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Thread: Savage Impulse straight pull

  1. #21
    Boolit Grand Master


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    Quote Originally Posted by richhodg66 View Post
    How can anybody hate bolt actions? Hands down the easiest type to get good performance out of simple and strong, concentric and accurate..

    If it weren't for the en bloc clips and split receiver bridge, those Hungarian M95s could be the basis for a great sporter.
    It is fairly easy when lever actions, pump actions, gas semi-auto's, even break action single shots seem more pleasant to shoot for me. I've also never owned a bolt action I 100% trusted, and that includes my Savage 110L, which you had to operate just so, or it would not eject right. The shotguns were the worst. Bolt actions are a dirt cheap way to mate a magazine to a barrel. Nothing more, nothing less. There is nothing elegant about them.

    I've owned bolt actions rifles, pistols, and shotguns. Didn't like a single one of them. I don't know what else to say. I don't know what people see in them other than they are commonly built for the super-accurate competitions. When a break action TC Encore that is way more user friendly can shoot MOA or better easy, I don't see any need for a bolt action for my own purposes.
    Last edited by megasupermagnum; 01-12-2021 at 12:43 AM.

  2. #22
    Boolit Grand Master

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    Didn't colt or one maker make a turn bolt where the lugs retracted into the body with straight receiver (no cut outs for the lugs)? I did look at the assembly drawing on svavges site. couldnt tell if the were actual balls or radius end pins that locked on to the cam to raise and lower. Im thinking when the bolt handle rotates back it turns a sleeve the pulls the pins down and the sleeve on one end or the other provides initial extraction for the case.

    I can see this being a very strong square and smooth action.

  3. #23
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    I say let the rifle speak for itself!

    If it’s good that will be borne out. If not, that will become evident as well.

    Three44s
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    “There is more to this than dumping lead in a hole.”

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by GARD72977 View Post
    Savage will screw this up
    How so?

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by swheeler View Post
    Rich I think you got the M95 mixed with something else, but it does use an enbloc clip.
    You're right, they don't have the split receiver like other Mannlichers, not sure what I was thinking.

  6. #26
    Boolit Grand Master FergusonTO35's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ironbrew View Post
    One thing I did not see in any of the videos (yeah, I went down the rabbit hole) was if you could cycle the bolt without breaking cheek weld.

    Somebody mentioned auto closing bolts on a bolt action rifle. Never heard of that. Does it really get you any faster? I know I've watched the (Norwegian?) mad minute, and I figure in the 40's, on target, in one minute with 8 mag changes (5 round mags)... That's impressive.
    Ruger made some Mini-14's for the UK that did not have a gas system, so effectively a straight pull bolt action with spring driven reloading.
    Currently casting and loading: .32 Auto, .380 Auto, .38 Special, 9X19, .357 Magnum, .257 Roberts, 6.5 Creedmoor, .30 WCF, .308 WCF, .45-70.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by country gent View Post
    Didn't colt or one maker make a turn bolt where the lugs retracted into the body with straight receiver (no cut outs for the lugs)? I did look at the assembly drawing on svavges site. couldnt tell if the were actual balls or radius end pins that locked on to the cam to raise and lower. Im thinking when the bolt handle rotates back it turns a sleeve the pulls the pins down and the sleeve on one end or the other provides initial extraction for the case.

    I can see this being a very strong square and smooth action.
    Colt Sauer made by Sauer & Sohn in Germany, rear locking lug design. Three bolt lugs were flush with the bolt body until the bolt handle was lowered. In essence it was a cylinder in a sleeve until the bolt was lowered. Smoothest action I ever owned, had them in 25-06 and 375 H&H.
    "Always do sober what you said you'd do drunk. That will teach you to keep your mouth shut." - Ernest Hemingway

  8. #28
    Boolit Master Jack Stanley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by richhodg66 View Post
    How so?
    Rich I can't speak for anyone else but the problem I've had with Savage is the plastic stock . Wood stock have been fine , not many other problems with their stuff .

    Jack
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  9. #29
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    I watched the video and it was impressive. However, I not crazy about more moving parts with probably high tolerances. If the rifle wasn’t perfectly maintained, what would happen if those bearings started to stick?

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle R. View Post
    Physics will not be cheated - you don't get something for nothing. The reduced total movement of the bolt handle when compared to traditional bolt actions means reduced movement put into operating the action. That reduced movement is likely to require increased force to complete the functions performed by working the action. I expect the compromises required by that design include reduced primary extraction and reduced camming power for chambering dirty, malformed or corroded ammo. Whether or not those are serious issues for a sporting rifle is for the buyer to decide.

    Yes - a 760 Remington is a straight pull bolt action too - operated by the forend instead of a rear handle. And yes, a 760 does have reduced camming power and reliability compared to a 700. For myself, the choice would be about accuracy and reliability. The 1/4 second saved by a straight pull over a conventional bolt action would not be much of a factor.

    Uncle R.
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  11. #31
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    Most biathlon rifles are straight pull. They are fast and accurate.
    [The Montana Gianni] Front sight and squeeze

  12. #32
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    This Action's Mechinism has been around for along time and was never very popular. The reason why is that if the heat treating of the action body isn't as hard as the steel balls repeated firing will "Peen" the seating area thus loosening it and increasing Headspace.

    Where I first saw this mechinism was in Yamaha 80 and Hodaka 90/100/125 Transmissions back in the 60's. The Input shaft of the trans had 4 or 5 gears on it which were solid. The Driven Output shaft was hollow and had holes in it for each of the gears which had the balls captured between the shaft and a spring that held all the balls in the shaft. Each gear had the mating groves for the balls and when the balls were pushed out by the shifter shaft it locked the gear to the shaft and power would flow thru that gear. The rest of the time all other gears on the Output Shaft just rotated freely around the output shaft . Only one gear could be driven at a time.

    This was called a "Constant Mesh Transmission," Because all the gears were in mesh all the time.

    the Hodaka trans was lightyears better than the Yamaha 80 just because to the heat treating of the shaft and gears. Also we designed it as opposed to the Japanese who were still coming up the technology ladder to catch us.

    Randy
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  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by W.R.Buchanan View Post
    This Action's Mechinism has been around for along time and was never very popular. The reason why is that if the heat treating of the action body isn't as hard as the steel balls repeated firing will "Peen" the seating area thus loosening it and increasing Headspace.

    Where I first saw this mechinism was in Yamaha 80 and Hodaka 90/100/125 Transmissions back in the 60's. The Input shaft of the trans had 4 or 5 gears on it which were solid. The Driven Output shaft was hollow and had holes in it for each of the gears which had the balls captured between the shaft and a spring that held all the balls in the shaft. Each gear had the mating groves for the balls and when the balls were pushed out by the shifter shaft it locked the gear to the shaft and power would flow thru that gear. The rest of the time all other gears on the Output Shaft just rotated freely around the output shaft . Only one gear could be driven at a time.

    This was called a "Constant Mesh Transmission," Because all the gears were in mesh all the time.

    the Hodaka trans was lightyears better than the Yamaha 80 just because to the heat treating of the shaft and gears. Also we designed it as opposed to the Japanese who were still coming up the technology ladder to catch us.

    Randy
    I can see the peening action in a transmission that is running constantly and under relatively constant strain, Randy, - but how does that translate to a rifle action that is stressed infrequently? Used in a full auto arm I could see it as a problem, but a bolt action?
    Wayne the Shrink

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  14. #34
    Boolit Master

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    Same as peening to form a head on a rivet, many continued blows.
    Spell check doesn't work in Chrome, so if something is spelled wrong, it's just a typo that I missed.

  15. #35
    Boolit Bub
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    Quote Originally Posted by W.R.Buchanan View Post
    This Action's Mechinism has been around for along time and was never very popular. The reason why is that if the heat treating of the action body isn't as hard as the steel balls repeated firing will "Peen" the seating area thus loosening it and increasing Headspace.

    Where I first saw this mechinism was in Yamaha 80 and Hodaka 90/100/125 Transmissions back in the 60's. The Input shaft of the trans had 4 or 5 gears on it which were solid. The Driven Output shaft was hollow and had holes in it for each of the gears which had the balls captured between the shaft and a spring that held all the balls in the shaft. Each gear had the mating groves for the balls and when the balls were pushed out by the shifter shaft it locked the gear to the shaft and power would flow thru that gear. The rest of the time all other gears on the Output Shaft just rotated freely around the output shaft . Only one gear could be driven at a time.

    This was called a "Constant Mesh Transmission," Because all the gears were in mesh all the time.

    the Hodaka trans was lightyears better than the Yamaha 80 just because to the heat treating of the shaft and gears. Also we designed it as opposed to the Japanese who were still coming up the technology ladder to catch us.

    Randy
    All the standard transmissions I worked with were constant mesh but normally they used a dog clutch to slide between two gears for engagement....not moving the gear itself.


    HK didn't come up with the roller locking system so its definitely not a copy of their design. I think Savage is using ball type bearings and its a different system.

    straight pulls are a niche market and whether they are any better than a turn bolt, lever, slide action or whatever has little to do with their existence. There are those who like the actions so there is a marketer who will put one on the market. In reality there are some advantages to the actions like there are with any of the others. I like the Swiss straight pulls and the Mannlichers are cool too. I'm not being shot at though so I don't really care about speed and camming action. I like them for reasons that are probably only my own. Its a neatness factor. I've got turnbolts and semi's as well. Never been a savage fan though....

    Frank

  16. #36
    Boolit Master JHeath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MT Gianni View Post
    Most biathlon rifles are straight pull. They are fast and accurate.
    Yes and they extract .22lr just great.

  17. #37
    Boolit Master JHeath's Avatar
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    MT Gianni sorry, that probably sounded snarky.

    The Lee Navy and Ross and K31 all worked and were centerfires. The Ross took some criticism, not all of it correct or fair.

    Straight-pull solves an imaginary problem that bolts are slow. Bolts can pump out rounds really fast. Match rifle shooters joked to service rifle shooters that bolts are faster than M1As because "you don't have to wait for the action to cycle."

    Somebody above commented that bolts are a dirt cheap way to mount a barrel to something and there is nothing elegant about them. That is what I told the salesman at Rigby hoping to get a better price on an engraved .416.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading

BP Bronze Point IMR Improved Military Rifle PTD Pointed
BR Bench Rest M Magnum RN Round Nose
BT Boat Tail PL Power-Lokt SP Soft Point
C Compressed Charge PR Primer SPCL Soft Point "Core-Lokt"
HP Hollow Point PSPCL Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt" C.O.L. Cartridge Overall Length
PSP Pointed Soft Point Spz Spitzer Point SBT Spitzer Boat Tail
LRN Lead Round Nose LWC Lead Wad Cutter LSWC Lead Semi Wad Cutter
GC Gas Check