wondered if the sharp corner where the meplat meets the sides would be problematic. I'm hoping a different magazine solves the issue. If not then I may be in the market for a different mold. I've shot this pistol only just a bit - 60 rounds total so far and only with the Brownell's magazines. I have one factory mag that has the little dimple on the follower and if that works, then I'm OK. If I still have problems, I think I'll try a Checkmate or Wilson magazine. I gotta admit, that SAECO boolit is an accurate little sucker. None of my other pistols come close to this kind of accuracy. [IMG][/IMG]

[metricmonkeywrench]

Seeing this post pop up reminded me that I should provide a current status. I finally put the SWC load across the Chrono. End result the 200g SWC Lyman over 4.5g of BE was only netting me 836fps and a crummy group.

In conferring with my more experienced reloading mentor the load seems to be on the ragged edge of reliably functioning in my gun with the light bullet and likely need to bump up the powder charge to the 5g zone. I can also possibly increase the OAL a bit, I will load some test batches of both to see what happens

The 225g RN load I put together runs like factory and is more accurate than me.

Still working with the same 3 original mags, but I have the bucket ready for the inevitable collection of magazines

@10 yards SWC on the Right Rn on the left

[mvintx]

Your 836 fps pretty danged close to what I'm getting (839 fps) with my 4.4 grains BE.

[45workhorse]

I run 8 and 10 round Wilson magazines in a Colt. It will feed an empty case. Good practice drill for failure to fire drill, and seeing if somebody is anticipating the recoil!
Just my two cents worth! YMMV

[roverboy]

I know this is a old thread but, I just saw this. My 1911 will feed 230 gr. FMJ and 230 gr. HP like a greased pig but, absolutely hates 200 gr. SWC. I've got 2 factory 8 rd. and a Promag I've not tried yet.

[Papercidal]

I prefer checkmate mags with the colt hybrid feedlips but the only magazines I’ve had that Don’t feed reliably are wilsons

[1hole]

My 1911-A1 was said to have been assembled late at night in VietNam some 40+ years ago with hand selected parts in a military armory. It's all military so it's not pretty but it handles and shoots like a custom handgun; it came to me with three common G.I. magazines. That thing gobbles up whatever I feed it, round nose or SWC. (I love that ugly old Parkerized thing and cast SWCs.) And I did put Pachmyer's rubber wrap-around grips and an extended slide release on it.

Novac sights would be great too, but for the way I use it it's fine as is. It's a very accurate handgun but, after all, autoloading handguns are just close range combat weapons! Better sights for "long range" (50+ yards) shooting would be nice but wasted on any rugged defensive handgun, IMHO.

In good light, even at 100 yards, the original sights and my 200 gr. SWC handloads are plenty good enough to give a stationary goblin's exposed head much trouble. Even if he lived, the facial scarring would look terrible!

[wv109323]

There is a lot more to a reliable feeding 1911 than magazine lip configuration. The height the magazine is held by the magazine release, where the bullet hits the feed ramp, the strength of the magazine spring, the recoil spring and mainspring weight(the distance the slide recoils), brass dragging on sharp magazine lips, the height and relationship of barrel on the frame deck COAL, and finally the extractor tension. This is not a complete list at all.
The reason most have a bucket of magazines is there is a pistol problem. One of the least expensive and highest quality magazines is a Metalform. On the other hand I have a Colt magazine from the 1940-1950's that has feed probably 100k rounds that I still rely on.

[Rich/WIS]

Out of curiosity tried my load of Lee 68 clone in five GI mags that the CMP was selling several years ago. These were new mags and still stiff and scratchy with the parked finish. All fed fine in my SA Range Officer, although this was limited to five in each mag. Mags that have seen a bit of use and have smoothed the park will likely feed reliably. Key is to shoot enough through the mags to be sure there are no issues.